Tekton M-Lore Speaker Review

[markus]

View attachment 364006

@Eric Alexander please post those simulations and measurements so we can work out what could cause such a difference in data. Making claims isn't the same as showing facts. A claim doesn't prove anything.

On a general note, Klippel NFS measurements show how a speaker objectively behaves in the real world. Just like a tape measure shows whether a piece of wood is 1 feet long or not. If such measurements don’t correspond to Tekton’s simulations/measurements then Tekton is selling speakers that don’t work as designed.

 

[Katzz]

I peeked at the FB post to read that person clarifying Dr. Choueiri's supposed quote and it's gone.

Also Eric is responding to someone who claims to have purchased speakers from him but is asking him to answer for what has happened here and he replied:
"Amir was forced to change/update his measurements - that's a win for Tekton Design. In fact he admitted he couldn't correct the 'step response' - an even bigger win for Tekton Design. The fact that measurements have been updated and changed is a win for Tekton Design and vindication."

I really want to believe that someone hacked the tekton design fb page, Its so surreal to see him describe as a "big win" on amir not able to correct the step response in his review

 

[amirm]

@amirm I know you made a comment on EA's post on the Tekton's FB group when he fake apologized to Erin, I think he deleted your comment.

I checked and it is still there. I am not too much into facebook. Do people have the ability to delete other people's commetns?

 

[voodooless]

From @Eric Alexander, thanks @Ninjastar for posting!

"Amir was forced to change/update his measurements - that's a win for Tekton Design. In fact he admitted he couldn't correct the 'step response' - an even bigger win for Tekton Design. The fact that measurements have been updated and changed is a win for Tekton Design and vindication."

He wasn't forced at all, he did it out of his free will to show you that it doesn't matter very much, and in the process debunked any and all arguments you made against him. This is not a win for you, it just shows you were wrong all along. As for step response: it would actually be trivial to recreate that since we have the frequency and phase response of any point in space. It's just that the software uses a different way of measuring it (probably more accurately). You could just export it to some other software to recreate it. There is no win for you, there is no vindication!

Good luck in your fantasy world!

 

[ScofieldKid]

I don't think so. the primary breakup of the Alpha-8A would at least need a notch. It's not like the Seas A26 for example which has a 2nd order more or less natural roll off (HP):

Green is the unfiltered Alpha 8A. With a nominal 2nd order crossover on the tweeter (no padding) there's a prominent ~ 3.5KHz peak. The orange dashed line is Amir's on axis klippel measurement for reference. there's definitely a LP filter on the Alpha

View attachment 364062

Ah, looks quite different from the one I remember. See for example: https://www.avsforum.com/threads/tekton-lore-owners.1465726/page-8

 

[amirm]

I put in a couple of facebook posts there.

 

[Katzz]

I checked and it is still there. I am not too much into facebook. Do people have the ability to delete other people's commetns?

He can delete or hide your comments

 

[amirm]

He can delete or hide your comments

Well, should this ever get to litigation, this kind of action will not look good for him.

 

[voodooless]

Well, should this ever get to litigation, this kind of action will not look good for him.

I think that would be the least of his worries though

 

[DanielT]

That would rarely work.
It's always just an approximation, but the more difficult and complex the speaker, the further away the simulation can be.

For a simple DIY 2-way speaker with no frills, ok. With experience you can tune something like this by ear.
But loudspeakers that are produced in quantities and perhaps sold for years? Simply being responsible for the shipping costs for floorstanding speakers in the event of dozens of complaints could kill you.

I know you know about it, but for others just coming in and reading the thread:

The tweeter in Tekton M-Lore is a classic budget king, which I know many DIYers have used. However, it does not go well with
Eminence Alpha-8A. With a smaller bass driver, however, the possibility of putting together a nice budget two-way DIY speaker increases. For example with this bass driver:

Peerless 830656 5.25" Woofer

Peerless SDS Line 830656 5.25" Woofer Spec sheet: Peerless 830656 PDF Coated paper cone Rubber surround Aluminum voice coil Soft roll spider The SDS compact subwoofer family offers low resonant frequency performance, ideally suited for compact sealed enclosures. This 5.25 inch 8 ohm member of...

www.madisoundspeakerstore.com

Low sensitivity, you can't ask for everything for a driver that costs like a hamburger menu.
(there are many good woofers from different manufacturers in that size that don't cost that much money)

The tweeter in Tekton M-Lore is:

Vifa BC25TG15-04 1" Textile Dome Tweeter

Peerless BC25TG15-04 1" Textile Dome Tweeter Pre-coated textile diaphragm for improved consistency Damped cavity in pole for lower resonance frequency and reduced distortion Ferrofluid cooled voice coil for improved power handling Optimized face plate for linear response 104mm diameter face...

www.madisoundspeakerstore.com

Then of course suitable crossover but that is another question. Anyway the drivers are above, especially in relation to the price, have a potential in themselves.
Maybe even with the drivers above together with a good budget 10-15 inch bass driver in a three-way system, but that's a topic for another thread.

