WiiM Amp discussion

[Jeromeof]

Can someone explain frequency response changes under load? I'm using 8 ohm Boston Acoustic A100's and on House Curve it shows a notable rise above 10K, but I assumed I was using the app or the phone incorrectly.

I think the important thing is if you can use House Curve and measure your speakers in your room then the built in PEQ features of the WiiM amp mean you can compensate for both some room modes but also for any changes to the frequency response that might happen because of load dependency between the Amp and your speakers.

 

[harkpabst]

I think the important thing is if you can use House Curve and measure your speakers in your room then the built in PEQ features of the WiiM amp mean you can compensate for both some room modes but also for any changes to the frequency response that might happen because of load dependency between the Amp and your speakers.

But only if you can even trust HouseCurve measurements. Or your ears, for that matter.

I for one would definitely not trust any smartphone based measurements at 10 k or above.

I hope HouseCurve measures both speakers individually, not using a correlated mono signal ...

 

[markalot63]

But only if you can even trust HouseCurve measurements. Or your ears, for that matter.

I for one would definitely not trust any smartphone based measurements at 10 k or above.

I hope HouseCurve measures both speakers individually, not using a correlated mono signal ...

I don't trust the phone mic at all, plus high frequencies will reflect so I wonder if that's what it is picking up on? Amp sounds fine to me, and I like the way I can control spotify from my computer, including the amp volume. Now I need to find something with uncompressed music where I can do the same.

 

[Arianoxx]

I don't trust the phone mic at all, plus high frequencies will reflect so I wonder if that's what it is picking up on? Amp sounds fine to me, and I like the way I can control spotify from my computer, including the amp volume. Now I need to find something with uncompressed music where I can do the same.

Would be nice to see a comparative between a calibrated mic like an umik-1 and a phone. For example, on Rew on Mac you can choose your iPhone as microphone. Can anyone that has a Mac and both an iPhone and a calibrated mic try to measure his speakers with Rew and compare the measurements?

 

[harkpabst]

I don't trust the phone mic at all, plus high frequencies will reflect so I wonder if that's what it is picking up on? Amp sounds fine to me, and I like the way I can control spotify from my computer, including the amp volume. Now I need to find something with uncompressed music where I can do the same.

It would make things easier if you could show us the actual measurement, instead of describing it.

Did you select the correct internal microphone in Measure Setup? Double check this. Results can be vastly different.

Did you limit the chirp and sweep tone to one channel at a time? If not, then do it and compare with your previous measurement.

 

[markalot63]

Left and right (green). Using bottom mic, internal. Mic aimed ahead of me at listening position. Measurement close to identical to combined channel.

 

[harkpabst]

Whatever that is, it looks ridiculous. And for sure it has nothing to do with load dependency on part of the amp. Pretty much impossible that any tweeter ever used in A110s could really exhibit this kind of peak.

You could still limit the frequency range to 2.5 or 3 kHz and have HomeCurve determine a set of 4 PEQ filters to correct the remaining peaks ... but as long as it is not clear what is causing this strange result I would probably not trust in the outcome, either.

Here's the reason why I was asking for single channel measurements: Wave length at e.g. ~12 kHz is ~28.66 mm. When doing combined channel measurements (monophonic test signal played through both speakers at the same time) and the distance between mic and speakers is off by around half the wave length for one speaker (read: 14.33 mm or any odd multiple) you will observe noticeable cancellation at the measuring point.

 

[markalot63]

Thanks. The room is very small and while not echoey (is that a word) it does have a lot of bare wall and a smooth flat ceiling. Room size is 11x10 (feet). Maybe because the room is so small the echoes are seen as the direct signal? I'm not sure housecurve has any detection of that. I'll look for a housecurve thread to continue.

 

[harkpabst]

The room is very small and while not echoey (is that a word) ...

At least as of now it is. Trying to imagine how it was the other way around ...

... it does have a lot of bare wall and a smooth flat ceiling. Room size is 11x10 (feet). Maybe because the room is so small the echoes are seen as the direct signal?

I don't believe that echoes could play a role here. This is by far too high up in the frequency band. Remember the wave length. There might be little damping, but even relatively small irregularities of surfaces will cause diffusion.

An external microphone (as supported by HouseCurve) would help identifying or ruling out the iPhone mic as the cause, but - unless you can borrow one - literally comes at a price.

 

[sweetchaos]

Amir posted the review:

WiiM Amp Streaming Amplifier Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the WiiM Amp streaming amplifier. It was sent to me by the company and costs US $299. I was pleasantly surprised by the good bit of weight this small box has. It will help it not slide with the weight of the speaker wires and such. Back panel shows...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[CarlToft]

With a purely resistive 8 ohm load the transfer function rise is ~0.3.dB at 10 kHz and ~0.6 dB at 20 kHz. This might not be ideal, but it's still close to nothing.

