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Topping LA90 Review (Integrated Amplifier)

Rate this amplifier:

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 35 4.4%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 50 6.2%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 193 24.1%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 524 65.3%

  • Total voters
    802

theREALdotnet

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So the same adapters used on the PA5? TRRS (edit- TRS)?

The one pictured on the left is a TS adapter, not TRS. It would short the “-“ lead to ground, but should still work at half the input level. The one on the right is an XLR-RCA adapter, whether it works depends on how it’s wired. It will most likely also short “-“ to ground.
 

DHT 845

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That is great that it is not class D. I must audition this amp. Technically measurements are the best, power is more that enough.
 

xrk971

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The LA90 is designed as an amplifier for balanced input only. The one in the photo cannot be used.
You can use it, you are just tying the negative balanced phase to ground. Depending on how the balanced input topology is setup, it may permit full power output by rebalancing the amp drive based on only the positive input, or it may only allow half the output swing. I suspect it is the former. This same technique can be used on the PA-5 and many other balanced input amps. What you lose is the noise cancellation advantage of balanced lines. For short runs of signal cable though, this doesn’t really matter. Most amps with an LTP input stage often have the negative side tied to ground. The single ended input drives the positive side. That same LTP input can be used for balanced input by driving both sides with balanced preamp inputs. The grounding on the negative side must be removed though.
 

DualTriode

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Hasn't @amirm tested load-dependency in pretty much every Class D amp review he's done, and found no significant load dependency for Hypex and Purifi-based amps?

If you're talking 2 ohm loads, that's another story, although I wouldn't necessarily describe that as load dependency. By load dependency I assume you're referring to high frequency response variations depending on impedance, and the Hypex and Purifi modules have solved that issue as far as I know.

To some degree or another every Class D amplifier requires a filter to take out the high frequency trash.

That filter is some variation of LC. The time constant and cutoff frequency of that filter depends on the R or impedance of the load. The typical design load is 4Ohms. A higher or lower connected load will affect the frequency response of the amplifier.

A manufacturer may spend more time and or money on the Class D output filter.

Like it or not you as a consumer need to spend more effort working with your connected load to avoid surprises with the frequency response.

Thanks DT

 

voodooless

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A manufacturer may spend more time and or money on the Class D output filter.
It's not necessarily money that makes it better, it's engineering. If you want load independence, you'll need to take the feedback behind the LC, not before it as many budget Class D amps do. Post filter feedback is just a much harder problem to solve, and therefore less seen.
 

antcollinet

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To some degree or another every Class D amplifier requires a filter to take out the high frequency trash.

That filter is some variation of LC. The time constant and cutoff frequency of that filter depends on the R or impedance of the load. The typical design load is 4Ohms. A higher or lower connected load will affect the frequency response of the amplifier.

A manufacturer may spend more time and or money on the Class D output filter.

Like it or not you as a consumer need to spend more effort working with your connected load to avoid surprises with the frequency response.

Thanks DT

It's not necessarily money that makes it better, it's engineering. If you want load independence, you'll need to take the feedback behind the LC, not before it as many budget Class D amps do. Post filter feedback is just a much harder problem to solve, and therefore less seen.

Perhaps this class D discussion should be taken elsewhere. It is off topic for this thread.
 

antcollinet

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This thread is getting ridonculous.
People saying there is no speaker/room combination in the world where you can live with less than half a kilowatt@8R.
View attachment 202907

480 watt peaks? Really? What do you do with that, pulverize kidney stones?
480W is only 20dB above 4.8W.

If you have music with a 20dB dynamic range (not unusual for classical), and you are listening at an average of 4.8W (only 3.8db over the speaker sensitivity rating for 4ohm speakers), then the peaks will be hitting 480W. They might be very short term peaks, but they'll be there.
 

TheBatsEar

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you are listening at an average of 4.8W
I don't want hearing damage so i don't do that.
1563904902768.gif


Do you listen with 4.8 watts on average? What speakers, how far from them, what music?
 

antcollinet

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I don't want hearing damage so i don't do that.
View attachment 203315

Do you listen with 4.8 watts on average? What speakers, how far from them, what music?
I don't. People with less sensitive speakers or larger rooms might.

Here's a piece of music. Large parts of the first four minutes are at -30dB. The crescendo sits at around -10dB for long periods. Transient peaks hit about -2dB.

Even listening to the quieter parts at 1/2 a watt, the transient peaks are going to clip on any amp less than around 500W. I accept that might not be an audible problem.

 
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BDWoody

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This thread is getting ridonculous.
People saying there is no speaker/room combination in the world where you can live with less than half a kilowatt@8R.
View attachment 202907

480 watt peaks? Really? What do you do with that, pulverize kidney stones?

That's what JBL figured when they tucked 2x250w amps into each of their 7 series monitors. ;)

Even with that, I will still occasionally see the clip light flicker...

It obviously depends on the speaker being driven.
 

rebbiputzmaker

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That's what JBL figured when they tucked 2x250w amps into each of their 7 series monitors. ;)

Even with that, I will still occasionally see the clip light flicker...

It obviously depends on the speaker being driven.
And realistically in your example because it is active those would seem even more powerful than comparable passive amplification which has to travel through a crossover and experience additional loss. I would guess a lot of the prospective users will be buying this and bi amping which would be sensible. And… I would think in turn extremely satisfied with the sound quality.
 

F1308

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I don't. People with less sensitive speakers might.

Here's a piece of music. Large parts of the first four minutes are at -30dB. The crescendo sits at around -10dB for long periods. Transient peaks hit about -2dB.

Even listening to the quieter parts at 1/2 a watt, the transient peaks are going to clip on any amp less than around 500W. I accept that might not be an audible problem.

I have taken a couple of screenshots...
Roland Fantom 8 synthesiser.
Myself playing piano and then a full orchestra, Tchaikovskyish style...:):):):)
Topping PA5 involved and set at 3'oclock.
Fantom at 40%.
Smartphone reading data overhead the keyboard.
Background room noise around 31dB.
When playing the keys as hard as possible with volume closed, 45 dB detected.
Then Mythos ST 93dB.

Almost unbearable...and stays well below 85dB at 83.2dB peak.

Of course, everybody around asking to lower that ear-ringing-level after the first minutes, but trumpets are trumpets, horns are horns, choirs are choirs, taykos are taykos, cannons are cannons, cathedral bells are bells...and that is the real thing placed at home !!!!
 

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DualTriode

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480W is only 20dB above 4.8W.

If you have music with a 20dB dynamic range (not unusual for classical), and you are listening at an average of 4.8W (only 3.8db over the speaker sensitivity rating for 4ohm speakers), then the peaks will be hitting 480W. They might be very short term peaks, but they'll be there.

Perhaps this, how many watts does it take to fill a room, discussion should be taken elsewhere. It is off topic for this thread.
 
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amirm

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What is the cause for the difference between the measured figure and the expected figure (-140dB at 1k)?
There are optimizations which can yield better crosstalk. I am using my standard dummy load which may not allow 140 dB of crosstalk itself. For Benchmark, I had a different load box/wiring. There are also different schemes for measuring crosstalk which yield different results (Left vs Right or the other way around).
 

mocenigo

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It's interesting that so many people suddenly starts to demand topping's amp to perform extremely well at 2Ω, which is not the typical Hi-Fi system needs, or what they asked in other products, even competing manufactures started to do trash talk, really makes you think.View attachment 202417

You may be missing that if your speakers are 4ohm nominal (and many are) then they can dip much lower than that in some ranges. You can have 4 ohm nominal speakers with drops to 2ohm and less in some frequency ranges, sometimes in the bass. In this case, an amp like this one may even turn off because of overcurrent protection.
 

mocenigo

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Not in my case . I’m a happy owner of a topping DAC which I could praise all day long.
But this amps simply is underpowered for the task of driving today’s typical low sensitivity loudspeakers in midsized rooms , which is my use case . Add some room eq and it to wants some headroom.
If I powered nearfield speakers on my desktop? Bu then I would by a nice pair of active speakers .

So this product is more of an engineering excercise than something I can use . The Engineering is remarkable but for what purpose , what’s the use case .

If you have sensitive speakers this is a dream of an amplifier. That's a perfectly valid use case for you.
 
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amirm

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You may be missing that if your speakers are 4ohm nominal (and many are) then they can dip much lower than that in some ranges. You can have 4 ohm nominal speakers with drops to 2ohm and less in some frequency ranges, sometimes in the bass. In this case, an amp like this one may even turn off because of overcurrent protection.
I have tested some 200 speakers. The *minimum* impedance is what I report and it is almost always in 3.6 to 4.2 ohm range. Dropping to 2 ohm is exceptionally rare. But even if it did, many people power these with amps with minimum spec of 4 ohm and don't report issues.

Regardless, I have already tested the Topping LA90 with 2 ohm load and it worked to full power in my sweep. And even pushed into clipping region for peak power measurements. So let's not continue to spread this myth.
 
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