Edit:
As already pointed out in the thread, it is possible to create good two-way speakers with an 8 inch bass and a 1 inch tweeter but then the tweeter often has a waveguide. Here is an example of an active one:

Genelec 8050B Review (Studio Monitor)

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Genelec 8050B powered studio monitor (speaker). It was kindly purchased by a member used and drop shipped to me. It costs US $1895 each when new. I was horrified when I noticed the speaker was simply put in a plastic bag, dumped into a much...

audiosciencereview.com

 

[BDWoody]

From @Eric Alexander, thanks @Ninjastar for posting!

He wasn't forced at all, he did it out of his free will to show you that it doesn't matter very much, and in the process debunked any and all arguments you made against him. This is not a win for you, it just shows you were wrong all along...

Good luck in your fantasy world!

He pulled the same nonsense when Erin temporarily pulled his review, claiming that PROVED there was a mistake needing fixed.

He doesn't seem to understand what it means to interact in good faith.

 

[caught gesture]

He pulled the same nonsense when Erin temporarily pulled his review, claiming that PROVED there was a mistake needing fixed.

He doesn't seem to understand what it means to interact in good faith.

There is some, shall we call it, “interesting faith” where he is based.

 

[olieb]

He pulled the same nonsense when Erin temporarily pulled his review, claiming that PROVED there was a mistake needing fixed.

Though this be nonsense, yet there is method in't.
This guy has an agenda and he does not care for "good faith".

 

[caught gesture]

Though this be nonsense, yet there is method in't.
This guy has an agenda and he does not care for "good faith".

It is a well-trodden path, attack being the best form of defense, as attributed to Sun Tzu, the Chinese military general.

​

 

[tomtoo]

He pulled the same nonsense when Erin temporarily pulled his review, claiming that PROVED there was a mistake needing fixed.

He doesn't seem to understand what it means to interact in good faith.

There was a willing confrontation from the beginning and this goes on.

 

[Buckchester]

I don't even think that's a terrible way to go about it, if you and your customers are happy with potentially-technically-imperfect speakers. Which lots of people seem to be. It's a common and valid point of view to say one prefers ears-based design than a technically perfect speaker. Full disclosure - I've done a bit of voicing by ear in my day. The results were fine. I will always use the measurement gear at my disposal, but I won't tell someone with 250 ear-tuned speaker designs under their belt that their ears are worthless, either.

I wouldn't trade my Genelecs for anything Tekton makes, but some people may feel the opposite, and that's fine.

Which just makes this whole episode all the more bizarre. Eric has plenty of happy customers, none of whom (I assume) are clamoring for him to start using a Klippel. Why take this horrible, reputation-destroying detour just to call out measurements that weren't even that bad to begin with and that nobody really cared about in the first place?

Ego.

 

[Roland68]

He pulled the same nonsense when Erin temporarily pulled his review, claiming that PROVED there was a mistake needing fixed.

He doesn't seem to understand what it means to interact in good faith.

@Eric Alexander has a much bigger problem.
If the manufacturer of the measurement system, or someone else, oversees a retest and finds it correct, it will be an extreme blow to the company's and his reputation.

 

[tomtoo]

The only thing i can see is a person that digs him deeper and deeper into the sh**. That picture could be seen from the begining but it gets more clear and sharp from post to post. At least thats my impression from all this. The sad part is this all had not to go that way.

 

[tomtoo]

Nice. Came here for the trypophobia reference. Not disappointed. A++++

Thx did learn a new word.

 

[Rick Sykora]

Counting the sim claim, that's deflection #6 or so? Am losing track of his empty promises...

Have you seen the Tekton flagship speaker? The 1812 looks like a bad DIY project and does not even utilize his likely fraudulent patented array design.

Reminds me of the ole "if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit."