Topping D30Pro Review (Balanced DAC)

[Pdxwayne]

Widening is not ideal but not too bad. I'd be more concerned about those high order harmonics. Can you show your 3khz d30 pro spectrum with values on the Y axis and logarithmic frequency scale?

Here you go. I thought the harmonics are not bad?

 

[gvl]

Here you go. I thought the harmonics are not bad?

The high order ones are worse. This is interesting, Amir's THD(F) wasn't very revealing due to noise shaping getting in the way, but while your harmonics are still fairly low relative to the fundamental (-100db or lower), it's worse than what the original review might suggest. Dunno, might be instrumentation error as the multitone is pretty squeaky clean or could be Amir got a cherry picked unit. Either way I don't think what you show is an audible concern but you might be onto something.

 

[Pdxwayne]

The high order ones are worse. This is interesting, Amir's THD(F) wasn't very revealing due to noise shaping getting in the way, but while your harmonics are still fairly low relative to the fundamental (-100db or lower), it's worse than what the original review might suggest. Dunno, might be instrumentation error as the multitone is pretty squeaky clean or could be Amir got a cherry picked unit. Either way I don't think what you show is an audible concern.

The worse measurements is likely due to the limitation of the loopback device, the Focusrite Scarlett Solo (3rd Gen).

Anyway, I wonder what else could cause one DAC sounded less clean than the other, when typical measurements already looking really good.

 

[aandres_gm]

Anyway, I wonder what else could cause one DAC sounded less clean than the other, when typical measurements already looking really good.

The most powerful instrument in this chain: your brain

 

[half_dog]

When I zoom into original spectrum, I can see that d30pro 3khz shape is wider than x16. Maybe that is the difference?

White line is d30pro. Blue line is x16.

View attachment 139384

Interesting... Do you still have the E30? If yes, could you make this same measurement with it?

 

[gvl]

The worse measurements is likely due to the limitation of the loopback device, the Focusrite Scarlett Solo (3rd Gen).

Perhaps, but looking at your delta graph the X16 appears to be cleaner.

 

[Pdxwayne]

The most powerful instrument in this chain: your brain

Please take a look at the blind tests I have done so far. Post 1 mostly online blinds and ABX tests. Post 2 and 3 described my double blinds between DAC.



https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...tracking-my-listening-tests.24364/post-822052

I would appreciate if you could provide suggestions for measurements that I can actually perform.

 

[Pdxwayne]

Interesting... Do you still have the E30? If yes, could you make this same measurement with it?

I will be very busy today. I will provide that info soon, but likely late today.

 

[Lupin]

@JohnYang1997, I got the d30 pro. My windows 10 laptop is seeing it as E30. I have been using e30 with the laptop for a while. Is that OK? Should it says D30 instead?

Thanks!

1. Uninstall the driver and restart (not strictly necessary to restart but just to be safe)
2. Go to the device manger window and enable the option to show hidden devices
3. Right click on anything with Topping name and select remove device
4. restart (again not strictly necessary to restart but just to be safe)
5. Install the driver again

This should solve your issue.
If not.. it will require some registry editing which is a lot more involving.

 

[Pdxwayne]

1. Uninstall the driver and restart (not strictly necessary to restart but just to be safe)
2. Go to the device manger window and enable the option to show hidden devices
3. Right click on anything with Topping name and select remove device
4. restart (again not strictly necessary to restart but just to be safe)
5. Install the driver again

This should solve your issue.
If not.. it will require some registry editing which is a lot more involving.

Thanks! After John responded, I was able to get windows to show correct name once I remove e30 from device manager. I had to do the same again if I want my windows to show e30 when connect back the e30.

 

[Lupin]

@JohnYang1997
Just noticed there is a "BT" input indicator on the display, but there's no BT support on the D30Pro.
Is it a general display which happen to have this indicator being sourced for the D30Pro or was the D30pro planned to have Bluetooth but was scratched later on in development cycle?

 

[JohnYang1997]

@JohnYang1997
Just noticed there is a "BT" input indicator on the display, but there's no BT support on the D30Pro.
Is it a general display which happen to have this indicator being sourced for the D30Pro or was the D30pro planned to have Bluetooth but was scratched later on in development cycle?

There was shortage with Qualcomm Bluetooth chip before the production. So basically no Bluetooth or no D30pro.

 

[Lupin]

There was shortage with Qualcomm Bluetooth chip before the production. So basically no Bluetooth or no D30pro.

Thanks for the quick reply.
Good decision to proceed with the D30pro imho. I for one don't really care about BT.
My previous DAC had BT support and in all those years I used BT like... well... never actually

 

[half_dog]

I will be very busy today. I will provide that info soon, but likely late today.

Thank you for your time and attention! I have a Sonata HD PRO with (CS DAC chip) an E30 and D10s, I will try do some measurements and see how they behave.

 

[Pdxwayne]

Thank you for your time and attention! I have a Sonata HD PRO with (CS DAC chip) an E30 and D10s, I will try do some measurements and see how they behave.

Hmm, I am just ready to check my e30 and then I realize that E30 only got RCA out. Previously all my measurements were using right XLR out from X16 and d30pro.

So, to get the gain of my loopback device to match will take some time. Also, it is unlikely going to be apple to apple comparison....

I will see if I can do RCA out comparison between x16, d30pro, and e30 later today.

 

[Pdxwayne]

Thank you for your time and attention! I have a Sonata HD PRO with (CS DAC chip) an E30 and D10s, I will try do some measurements and see how they behave.

E30 RCA out vs d30 Pro RCA out at 3khz showed no difference around 3Khz. They overlapped each other.

X16 RCA out vs d30Pro RCA out continue to show difference for 3khz. Blue is x16.

Note that I have done many more comparisons yesterday using XLR out of d30pro and X16. The fundamentals matched very well for 1khz, 1.5khz, 2khz, 2.6khz, 3.2khz, 4khz, and 5khz. The only differences I noticed were 3khz. Strange.....

Anyway, if you think of anything else to measure to show differences in perception of "clean" sound, let me know. Thx!

 

[trivenge]

What is everyone using for the pcm filter?

 

[Lupin]

What is everyone using for the pcm filter?

F2

 

[half_dog]

E30 RCA out vs d30 Pro RCA out at 3khz showed no difference around 3Khz. They overlapped each other.
View attachment 139524

X16 RCA out vs d30Pro RCA out continue to show difference for 3khz. Blue is x16.
View attachment 139525

Note that I have done many more comparisons yesterday using XLR out of d30pro and X16. The fundamentals matched very well for 1khz, 1.5khz, 2khz, 2.6khz, 3.2khz, 4khz, and 5khz. The only differences I noticed were 3khz. Strange.....

Anyway, if you think of anything else to measure to show differences in perception of "clean" sound, let me know. Thx!

Thank you for take these measurements. I did some here with a Sonata HD PRO(black) and Topping D10s (blue). I coudn't measure E30, I will try to do it later. That's what I got...

 

[Pdxwayne]

@JohnYang1997, since d30pro has 4 DACs, how do you make sure left and right channels don't have timing issue? How do I check?

I know my unit has 0.05db imbalance between left and right channel. If there is such imbalance in dB level, then I think there is a possibility of timing imbalance too.

Please explain if that kind of imbalance is possible or not.

Thanks!