When 12 Gauge Wire is Not 12 Gauge

[wseroyer]

As I've mentioned here before, I've been using the wire distributor Sky High Car Audio on ebay.
They offer everything from 8g OFC zip and up at very attractive prices.

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Really good stuff car audio guys swear by them, and push huge amounts of power through their wire.

 

[Sal1950]

Really good stuff car audio guys swear by them, and push huge amounts of power through their wire.

It is "just great wire" at a very reasonable price. If you want something purdy'r, buy some of the cheap attractive snake-skin type coverings to make it look like the "high priced spread".

 

[Haskil]

I use flexible electrical cable in gray sheath H05VVF from a large industrial cable manufacturer (Nexans) in 4 times 15 AWG connected two by two, which gives 12 AWG and reduces the inductance.
16 euros for 15 meters in 2019.
4 ohm speakers with a minimum of 3 ohms at 250 Hz and an amplifier of twice 200 watts of old conception but excellent to listen to and recently compared to a Purifi without differences relating only to a vague sensation being able to be noted.

 

[Speedskater]

I use flexible electrical cable in gray sheath H05VVF from a large industrial cable manufacturer (Nexans) in 4 times 15 AWG connected two by two, which gives 12 AWG and reduces the inductance.

Yep, four conductor electrical cable is also an excellent loudspeaker cable. Wired as a Star-Quad to reduce the inductance.

In the US, the best dollar for dollar loudspeaker cable is:
Romex® 14AWG by three plus ground
Wired as a Star-Quad it's an 11AWG conductor.
But, it's very, very stiff and ugly.

 

[Angsty]

Belden 5000UE is an excellent two conductor speaker cable at twelve gauge. I prefer the variant offered by Blue Jeans Cable which has a white outer jacket versus the common grey jacket.

Speaker Cable - 5000UE

www.belden.com

 

[Sal1950]

In the US, the best dollar for dollar loudspeaker cable is:
Romex® 14AWG by three plus ground
Wired as a Star-Quad it's an 11AWG conductor.
But, it's very, very stiff and ugly.

No offense intended but,
I would just query you on what you think makes it "best dollar for dollar loudspeaker cable"?
Since sound quality wise it will be no different than any good 10g or 12g zip, and the fact it's "very stiff and ugly",
I'm confused why you would recommend it over many the other options?

 

[Speedskater]

I would just query you on what you think makes it "best dollar for dollar loudspeaker cable"?

a] Because it costs less per foot.
b] Sometimes a Star-Quad has advantages.
With loudspeakers that have a very low, high frequency impedance (think Apogee).
In some high interference situations, although a twisted pair might be better.
It is rated for in-wall use.
* * * * * * * * * * * *
Yep, there are many other options:
Landscape cable
Loudspeaker cable
& Zip cord
* * * * * * * * * * * * * *

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[Haskil]

Here is a PDF in French of a large article on HP cables published in a French electronics magazine in 1995... This detailed article destroys the myth of the special cable, supporting measurements as well as theoretical demonstrations and serious calculations.

This is where I got my way of making a speaker cable that leaves me peace of mind... with four-wire electrical cable connected in pairs... of a diameter sufficient for the length

But I annoy many, many golden ears with this... and with the other standard cables of my high fidelity system... Some are even furious...

 

[Sal1950]

a] Because it costs less per foot.
b] Sometimes a Star-Quad has advantages.

Ok, I do accept those as positive attributes.
But unless the Joe Average customer can't afford any thing else, I just can't imagine anyone
running them across the living room floor, which is by far the vast majority of "speaker wire" applications.
And then there is the always controversial "Wife Acceptance Factor" issue? OMG... LOL
Cheers

 

[Descartes]

Mogami W3103 or Mogami W3104

 

[JustJones]

250 ft 14/3 romex at Lowes is $112 . 14/2 is $75
250 ft in wall 12AWG speaker cable at monoprice is $99
If I was running a lot of speaker cable in wall I'd go with in wall rated cable for speakers it's a lot easier to work with and price difference is negligible.

 

[radix]

250 ft 14/3 romex at Lowes is $112 . 14/2 is $75
250 ft in wall 12AWG speaker cable at monoprice is $99
If I was running a lot of speaker cable in wall I'd go with in wall rated cable for speakers it's a lot easier to work with and price difference is negligible.

Then you might as well go with 500 ft. 14 Gauge Solid Copper THHN Wire, which is $60/500 ft (single wire) at HD. So for 250ft, that's $60/pair. And you can pick your own colors and someone down the road might be less likely to confuse it with a high-voltage wire. Sure, you have to twist a pair yourself....

 

[JustJones]

Then you might as well go with 500 ft. 14 Gauge Solid Copper THHN Wire, which is $60/500 ft (single wire) at HD. So for 250ft, that's $60/pair. And you can pick your own colors and someone down the road might be less likely to confuse it with a high-voltage wire. Sure, you have to twist a pair yourself....

Yes that would work but that wire is usually pulled in conduit. I was referring to the above post about using romex for speaker cable. It works but I wouldn't use it. Personally I would only use speaker cable rated for in wall to avoid problems with inspections.

 

[192kbps]

I saw this test, why can't I see a difference? He used 10 meters of cheap wire. Is there a problem with the testing method?

 

[radix]

I saw this test, why can't I see a difference? He used 10 meters of cheap wire. Is there a problem with the testing method?

I'm not sure what the question is. What difference did you expect to see?

To me, it looks like he first showed the wire with the signal generator off, and it had 4 uV of 10 kHz signal on it. In the next test, he put 5 V of 1 kHz on the wire, and it measured pretty darn transparent.

 

[192kbps]

I'm not sure what the question is. What difference did you expect to see?

To me, it looks like he first showed the wire with the signal generator off, and it had 4 uV of 10 kHz signal on it. In the next test, he put 5 V of 1 kHz on the wire, and it measured pretty darn transparent.

The specification of this wire must not reach 12AWG, and the length is up to 10 meters. Why can't I see the frequency response change？

 

[DonH56]

The specification of this wire must not reach 12AWG, and the length is up to 10 meters. Why can't I see the frequency response change？

The audio analyzer does not put out enough power and does not load the wire enough to show any difference. Smaller wire has more loss at high power, and has higher resistance that acts like a larger frequency divider driving a speaker or other low-impedance load.

 

[Power Pop 23]

Hi there. Unfortunately I have torn down my measurement fixture so no way of repeating those results right now.

Belden and Canare wire are still available to purchase. ASR members have suggested alternatives since this test was run. Consider resurrecting your measurement fixture to measure wire donated or suggested by ASR members.

 

[Descartes]

Belden and Canare wire are still available to purchase. ASR members have suggested alternatives since this test was run. Consider resurrecting your measurement fixture to measure wire donated or suggested by ASR members.

Mogami cables are great as well!

 

[Speedskater]

For loudspeaker cables almost any reasonable electrical or audio cable will do. You don't need the good bulk cable manufactures like Belden, Canare or Mogami. Those are for interconnect cables.