Both, the "simple" and the "complex" reactive loads used in Erin's measurements are somewhat arbitrary chosen, but not to far from typical real-world speakers. Still, the maximum deviation from ideal is <1 dB in all cases.

Obviously, there have been multiple generations of Boston Acoustics A100. What they all have in common is that they are not constantly 8 ohms from 20 Hz to 20 kHz (no speaker is) and that no measurements can be found on the internet.

If the rise shown by HouseCurve is more than 1 dB, then it's not just the amp. It might be the phone or the speaker itself. If it is less than 1 dB, then don't worry about it.

In any case you might want to limit the frequency range HouseCurve is acting on to less then 10 kHz or better less then 5 kHz upper limit.

Any alternative app for Android?

 

[harkpabst]

Any alternative app for Android?

None that I am aware of. The root problem is that there are just too many different types and configurations of Android phones with way too many different mics and manufacturers not providing calibration information for those microphones. No single app programmer could ever make up for that disadvantage.

Room Equalization Wizard has rightfully developed into something like the gold standard for acoustical measurements. If you happen to have access to a USB mic like the now famous MiniDSP UMIK-1 and a Windows, Linux or Mac computer you'd be best of using this setup. You can instruct REW to semi-automatically calculate correction for the 4 PEQ points available with the WiiM Amp, but it's not quite as easy as using HomeCurve with an iPhone.

WiiM is actively working on bringing 8-band PEQ and room correction to their products, but there's no timeline yet and no information on what microphones might be supported for the latter.

 

[CarlToft]

None that I am aware of. The root problem is that there are just too many different types and configurations of Android phones with way too many different mics and manufacturers not providing calibration information for those microphones. No single app programmer could ever make up for that disadvantage.

Room Equalization Wizard has rightfully developed into something like the gold standard for acoustical measurements. If you happen to have access to a USB mic like the now famous MiniDSP UMIK-1 and a Windows, Linux or Mac computer you'd be best of using this setup. You can instruct REW to semi-automatically calculate correction for the 4 PEQ points available with the WiiM Amp, but it's not quite as easy as using HomeCurve with an iPhone.

WiiM is actively working on bringing 8-band PEQ and room correction to their products, but there's no timeline yet and no information on what microphones might be supported for the latter.

Thanks i own an ipad so i guess that would work.

 

[Graham849]

Another mainstream review

Wiim Amp review: your favorite speakers’ new best friend | Digital Trends

The Wiim Amp is compact, stylish, easy to use, and ridiculously full-featured. For all your audio needs, just add speakers.

www.digitaltrends.com

 

[xSDMx]

Is anyone else seeing significant regressions in HDMI behavior since the firmware update rolled out yesterday? I'm using my WiiM Amp with an LG C9 and Nvidia Shield Pro (2019) with HDMI CEC and auto sense enabled. Since the update yesterday, whenever my TV goes to sleep upon resume the WiiM Amp will not output audio until I reboot the WiiM Amp itself.

 

[NuclearWinter]

Is anyone else seeing significant regressions in HDMI behavior since the firmware update rolled out yesterday? I'm using my WiiM Amp with an LG C9 and Nvidia Shield Pro (2019) with HDMI CEC and auto sense enabled. Since the update yesterday, whenever my TV goes to sleep upon resume the WiiM Amp will not output audio until I reboot the WiiM Amp itself.

Yes, exactly the same problem here with my C9. Started today after updating.

 

[xSDMx]

Yes, exactly the same problem here with my C9. Started today after updating.

I found a weird alternative to rebooting that might indicate the root cause of the issue. If I go into the LG TV audio settings and cycle between PCM, auto, and bitstream after a few times through the audio suddenly starts working again without needing to reboot the entire amp. Weird. Please fix!

 

[NuclearWinter]

I found a weird alternative to rebooting that might indicate the root cause of the issue. If I go into the LG TV audio settings and cycle between PCM, auto, and bitstream after a few times through the audio suddenly starts working again without needing to reboot the entire amp. Weird. Please fix!

I submitted a ticket and they've reverted my firmware to the previous version, so all is working for me again. Hopefully they come up with a proper fix soon.

 

[Brantome]

New Amp firmware just landed

 

[xSDMx]

New Amp firmware just landed
View attachment 353759

I've said it before, I'll say it again. WiiM is truly the hardest working in the business. They were super fast to jump on this issue!