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Topping Centaurus R2R DAC Review

Rate this R2R DAC:

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 18 6.5%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 69 24.7%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 138 49.5%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 54 19.4%

  • Total voters
    279
I can't even get on the small band wagon of engineering achievement when it's based on trying to make a "sub standard" technology into something adequate for an otherwise expensive cost vs other DACS, it's just silly.
This statement also applies 1 to 1 to USB, and especially to USB 2.0, and today it is used in all DACs as the standard connection to PCs/Macs.
And that's only because years of engineering have transformed a "sub standard" and cheap technology into something adequate.
 
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Hello,
Very interesting... I was waiting a premium desktop DAC with PEQ. But I was wondering how to configure the EQ...? It's on the Tooping application ? This application is available on IOS ? And if not, is it possible to configure PEQ directly on the Centaurus menus ?
 
‘Audiophiles’ belief that an earlier version of something is always better, Cd was better than streaming, vinyl was better than CD, it’s a men of a certain age, issue.
Keith

I’m 41 and been on the R2R train for a year or two now. It all started by chance when I bought a California Audio Labs valve CD player from 1989 off eBay for kicks and was shocked that I enjoyed it more than some of my modern equipment. I was actually always raised to believe anything digital is automatically outdated and worthless in 6 months so it upended my worldview. I’m now at the point I don’t believe anything is better or worse from a subjective experience, just “different” and believe variety is the spice of life.

Had a run around forums about this stuff and I was surprised to see that this new R2R gear are probably not targeting old audiophile crowds but rather new,mostly headphone users.
Interesting.

100% this is me, I’m mostly a headphone guy. In general R2R’s just seem to be easier on my ears, especially when you listen to bright headphones like Grado which is my daily drivers.
 
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Hello,
Very interesting... I was waiting a premium desktop DAC with PEQ. But I was wondering how to configure the EQ...? It's on the Tooping application ? This application is available on IOS ? And if not, is it possible to configure PEQ directly on the Centaurus menus ?
A look at the Topping Tune Reference Guide should answer your questions. You can download this tool from Topping and it is used for the current DACs from Topping with EQ. Unfortunately only under Windows
Topping Tune Reference Guide
With the Centaurus R2R DAC you can only choose between saved EQs, but not create any.
Centaurus R2R DAC Manual
 
Many thanks Roland68 for your answer...
Ok, so, if I understand, I only can create EQ on topping windows application. But once I have created my Eq's on windows application, those EQ will be sent to the Centarus, and I don't have to keep the windows application opened to choose one of my EQ, is this correct ?
So I only need Windows application to create or modify my Eq's but once it has done, the Cenaurus is able to have them in local Centarus and I can choose my Eq's ont the Centaurus.
If yes, it can be ok. Not practical, but ok.
 
Many thanks Roland68 for your answer...
Ok, so, if I understand, I only can create EQ on topping windows application. But once I have created my Eq's on windows application, those EQ will be sent to the Centarus, and I don't have to keep the windows application opened to choose one of my EQ, is this correct ?
So I only need Windows application to create or modify my Eq's but once it has done, the Cenaurus is able to have them in local Centarus and I can choose my Eq's ont the Centaurus.
If yes, it can be ok. Not practical, but ok.
That's exactly how it is.
 
I’m 41 and been on the R2R train for a year or two now. It all started by chance when I bought a California Audio Labs valve CD player from 1989 off eBay for kicks and was shocked that I enjoyed it more than some of my modern equipment. I was actually always raised to believe anything digital is automatically outdated and worthless in 6 months so it upended my worldview. I’m now at the point I don’t believe anything is better or worse from a subjective experience, just “different” and believe variety is the spice of life.



100% this is me, I’m mostly a headphone guy. In general R2R’s just seem to be easier on my ears, especially when you listen to bright headphones like Grado which is my daily drivers.
Yeah, the thing is if they measure adequately they won't actually be sounding easier on your ears. It will be psychological.
 
It's funny how prejudices emerge from all sides ... but for whatever the reason (competition in their home market or other) Topping are doing us a favor IMO.

We have ESS, AKM, Discrete 1 bit (Topping's choice entirely to develop this from an engineering point of view), and R2R, all within 10% of each other in terms of price, and all, I think everyone agrees, with performance above necessary thresholds, human hearing, lowest distortion etc.

Innovation comes from this, and not just sticking with one technology because "everyone" thinks that it measures so well lets just have that from now on ... "why bother" kind of thing. Innovation does not come from that, just more of the same.

Sure R2R is old technology re-implemented I am understanding with more accuracy (old technology can surely be improved), Topping's Discrete 1 bit is a completely new bespoke 'take' on their part.

And all on a level playing field engineering wise for people who wish to investigate and compare for themselves.
 
