• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required as is 20 years of participation in forums (not all true). There are daily reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Has civility on ASR declined recently?

Walter

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Aug 25, 2020
Messages
829
Likes
1,133
I have noticed an increase in combative and insulting posts on ASR over the last couple of months--mostly, but not always, by new members. The posters definitely have not seemed to heed the message at the top of every forum page to Come here to have fun, be ready to be teased and not take online life too seriously. For those of you that have been here longer than I have, is this normal, or is it truly getting worse? I have been a member and sometimes moderator on a lot of Internet forums on many different subjects over the last 25 years. This behavior is not at all uncommon--except here. I have seen it destroy other sites by driving off the posters that had genuine knowledge to share. One thing I really like about this site is that the members generally do a very good job of leveling their disagreements at ideas, not at people, and are usually open minded and ready to learn. Is the site's popularity starting to attract a different kind of poster, or have these types always come, flamed out, and then slunk away? Or am I just reading the site more and seeing posts I might would have missed in the past?

Note to moderators: If this is the wrong forum for this, please move it. If it is unacceptable for any reason, please delete it.
 
Last edited:

JaccoW

Active Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2021
Messages
238
Likes
339
Location
The Netherlands
A little bit of both I think. I am a relatively new member and while this forum prides itself on measurements and factual debate, as soon as we get into more opinion-related topics there can be some strongly held beliefs that clash. And with everyone having more times on their hands those threads show up more often.

Add to that that most people are not used to debating people with vastly differing opinions or backgrounds to them and you run into some rough edges.

I remember spending an entire day on a campsite just talking with a pair of older Texan libertarians while I am a strong proponent of social democracy bordering on extreme left-wing. We disagreed on a lot of political things but we all enjoyed the debate. We even shared our breakfast items for a luxurious meal.
 

VintageFlanker

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Sep 20, 2018
Messages
3,357
Likes
11,723
Location
Paris
I wouldn't say I have noticed any major difference in behavior in the last year.
I did not either.

Or at least: if so, it follows a pretty logical pattern. As the forum grows and is now quite famous worldwide (went up to 2.7M visits/month), you've got a bunch of new members. Most are hopefully respectful, here to share and/or learn... a few (but sadly the most visible ones) are either here for subjectivism trolling or/and show some strong Dunning Kruger symptoms.
 

thewas

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 15, 2020
Messages
4,973
Likes
11,095
More popularity attracts more strange foke. That's just the burden of success I guess. It's really not that bad from what I can see.
^^^This
I also have the same impression as the OP but have noticed this also in other forums when they get more popular, more people with lower topic knowledge, argumentative, writing and moral levels are attracted. The first is of course not a problem - all humans start at some point with zero knowledge in a topic - as long as its not combined with too high self esteem and trust in their own limited or wrong knowledge, see Dunning Kruger.
 

PierreV

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Nov 6, 2018
Messages
1,375
Likes
4,450
More popularity attracts more strange foke. That's just the burden of success I guess. It's really not that bad from what I can see.
Well, when I joined 3 years ago, after some lurking time, we also had very strange folks. They are mostly gone now, something I regret a bit. Reading nearly insane but well-argued 4 pages rants on about any issues was fascinating. It reminded me of the original Usenet. Today, we are a bit in the "AOL users invade Usenet" phase but the moderators and community are keeping things under control imho.
 

BDWoody

Chief Cat Herder
Moderator
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 9, 2019
Messages
5,808
Likes
17,413
Location
Mid-Atlantic, USA. (Maryland)
Add to that that most people are not used to debating people with vastly differing opinions or backgrounds to them and you run into some rough edges.

Or, they aren't used to debating people with actual knowledge on a subject, as opposed to information based primarily on sales propaganda.

I don't think many newcomers realize the level of expertise represented by the members of this forum, and can't handle the deep end as well as they had hoped.

It's a balancing act as moderator...and we definitely rely on the membership to keep it from getting out of hand.
 

