Yamaha R-S202 Receiver Review

[Ajax]

Everywhere is cheaper than Belgium. Trust me, I live there The situation has improved vastly in recent years, but if you're somehow desperate to pay a premium for hifi or electronics, buying it in Belgium is still your best bet in the whole wide region.
We somehow, completely unexpectedly, have gotten cheaper than Britain, though...

Hi Bob,

..... I hear you but if you really want to buy expensive under performing Hi Fi there is no better place to bend over than Aus.

 

[Haskil]

france like to fuck customer , i make 50 km to buy my sony tv year ago : french price 2000 luxembourg sony official 1500 e , warranty 5 year 300 e france by shop , 100 e lux by sony europe .,

We are not going to throw our flags in each other's faces, because as Stephan Zweig said of nationalism: "when the flags are out, intelligence is at the trumpet", but Luxembourg is a small, very rich country which does not is not very careful about the money that passes through its banks...

In France, we pay taxes, a high VAT, but the citizen finds them at one time or another. We saw it during Covid...

The prices of hi-fi in French stores are very often held by distributors illegally, of course, but still held for certain brands today.

Sony was one of those for a long time and everyone laughed in Paris to see a very small store constantly selling televisions in front of the largest Sony distributor in Paris at that time in the 1980s-1990s (Fnac) and the same Place de la Madeleine... Sony had tried to ban these two stores, but the law was on their side... they sourced their supplies from foreign wholesalers... in countries where the same Sony allowed this... And pretty farce: Sony in France was forced to provide after-sales service and warranty...

In France, as throughout Europe, the warranty is two years. The warranty extensions sold in stores during the purchase are ruinous and in the case of a television rather useless because very often the manufacturer refuses the warranty by finding one way or another... Sony like Samsung are masters in this art... And a consumer magazine as powerful as "Que Choisir" has often highlighted their attitude which consists of blaming the customer in the case of dead pixels, power supplies whose capacitors swell (I have repaired several from Samsung for friends and for a few euros), processors that burn out (my case on a Sony: funny the new card is identical to the old one which I demanded returned to me, except that there is now a cooling radiator on the processor and updates are blocked...). For the Sony warranty extension: I think you just need to register your device on their site... more and more manufacturers are doing this... and from two years, we often go to 3 or 5...

In the case of Yamaha: I bought five devices, the oldest of which I think was in 1993 (AX 590), the most recent an Aventage 3020 must be a good 10 years old and only one breakdown: a small ceramic capacitor which prevents switching on. voltage... changed in a few dozen minutes by my brother with whom this RX 2600 had landed... They all have happy days with penniless friends and in my family... Oh yes: a crazy remote control which drained its batteries in one day with the Aventage 3020: changed immediately by the store without questions.

The French price of the Yamaha is the official price... when you look you often manage to find cheaper by calling...

 

[popej]

•Treble response is not symmetrical

Really? Looks symmetrical up to frequency limit about 50kHz. Electronic circuit is symmetrical.

Or you can say, that bass control at 10Hz is not symmetrical too

 

[Tovarich007]

Excited to see an affordable
Yamaha class AB stereo amp in Amir Sir's recommended list :
•Extended frequency response
•No load dependency
•Solid build
•Treble response is not symmetrical
•Audible noise and distortion
In the graph showing power supply noise,
SMSL A300 & Fosi Audio ZA3 are rated much higher in the 'green zone', while Yamaha is on the borderline.

Is Yamaha RS-202 an overall better option than a SMSL A300 or Fosi Audio ZA3 ?

They are quite different devices, for functionnalities and technical design as well.
I summarize what are in my opinion their respective PROS ans CONS, but it's hard to compare them and make a firm statement on which one is the best buy. It all depnds on your needs and risks taking by buying SMSL (or Fosi) on line or not.

So :
YAMAHA RS202
Pros :
Class AB, no load dependecy, very large FR in the treble (possible better treble range, but is it always audible ?)
More powerful (not so important, about only 1 or 1.5 dB more in real use)
AM/FM radio
Bluetooth (and DB+ for model D, in Europe only it seems)
Bass/treble controls
Well long time respected and distributed brand, service easier, possibilities to buy and repair are easier
Cons :
No EQ,
No phono input (more sophisticated Yam receivers have one)
Less good headphone output (but depends on phones and SPL level you need -be careful for your ears)
Distorsion in bass and average SNR (probably not a major concern in real use with budget speakers, I guess nobody will use these 2 amps with large top range speakers)

SMSL A300
Pros :
Much smaller and lighter, neat modern design
Class D : draw less power
Less distorsion, very clean performance
EQ
Bluetooth
Better headphone output (but depends on phones and SPL level you need -be careful for your ears)
Subwoofer output
Cons :
No AM/FM nor DAB+
No phono input
Less power (not so important in real use- only 1dB less about)
Slightly load dependent (maybe less "natural" in treble depending on speakers)
Newer brand (with a growing good reputation) but buy on line only, less easy for service and repair

As for the FOSI, it's a good minimalistic little amp, but it lacks functionnalities, so I don't take it into account for a fair comparison.
The choice is yours, as always.

