PS Audio FR30 speakers

[amirm]

I have a PS Audio amp, legacy from my sorry days. I HAD respect for him. Now, I just don't know anymore. Does he believe his stuff or is he in just for the money?

As much as I love to know the answer to this question, let's not put Chris on the spot like this. It is off topic as to how the speaker performs.

 

[DWI]

I absolutely do. I have a general liability insurance for ASR with $150,000 coverage limit. I pay thousands of dollars per year in insurance for ASR. So don't spread garbage rumors like this.

There was something on pinkfishmedia media, but it may have been seen differently from either side. As long as anything that fails or is damaged under testing or in transport is fully compensated by your insurance, then there's no problem, and apologies if any misunderstanding. I'm glad I don't live run the USA because my last premium for about $3m cover was $1,000.

Speakers are notorious and I understand expensive ones are usually delivered and set up by the manufacturer. These weigh something like 110kg each, it's a 2 or 3 man job.

 

[BrokenEnglishGuy]

But why the hate about something that you will likely never be in the market for or even try to experience? I think that it is at least in part, sour grapes, as the Aesop fable goes. Because they are out of reach, they must be sour.

I have been reading about the phenomenon of "hate watching". Why do people repeatedly watch something they dislike so they can belittle and ridicule it? One thought is that they are channeling and releasing negativity from other parts of life (bad mood, insecurities, other things).

Hello

I'll guess

But, i think the hate it's because there is a bunch of new company's with no much '' progress '' in comparason to the old stuff, instead of newer and better products all we see is expensier and sometimes worse than old stuff.





For example, if you have 30,000 USD you can buy pretty good stuff with that money. If you create a speaker it should be competitive..

I guess you know a lot of currently '' speaker solutions '' around 30,000.

This floorstanding speaker is not that expensive
lol

https://static-neumann.s3.amazonaws.com/img/1810/product_detail_x2_desktop_KH-420-on-a-KH-870-subwoofer-1_Neumann_M.png

 

[DWI]

They were listed by price, most expensive first. I was curious if any expensive speakers have been reviewed, given the transportation risks and this being a thread about speakers.

I appreciate the Neumann KH420 speaker would be on this list if it were up to date and you mentioned it was tested on your ground floor because it was heavy. I have no idea if that matters, but lugging speakers is no fun. My dealer does the lugging. After he set them up they won't move for years.

 

[CtheArgie]

@BrokenEnglishGuy it was a pair of KH310s anda pair of KH750s that blew my mind regarding money/quality issue. But they are not artistically pretty. That and the RME.

 

[CtheArgie]

As much as I love to know the answer to this question, let's not put Chris on the spot like this. It is off topic as to how the speaker performs.

It was a rhetorical question. Not one for Chris to comment.

 

[AwesomeSauce2015]

I don't know where you get that from. The top listing in there is Revel F328Be which lists for $8,000 each. A pair of these will be $16,000. So clearly pricey speakers that were purchased new and sent me to for testing en route to the member.

While handling the logistics is non-trivial, I have a lift that is capable of 400 pounds. So I could get it done.

Not that I ever could afford these (at least not in the next 30 years);
So if someone were to buy a pair of "Project Everest DD67000", we could get a review of them?
I checked the weight and it's only quoted at 313lb, so the lift should be good! - Though it may be a bit too heavy to bring up any stairs...
It's even a Harman product so we know you'll be subjectively unbiased!

 

[Chris Brunhaver]

You are completely outside of my reality!

We definitely can afford speakers like these! I've spent a huge amount of money in "audiophilia" over the years. Don't be a psychologist, just stay on your day job of speaker designer.

But, it is because of places like this one, ASR as one example, that I challenged myself to rediscover what it was all about. My "day job" is helping companies on the development of new drugs. That is, designing clinical trials, analyzing them and helping them interpret the results. My job is behind the scenes, but in the last two years my "client-physicians" asked me to publish with them (a commentary and a trial comparison review). Peer reviewed publications. It is when I started to apply the same parameters of my job to "audiophilia" that I truly discovered that I was conned. For years, by greedy people that took advantage of my goodwill and willingness to believe. Applying objective measures made me realize that it was all wrong. That you can really study what gets better sound and that you don't have to spend money in "Noise Harvesters" that do not harvest noise, in "power regenerators" that do not regenerate power. And have no effect on the sound.

My day job framework, applied to "sound", is what I am doing here. You do the work, you spend time in testing, you document your work, you "publish" (in the case you show your work) and then you can deliver your messages. I do know very well that developing drugs is different to hawking stereo. I still expect some integrity.

By the way, I am grateful that you wrote here. I'd rather not comment there as much as possible. Did you know that one of their posters insulted a woman and called a blind man a "moron" because he couldn't "see" something on the website? Besides insulting me at any opportunity? He was called on by Paul, but nothing happened. Now, I give him back when I feel like it.

I respect the fact that you are now trying to test. It should be the other way around. You should have told Paul the tools you needed to do the work "well". It is called R&D. You can't put a lipstick on a pig. If he didn't want to do it, you should have realized what kind of work you were getting into. It is clear you know your stuff, this is why I don't understand you. But I don't do psychology, so it is your life.

I can spend $15k on a bicycle, $8k going one week heli-skiing. It is not about the money. It is what I am getting. And this kind of subjective audio is really about satisfying insecurities. Not about sound quality. I live in an area where Ferrari's, McLarens, Lambos and expensive Porsches are a dime a dozen (incidentally, my wife has a Porsche though she rarely drives it now). That does not impress me.

As I said in your employer's site, I really have little patience for the subjective terms and the misleading advertising. Do you know that his $50 outlet is just a rebranded $7 one you can buy in Home Depo?

