Moondrop x Crinacle DUSK

[phoenixdogfan]

FWIW, I use a FreeDSP cable to drive my Aune AR5000 HP with an AutoEQ-based correction and I absolutely love it!

This could be another way to see the Dusk package: use Dusk, “as-is”, in analog mode, and, with the included DSP cable, see what EQ it takes for another IEM to sound identical to Dusk. Or if it can’t be EQ’d to sound like Dusk, try to identify why…

Reviewers out there are going "gaga" over the default DSP setting for these. How about an EQ which matches a pair of Truthear Crinacle Reds to that? Or 7gz Salnotes Crinacle 2's?

 

[Chromatischism]

You can do the same thing on your Android phone and USB Audio Player Pro with the added professional tools by Tone Boosters which cost around $10. Includes 10 band PEQ, balance, and Morphit which enable one IEM to emulate another (based on what's in the database).

Using peak filters, it's very hard to fix the frequency response where it gets whacky beyond 5 khz or so. And, doing it through an audio player is so limited. No EQ for my streaming account, YouTube, video player, etc. I would just put the $10 toward a Qudelix 5K and/or better IEM.

 

[MacClintock]

Using peak filters, it's very hard to fix the frequency response where it gets whacky beyond 5 khz or so. And, doing it through an audio player is so limited. No EQ for my streaming account, YouTube, video player, etc. I would just put the $10 toward a Qudelix 5K and/or better IEM.

Ah, in case you missed it, with an Android phone and USB Audio Player Pro you will have general EQ for everything. And PEQ.

 

[phoenixdogfan]

Using peak filters, it's very hard to fix the frequency response where it gets whacky beyond 5 khz or so. And, doing it through an audio player is so limited. No EQ for my streaming account, YouTube, video player, etc. I would just put the $10 toward a Qudelix 5K and/or better IEM.

USB Audio Player Pro not only has peak, it has shelf filters, and a whole host of others. It's a full featured PEQ.

 

[MayaTlab]

View attachment 362104View attachment 362105View attachment 362106
Chu 2, May, zero 2, zero Red, B2 Dusk (I hear the new Dusk but has extra depth on the main body of the shell towards the face plate)

The May and the Blessing have the obvious horn shape near the rear close to the 2 pin that works well for me even though they are very different sizes. For me the 2 Zero shapes aren't contoured enough to fit anyone well.

Edit regarding tws I have /had Samsung bud pro, Sony cf500 and some others with weirder shapes. Of the iem pictured above I'd say the May was closest in size /contour to the rounded tws style than the rest of them

Thanks a lot ! I think that I might try them and replace the cable (they'll be used with a Qudelix ideally).

 

[Jimbob54]

Thanks a lot ! I think that I might try them and replace the cable (they'll be used with a Qudelix ideally).

Oh- one legit complaint about the May package. The tips are woeful and barely fit on the nozzle (unless that was an early batch error) but Im guessing you have a stock of alternatives.

The packaged cable needs changing IMHO too- leaving aside the DSP element, there is no chin woggle and you cant fashion one from velcro etc as there isnt enough room between the inline mic blob and the ear which means its likely to flap around unless you are stationary.

 

[MayaTlab]

Thanks.

As a sidenote, since we're talking about ergonomics, I'm wondering how many IEM or headphone manufacturers are doing research in that area, or use anatomical databases to design their headphones. My gut feeling is that quite a few of them don't care quite as much as they should.

For example, this is quite an interesting project using rather large samples :

https://humanshape.org/index.html#models

I guess that it's expensive to do such research, so publicly available, "ready-made" databases could help.

 

[IAtaman]

Oh- one legit complaint about the May package. The tips are woeful and barely fit on the nozzle (unless that was an early batch error) but Im guessing you have a stock of alternatives.

Nope, not an early batch error. Got mine a few weeks ago, same problem. I was this close to throwing them out of the window

 

[USER]

Reviewers out there are going "gaga" over the default DSP setting for these. How about an EQ which matches a pair of Truthear Crinacle Reds to that? Or 7gz Salnotes Crinacle 2's?

Uuhhh, nothing if one's hearing isn't excellent above 13kHz and if they aren't sure that the peaking is actually a good thing as it may not follow Harman?

The Reds and Zero 2s were actually tuned to the desired response properly as they use higher quality drivers that can get the results with virtually no distortion. (Like with DACs, it looks like we are done here with the tech and I think this is a much more interesting topic.) The Dusks are a mishmash of audiophile drivers that they couldn't get working together as they wanted because the only recourse they had to differentiate their product was to cater to audiophile nonsense that wants some planar drivers thrown in there for absolutely no reason. This of course also makes the IEM body wider and bigger, which is something that has never meant more comfortable or better looking to me personally.

 

[MacClintock]

View attachment 362277

Uuhhh, nothing if one's hearing isn't excellent above 13kHz and if they aren't sure that the peaking is actually a good thing as it may not follow Harman?

The Reds and Zero 2s were actually tuned to the desired response properly as they use higher quality drivers that can get the results with virtually no distortion. (Like with DACs, it looks like we are done here with the tech and I think this is a much more interesting topic.) The Dusks are a mishmash of audiophile drivers that they couldn't get working together as they wanted because the only recourse they had to differentiate their product was to cater to audiophile nonsense that wants some planar drivers thrown in there for absolutely no reason. This of course also makes the IEM body wider and bigger, which is something that has never meant more comfortable or better looking to me personally.