 

[Dinesh Menon]

Really? Looks symmetrical up to frequency limit about 50kHz. Electronic circuit is symmetrical.

Or you can say, that bass control at 10Hz is not symmetrical too

I READ AMIR SIR'S REVIEW AND JUST PINPOINTED WHAT'S ALREADY MENTIONED THERE.
I requested for the expert opinion of our FMs on my query; As I'm not adept at audio systems. I'm happy to learn so much about the same from this forum.
So you are not questioning my opinion but doubting Amir Sir's review or you said it in a lighter vein !!

 

[Dinesh Menon]

They are quite different devices, for functionnalities and technical design as well.
I summarize what are in my opinion their respective PROS ans CONS, but it's hard to compare them and make a firm statement on which one is the best buy. It all depnds on your needs and risks taking by buying SMSL (or Fosi) on line or not.

So :
YAMAHA RS202
Pros :
Class AB, no load dependecy, very large FR in the treble (possible better treble range, but is it always audible ?)
More powerful (not so important, about only 1 or 1.5 dB more in real use)
AM/FM radio
Bluetooth and DB+ (for model D, in Europe only it seems)
Bass/treble controls
Well long time respected and distributed brand, service easier, possibilities to buy and repair are easier
Cons :
No bluetooth (US/North America)
No EQ,
No phono input (more sophisticated Yam receivers have one)
Less good headphone output (but depends on phones and SPL level you need -be careful for your ears)
Distorsion in bass and average SNR (probably not a major concern in real use with budget speakers, I guess nobody will use these 2 amps with large top range speakers)

SMSL A300
Pros :
Much smaller and lighter, neat modern design
Class D : draw less power
Less distorsion, very clean performance
EQ
Bluetooth
Better headphone output (but depends on phones and SPL level you need -be careful for your ears)
Subwoofer output
Cons :
No AM/FM nor DAB+
Less power (not so important in real use- only 1dB less about)
Slightly load dependent (maybe less "natural" in treble depending on speakers)
Newer brand (with a growing good reputation) but buy on line only, less easy for service and repair

As for the FOSI, it's a good minimalistic little amp, but it lacks functionnalities, so I don't take it into account for a fair comparison.
The choice is yours, as always.

Thanks Sir.You've given an in depth answer to my query. I understood your preference.
I've read that audiophiles prefer class AB.

It's fine for me if there's no Radio, Bluetooth/WiFi Streamer, Phono input, Headphone output.
Just clear audio to enjoy the music.

Yamaha is a legendary brand.
There's SMSL AO300 & A300.
I will study about their amplifier circuits,
and then comeback for clarification.
Happy weekend.

 

[Tovarich007]

If you don't need many features and connectivity, maybe the best for you could be the little Fosi. Simple devices are generally the most transparent (all things being equal) and simple things are often more reliable too.

Just a few things : i don't consider myself as an audiophile, but as a music lover who is also fan of audio technique, which is quite different.

And no, I don't prefer class AB over class D, you misunderstood what was my analysis of these two amps.
Frankly, if I had the money, I would go for a Ncore, Purifi or even Icepower or 3E Audio based amps, because class D well done has many advantages (less power hungry and heat, more light and compact, and rock solid performance in terms of distorsion and SNR, with a very solid and tight bass range and great overall clarity and neutrality).

But all class D amps are not load independent, which could be a (rather slight) problem in treble with some speakers.

In this particular case, this budget Yamaha receiver has some little advantages, the more important being IMHO the brand reputation of reliability and availability.
But the Loxjie A40, based on the same platform and the same chips as the SMLS A 300 is worth attention. it has some more features than the SMLS, in particular a phono preamp, but you don't need this, so...

 

[popej]

So you are not questioning my opinion but doubting Amir Sir's review

At that particular conclusion - yes.