Vini darko

Major Contributor
Joined
Jun 1, 2020
Messages
2,152
Likes
3,135
Location
Dorset England
I notice some things that have a tendancy to turn conversation sour.
The "uh huh" response , usually used when something is said that runs contry to the narrative (cables and dac sound spring to mind)
Attacking groups or individuals for having views contry to the narrative (sbaf and Steve Guttenberg spring to mind)
This third one is being unwilling to learn , test new ideas and overcome bais. The more we think we know the harder it is to break through bias ( not doing a good job of articulating this one sorry)
Special metion to qestioning amirs medthods and results in a aggressive manor , that really pokes the nest :eek:
 

sarumbear

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Aug 15, 2020
Messages
5,233
Likes
4,703
Location
Southampton, England
I have noticed an increase in combative and insulting posts on ASR over the last couple of months--mostly, but not always, by new members. The posters definitely have not seemed to heed the message at the top of every forum page to Come here to have fun, be ready to be teased and not take online life too seriously. For those of you that have been here longer than I have, is this normal, or is it truly getting worse? I have been a member and sometimes moderator on a lot of Internet forums on many different subjects over the last 25 years. This behavior is not at all uncommon--except here. I have seen it destroy other sites by driving off the posters that had genuine knowledge to share. One thing I really like about this site is that the members generally do a very good job of leveling their disagreements at ideas, not at people, and are usually open minded and ready to learn. Is the site's popularity starting to attract a different kind of poster, or have these types always come, flamed out, and then slunk away? Or am I just reading the site more and seeing posts I might would have missed in the past?

Note to moderators: If this is the wrong forum for this, please move it. If it is unacceptable for any reason, please delete it.
I am relatively new on ASR, 15 months, and to me there has not been much change. There are some people who are combative and even insulting, which is to me very rude, and rudeness while hiding behind an avatar is cowardice! However, ASR is much better than other forums -- full-stop. That is why I am only active here.

My issue with forums is the unwillingness of people to learn. As the saying goes, little information is dangerous. Many people think they know everything but otherwise all they know is at best from Wikipedia or magazine articles. As ASR is a hobby forum very few people have the basic education in an audio related engineering or science education. This lack of education makes them think their knowledge is final. Audio engineering requires a diverse amount of subjects. It is not possible for one person to know everything from speaker cones to amplifiers to heath dissipation to acoustics, but we often see the same posters vehemently arguing on all subjects. I am a well educated person with a long history in audio. However, I am still learning. I wish people will be similarly open to learning.
 

FrantzM

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Mar 12, 2016
Messages
3,462
Likes
5,662
WTF are you talking about ??!!
Here we take no Sh#%#%t!
We are fu***ing CIVIL!
You hear me ! You Audiophool!
:mad:

:p

I have been there almost from the start and IMO the tone is the same as before...
Some members post very much less and I miss them
I could be one of those who miss the levity and weirdness of people like @Thomas savage. Where are you? ..Bruv??
 

_theLaughingman

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 1, 2020
Messages
1,092
Likes
1,566
Location
Ohio
I think for most parts, ASR is pretty civil. Having @BDWoody as our chief cat herder and @AdamG247 the ban hammer helps a lot, but most of the members do a good job of engaging in meaningful conversations and being gate keepers without engaging in trolling behavior.
 

TLEDDY

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Forum Donor
Joined
Aug 4, 2019
Messages
566
Likes
731
Location
Central Florida
I don't think many newcomers realize the level of expertise represented by the members of this forum, and can't handle the deep end as well as they had hoped.
^^^This… the level of expertise here is a constant delight!! There are many times that the discussion is far above me! It is a huge learning opportunity as well as humbling.

Most heated debates hinge on “Golden Ears” opinions, rarely on measurement disagreements.
 

tomtoo

Major Contributor
Joined
Nov 20, 2019
Messages
3,126
Likes
3,804
Location
Germany
We are all humans and with that some times we get emotional. We are not computers that follow a tcp/ip protokoll. Imo ASR does well. Very well, imo.

Lets have fun, sometimes a littel verbal fight happens. Hell where are the good old cowboys? They had a fist fight, and after that they did go drink a whiskey in the saloon together. ;)
 
Top Bottom