I have a PS Audio amp, legacy from my sorry days. I HAD respect for him. Now, I just don't know anymore. Does he believe his stuff or is he in just for the money?

Well, I am a speaker designer, performing musician and nothing more but I think that the comment about hate watching still stands. If you want to read every daily blog post, youtube video (or positive product review about a new product category for the company) and make negative comments, it's your life and "to each his own". There are literally hundreds of audio companies out there and I hope you can direct more attention to things that you actually enjoy and find pleasure in.

I am not "trying to test". In this case, there is a difference between the many thousands of measurements (and listening work) that was done in development and the lab measurements for publishing a more detailed technical datasheet for the production unit on the website.

I won't be responding further to any comments that you post here or elsewhere (on PS blogs or forums) because you clearly have an "ax to grind" and there is no use in trying to comment on the design process or product performance decisions or trade-offs.

 

[CtheArgie]

Well, I am a speaker designer, performing musician and nothing more but I think that the comment about hate watching still stands. If you want to read every daily blog post, youtube video (or positive product review about a new product category for the company) and make negative comments, it's your life and "to each his own". There are literally hundreds of audio companies out there and I hope you can direct more attention to things that you actually enjoy and find pleasure in.

I am not "trying to test". In this case, there is a difference between the many thousands of measurements (and listening work) that was done in development and the lab measurements for publishing a more detailed technical datasheet for the production unit on the website.

I won't be responding further to any comments that you post here or elsewhere (on PS blogs or forums) because you clearly have an "ax to grind" and there is no use in trying to comment on the design process or product performance decisions or trade-offs.

Actually, I don’t. I had not heard the hate watching comment before. I don’t relate to it. I have no idea why you say that. Don’t answer. Your choice.

But I was a customer for many years, this is why I participated... I don’t think I’ll ever get their stuff again.

An axe to grind? No, I prefer honesty.

 

[ta240]

Well, I'll play armchair psychologist here and say that I've seen a lot of mock outrage or general animous towards very expensive things.

Expensive things and things that don't do exactly what they want them to do. Not things they've bought that didn't do what they want but things other people bought and are happy with. There seems to be an extra annoyance that someone else might be happy with it. I think it is possibly even amplified (pun intended) by the fact that the people that bought it and are happy with it even have the nerve to think it is better than what the annoyed person owns. At the very least they know they like it better than the product the annoyed person has. And, somehow, that just isn't acceptable.

 

[amirm]

So if someone were to buy a pair of "Project Everest DD67000", we could get a review of them?
I checked the weight and it's only quoted at 313lb, so the lift should be good! - Though it may be a bit too heavy to bring up any stairs...
It's even a Harman product so we know you'll be subjectively unbiased!

We had a sample at work for a while:

But yes, I would find a way to get it done. For listening tests, I would use our downstairs setup as getting it upstairs in my main system is out of the question.

 

[hardisj]

While handling the logistics is non-trivial, I have a lift that is capable of 400 pounds. So I could get it done.

Cool. Will you be measuring the Salon 2 then? I thought the weight and slippery-ness was the issue (per an earlier reply of yours in another thread saying that). I’m assuming that was before you got this lift.

Edit: I see your reply above about the upstairs/downstairs issue. I’m assuming that’s why you haven’t measured the Salon 2, then.

 

[amirm]

This floorstanding speaker is not that expensive

This would not compete with this speaker though. It doesn't have the luxury look that these buyers demand.

 

[amirm]

Will you be measuring the Salon 2 then?

The lift is useless in managing stairs and that is where the Salon 2 is located (in a loft upstairs). It is much easier to test a speaker that is shipped to me than testing Salon 2 because my measurement lab is where delivery is made.

 

[hardisj]

The lift is useless in managing stairs and that is where the Salon 2 is located (in a loft upstairs). It is much easier to test a speaker that is shipped to me than testing Salon 2 because my measurement lab is where delivery is made.

Completely understand. I do remember now someone else joking about hiring movers to come and carry it down the stairs for you.

 

[ahofer]

Well, here is the review summary from the same article:

The waiting is over, and the aspen FR30 speakers are nothing short of remarkable, setting new standards of focus, openness, weight and control at this price and well above. The build and finish are as immaculate as the sound, the unusual styling works remarkably well in the room, and the listening experience is a revelation. If you’re in the market for speakers in this sector, listen to them – they’re a bargain.

Can you point me to a critical review from this publication? It’s a sad state of affairs, but the audiophile reviewing press is just not useful. At best, you have to weed through the superlatives to find some hidden reservations or, at worst, they just pump up every kilobuck item they review. I’m sure you know this.

The consumer in this industry has very few chances to perform *actual* comparison shopping, or read objective reviews, and it’s a shame.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

Can you point me to a critical review from this publication? It’s a sad state of affairs, but the audiophile reviewing press is just not useful. At best, you have to weed through the superlatives to find some hidden reservations and, at worst, they just pump up every kilobuck item they review. I’m sure you know this.

The consumer in this industry has very few chances to perform *actual* comparison shopping, and it’s a shame.

This is like the old HiFi/Stereo Review model; they justified that they don't do bad reviews because they don't want to waste valuable space on bad products. I guess the assumption is that if something gets reviewed, its good. The problem however is that the consumer has no way of knowing if a non-reviewed product is due to it being in fact bad, or that they just haven't had an opportunity to review it. Ideally the reviewers would just list off the products which are bad and leave it at that, but of course that's not gonna happen.

 

[AwesomeSauce2015]

We had a sample at work for a while:

Oh my.
That looks like a big amp.
Did they sound good?
They seem like they'd be amazing, but I'm probably never going to hear them...

 

[amirm]

Did they sound good?

They did playing my 2nd gen master tapes on Reel to Reel.

 

[mSpot]

So if someone were to buy a pair of "Project Everest DD67000", we could get a review of them?

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