Here part of datasheet of chip used for tone control:

 

[dr0ss]

We bought an R-S201 (same receiver without bluetooth) in 2016 for around $130 to replace a dead 1980s 30wpc Technics in a vacation house. We hated it from day one. I can't give the main reasons why without using audiophile terms, suffice it to say to my ears the sound was...less? There has been some discussion of the tuner; our house is rather isolated and the Yamaha has trouble getting some stations we like. We now have a vintage B&O system there as well and the tuner gets every station we like effortlessly. On the plus side the R-S201 is simple, rugged (standing up over the years to rambunctious kids, and visiting in-laws who like to pile things on top of it), and has plenty of power to handle two sets of speakers at once (though not any better than the Technics it replaced).

My son recently bought an AS501 and was reluctant to tell me because he knew how strongly I felt about this receiver.

 

[Dinesh Menon]

At that particular conclusion - yes.

Here part of datasheet of chip used for tone control:

View attachment 353777

I got your point. It has an impressive, time-tested internal circuit:

Yamaha R-S202 Receiver Review

Have a look at their forum or this thread which resulted in a partial fix: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/dsp-measurements-and-rising-noise-floor.42383/ Summary?

audiosciencereview.com

 

[Dinesh Menon]

If you don't need many features and connectivity, maybe the best for you could be the little Fosi. Simple devices are generally the most transparent (all things being equal) and simple things are often more reliable too.

Just a few things : i don't consider myself as an audiophile, but as a music lover who is also fan of audio technique, which is quite different.

And no, I don't prefer class AB over class D, you misunderstood what was my analysis of these two amps.
Frankly, if I had the money, I would go for a Ncore, Purifi or even Icepower or 3E Audio based amps, because class D well done has many advantages (less power hungry and heat, more light and compact, and rock solid performance in terms of distorsion and SNR, with a very solid and tight bass range and great overall clarity and neutrality).

But all class D amps are not load independent, which could be a (rather slight) problem in treble with some speakers.

In this particular case, this budget Yamaha receiver has some little advantages, the more important being IMHO the brand reputation of reliability and availability.
But the Loxjie A40, based on the same platform and the same chips as the SMLS A 300 is worth attention. it has some more features than the SMLS, in particular a phono preamp, but you don't need this, so...

It was my general assumption.
Class AB is said to give the optimum
in terms of output power, power consumption and sound quality.

Class D amps are more efficient and getting better. Class AB is stuck in the past or evolving ?
Which one is that little Fosi ?
I will now study Loxjie A40
and get back to you.
Yes I am also not into the premium segment. Just something simple and affordable, for ears and years.
Happy Sunday.

As for R-S202 Amir Sir said it all:

Yamaha R-S202 Receiver Review

As an old school analog guy, I appreciate the bass control centered on 50 hz which gives an extended bass for most bookshelf speakers rather than the more common 100 hz which simply makes them more boomy. Also the bass and treble controls are on the front, what no menus to navigate through! I'd...

audiosciencereview.com

 

[Guerilla]

Dinesh Class D is today as good as the best Class AB. If you are looking for best sound for your money and you dont already have speakers I suggest you buy active speakers. They are by far the best bang for your bucks.
Cheers!

 

[Ismapics]

The A-s301 and up have sub out, phono, and digital in.

Yes but it's $150 more that opens up many other options.

 

[Ismapics]

It has preamp output, and any sub I‘ve seen has a low pass filter.
Can‘t really expect a crossover at that price, actual AVRs start at about double this.
Edit: Not sure if those are line or pre outputs, actually. The latter are usually labeled as the former, but who knows. I can measure that if I don‘t forget.

I‘ve bought the version with DAB for a workshop (paird with some old Arcus speakers), it works totally fine, just like any other radio tuner.
As far as FM goes I'm not sure about the situation in the US, but over here unless you're outside and armed with a good antenna, reception is terrible, making the performance of the tuner secondary.
Digital radio is nice to have at work though and it works well even with smaller stations. Internet radio of course is more versatile still - I listened to Bongo Radio from Tanzania just recently (it's exactly what you would expect), but can't ask for that built in for 200 bucks.

It is. Good connectivity and digital radio tuner (R-S202D, paid about 185€ a few months ago), plenty of power and hopefully good reliability.
IN Europe it‘s by far the cheapest product in its class from an manufacturer that I have any confidence in.

And no, even if it weren‘t for digital radio, buying some 20 year old higher end receiver is not an option for a business. Sure, it could last another 20 years, but it could break tomorrow and then I‘m right back where I started wasting more time on it.