Yes, the graph were already shown in posts #31 and #59. The most embarrassing thing is that if everybody considers the DSP default tuning so amazingly good, why didn´t they manage to produce it, using all the fancy tri-brid driver technology, with the standard cable as the non-DSP default?

 

[Chromatischism]

Yes, the graph were already shown in posts #31 and #59. The most embarrassing thing is that if everybody considers the DSP default tuning so amazingly good, why didn´t they manage to produce it, using all the fancy tri-brid driver technology, with the standard cable as the non-DSP default?

This is kind of a non-sequitur. The analog response is very good, but the DSP cable does the final 5% of tweaking. No different than loudspeakers, really.

 

[CedarX]

The Reds and Zero 2s were actually tuned to the desired response properly as they use higher quality drivers that can get the results with virtually no distortion. (Like with DACs, it looks like we are done here with the tech and I think this is a much more interesting topic.) The Dusks are a mishmash of audiophile drivers that they couldn't get working together as they wanted because the only recourse they had to differentiate their product was to cater to audiophile nonsense that wants some planar drivers thrown in there for absolutely no reason. This of course also makes the IEM body wider and bigger, which is something that has never meant more comfortable or better looking to me personally.

We may be "done with the tech." as it relates to achieving a given FR target, but I think there is still a debate about the correct / best target for IEMs: Harman IE 2019 is backed by data/study, but several argue that it is not the best target... Similarly, a lot of the measurements are done on 711-type couplers, which are also being questioned. So, there is still more work needed.

Besides FR & distortion, there may be other things to look at that are not being measured today. For example, Qudelix has claimed that their (discontinued) QX-over IEM design (2-drivers with active crossover) benefited IMD and phase distortion. It may be marketing BS... but this could also be an area to explore, differentiating these multi-drivers from the single ones...

Oh, and as far as the "planar" drivers used on Dusk: they are of the "micro-planar" type, looking like a BA driver. They are not really making the IEM body bigger, that has more to do with the 2x opposed DD arrangement I think.

 

[MacClintock]

This is kind of a non-sequitur. The analog response is very good, but the DSP cable does the final 5% of tweaking. No different than loudspeakers, really.

Again, the 7Hz Zero 2 delivers this without tweaking and DSP, straight out of the box.

 

[USER]

This is kind of a non-sequitur. The analog response is very good, but the DSP cable does the final 5% of tweaking. No different than loudspeakers, really.

The difference here is in this analogy, $50 mass market "speakers" are doing the same thing these expensive "Genelec" "speakers" are doing.

I have nothing against DSP cables and welcome them wholeheartedly. I EQ. I believe you have to to reach any target. I have yet to see a great example of Harman that doesn't tip a little too much toward treble. This is nothing new as there are many DSP programs and USB cables for smartphones. It's just that this is a terribly poor example of how to approach it because the FR has been reached with $20, the IEM is bulky, and the program sucks. This is taking things backwards in every possible way and the IEM community at large is so far up its own butt that they can't understand what's in front of it.

 

[Chromatischism]

Again, the 7Hz Zero 2 delivers this without tweaking and DSP, straight out of the box.

Not trying to just defend the Dusk here, but objectively, it's close, but not the same.

Many things in life have diminishing returns beyond a certain level. We're seeing that here.

 

[USER]

Many things in life have diminishing returns beyond a certain level. We're seeing that here.

At the same time, spend $5-10 on a nice fancy body for the red or zero 2 and charge me $120 more for it. I'd happily pay that for a premium, better fitting version. It's not just about diminishing returns regarding the actual technology. Most of us on these threads complaining still happily spend money. I just don't want something people will laugh at in 2 years. There is very good space in the market for a Zero 2 Deluxe with a nice warranty. It's so easily justifiable. Throw in a USB cable. They'd make a killing.

 

[Chromatischism]

At the same time, spend $5-10 on a nice fancy body for the red or zero 2 and charge me $120 more for it. I'd happily pay that for a premium, better fitting version. It's not just about diminishing returns regarding the actual technology. Most of us on these threads complaining still happily spend money. I just don't want something people will laugh at in 2 years. There is very good space in the market for a Zero 2 Deluxe with a nice warranty. It's so easily justifiable. Throw in a USB cable. They'd make a killing.

They call them the AFUL Performer 5 and Kiwi Ears Quintet

 

[digitalfrost]

Kiwi Ears Quintet

I was inspired by the new Dusk with DSP and made an EQ to get the Quintets close to this. This is the best they ever sounded IMHO. If anyone wants to try I will attach the file.

 

[USER]

I was inspired by the new Dusk with DSP and made an EQ to get the Quintets close to this. This is the best they ever sounded IMHO. If anyone wants to try I will attach the file.

My Peace GUI has a bunch of options like this. If you find a measurer you trust you can have most every IEM! The fact that these are based on differences on the same measurement rig make them more dependable. Obviously not perfect, and it doesn't account for things like fit and distortion, but it can give you a good idea if you are going to like something or not as you can switch back and forth quickly, and is a good justification for actually trying it out if you do. In this example I knew the 7Hz Sonus was not for me. I recently read a comment on this site that identified the exact issue I had with it. To a tee!

 

[Matias]

I wonder if 2 way, 3 way and N way IEMs would have lower multitone distortion than a single driver would? No one seems to measure this AFAIK.