If an inexpensive Fosi Amp manage to have a Sub-Out why won't this one. This AMP contrary to what you mentioned, does not have a Pre-Out.

 

[carsknivesbeer]

Yes but it's $150 more that opens up many other options.

I was just commenting on the minimum line to get these features on a non-network stereo Yamaha.

 

[carsknivesbeer]

The newish Onkyo A-9110 could be a decent budget contender. No digital in, but phono input and sub out.

Are the Yamaha a-301/501/701/801 official discontinued? They look like they are being replaced with the N-xxxA receivers. The old N600 series measured much worse than the basic stereo versions so hopefully they have a better design. The bottom LCD screen is an interesting choice, looks terrible on silver.

 

[ZolaIII]

Yes but it's $150 more that opens up many other options.

Which option does it open that you know for sure it will last you over a decade?
Having sub out and even HPF doesn't mean you will be able to integrate sub good not to mention pair of them independently and one per each chenel. You think how load dependent amp that has 0.001 better SINAD is better than one that's not load dependent after shown on example of easy to drive Revel speakers that it makes 2% shift in highs? No you are not thinking at all. There are great class H (based on D with voltage pump) SoM amplifiers and cheap one's with lot of things discutable and expensive ones (with long warranty, iron core or toroidal transformers, good caps, long term part availability, proper protection and so on like ATI Hypex line) but you also have class G ones (A-B with voltage pump) like Benchmark. You or anyone else won't ever have any benefit of SINAD higher than 80 on average and 90 dB in mids. Simply because speakers have higher THD. Best headphones have second fundamental under 1% THD in lows when driven loud. The Yamaha lines as A-S 7xx, 8xx are sweets spot there is right now for home use in stereo.

 

[Ismapics]

Which option does it open that you know for sure it will last you over a decade?
Having sub out and even HPF doesn't mean you will be able to integrate sub good not to mention pair of them independently and one per each chenel. You think how load dependent amp that has 0.001 better SINAD is better than one that's not load dependent after shown on example of easy to drive Revel speakers that it makes 2% shift in highs? No you are not thinking at all. There are great class H (based on D with voltage pump) SoM amplifiers and cheap one's with lot of things discutable and expensive ones (with long warranty, iron core or toroidal transformers, good caps, long term part availability, proper protection and so on like ATI Hypex line) but you also have class G ones (A-B with voltage pump) like Benchmark. You or anyone else won't ever have any benefit of SINAD higher than 80 on average and 90 dB in mids. Simply because speakers have higher THD. Best headphones have second fundamental under 1% THD in lows when driven loud. The Yamaha lines as A-S 7xx, 8xx are sweets spot there is right now for home use in stereo.

Sve the typing for an important issue. Simple, this is an old Yamaha, and if a cheap Fosi, Topping and such can offer a sub-out in the next iteration they should and keep the pricepoint. The rest really, with all due respect you can save it. For more or $350 you can go used, HTR, to a Wiim or many others.

 

[DSJR]

This unit reminds me of the expression "Horses for Courses".

I no longer listen to free to air Radio (or TV) so the tuner section is not of interest.

The front end of my ideal "budget" system would be the recently reviewed WiiM AMP, a $100 more gets you a streamer (wifi & ethernet), optical & analogue in, HDMI ARC & sub out plus 10db better SINAD performance. The streamer allows you DAB in lieu of FM & AM, although you could buy a cheap second hand tuner and connect it via the analogue in (or a turntable).

WiiM Amp Streaming Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the WiiM Amp streaming amplifier. It was sent to me by the company and costs US $299. I was pleasantly surprised by the good bit of weight this small box has. It will help it not slide with the weight of the speaker wires and such. Back panel shows...

www.audiosciencereview.com

I get the nostalgia but it doesn't make sense to me to buy a unit that doesn't take advantage of technology and all that the internet offers.

Believe me, many who still take an interest in traditional HiFi aren't always interested in latest tech, or believe from their dealer they have to spend thousands to get it (such as a Naim Uniti or something similar). We're spoiled here and a bit more clued-up I feel than the rather backward looking market out there and even more backward looking dealers servicing that market!

 

[Dinesh Menon]

Dinesh Class D is today as good as the best Class AB. If you are looking for best sound for your money and you dont already have speakers I suggest you buy active speakers. They are by far the best bang for your bucks.
Cheers!

I agree, Class D is the future.
After reading so many reviews about
active speakers and sound bars, I've never considered them.
Thanks for your suggestion.
Happy New Week.