Innovation comes from this, and not just sticking with one technology because "everyone" thinks that it measures so well lets just have that from now on ... "why bother" kind of thing. Innovation does not come from that, just more of the same.
While innovation can come from different directions, it is usually in an attempt to improve on the current state of the art. R2R, even the best-designed and engineered ones from Holo Audio, don't do anything better than the common, off-the shelf S-D chip DACs at 1/10 the price. It's an improvement relative to the older R2R DACs from last century, but it's not an improvement relative to modern technology.
 
While innovation can come from different directions, it is usually in an attempt to improve on the current state of the art. R2R, even the best-designed and engineered ones from Holo Audio, don't do anything better than the common, off-the shelf S-D chip DACs at 1/10 the price. It's an improvement relative to the older R2R DACs from last century, but it's not an improvement relative to modern technology.
..or the intended application , the DS chips today fundamentally solves the linearity issues you simply cant engineer out of R2R :)
 
Similar to satisfying a demand for vinyl? No objective benifit, but it pulls at certain consumers heartstrings so the manufacturer gives it to them?

By the way, I have no problem with people enjoying vinyl or tube amps or whatever they want. I just didn’t realize R2R was in a similar category…if it is. The technology doesn’t seem old enough to hold any nostalgic value like vinyl, tubes, etc.

Edit: Or is it just an appreciation for the engineering? As someone before me mentioned, similar to a mechanical watch over quartz? Which I get. I love mechanical watches. Even though they’re objectively inferior timekeepers, I do prefer them and pay a premium for the engineering alone.
I do love a smartwatch ... until the battery dies ! :)

I listen to vinyl a lot, but I am finding that a smaller and smaller percentage of my collection sounds better than the digital equivalents over time.

It is all about the source, and the transfer from the original tapes... and even the availability of the original tapes.

I still have a considerable number of records not currently available on Amazon Music which I play, and many which simply seem to have been 'cut' from a better original source (or in the digital version transferred from an inferior source, or just not transferred very well, or with not so great remixing).

It is interesting for me, and I think relevant to many of these debates, just how close many pressings sound to their digital equivalents despite all the limitations. It has implications regarding what we actually hear. The limitations of our hearing, and also what our brains prioritize with our hearing!

However, there is no doubt that, for example, a track mixed for bass and impact and done well for digital can't be matched by the vinyl ... can't match the bass especially. But I have examples from either format that because of the source can't be matched by the other.
 
While innovation can come from different directions, it is usually in an attempt to improve on the current state of the art. R2R, even the best-designed and engineered ones from Holo Audio, don't do anything better than the common, off-the shelf S-D chip DACs at 1/10 the price. It's an improvement relative to the older R2R DACs from last century, but it's not an improvement relative to modern technology.
Yes, it can come from different directions, and recently with DAC's it has been channeled into chips using Delta-Sigma Modulation.

I just posted a reply about vinyl. I doubt the "vinyl revival" will last, but I don't think it started because of a love of crackle and pop! Or even album art and nostalgia.

In my case it came from finding that a majority of my records sounded better on my record player ... BUT BUT BUT ... that was 20 plus years ago.

More even. The 'kick up the butt' came from an outdated medium: vinyl records. Equipment had to improve.

A lot has changed since then. Including in the past 5 or so years. So, in my view, despite the perfection of the measurements, there has been innovation ...

And despite the current perfection there will no doubt be more!
 
Does the May suffer from linearity issues?
To some degree they are always there in all R2R due to the principle of how they work . You add voltages from resistor networks that cant be perfect and drifts with temperature .
I have not detailed knowledge of May , but it should have this to some degree . There are better and worse ways of doing the summing ( so I've read ) but the fundamental issue is still there.
 
Yeah, the thing is if they measure adequately they won't actually be sounding easier on your ears. It will be psychological.
But we don't know how this measures in NOS mode.
Some very astute observer of audiophiles pointed out earlier in this thread that many (even most) people who buy into the R2R thing, will also select this mode.
But has our glorious leader shown these measurements to the data hungry masses. Hint.... no
 
despite the perfection of the measurements, there has been innovation
One can use the latest materials and engineering techniques to build a raft to cross the Atlantic, or one can board a modern airplane to do the same, faster, safer, and cheaper. While first one is an engineering achievement, it's still not the way I'd prefer to travel. YMMV.
 
But we don't know how this measures in NOS mode.
Some very astute observer of audiophiles pointed out earlier in this thread that many (even most) people who buy into the R2R thing, will also select this mode.
But has our glorious leader shown these measurements to the data hungry masses. Hint.... no
And tries to rectify this more or less sucessfully by applying filters and upsampling with some software , level of tweaking will be unknown ?
 
To some degree they are always there in all R2R due to the principle of how they work . You add voltages from resistor networks that cant be perfect and drifts with temperature .
I have not detailed knowledge of May , but it should have this to some degree . There are better and worse ways of doing the summing ( so I've read ) but the fundamental issue is still there.
I believe Holo had developed some sort of system which reduced the inaccuracies due to resistor tolerances. Not sure if it's used in this Topping or not.
 
I believe Holo had developed some sort of system which reduced the inaccuracies due to resistor tolerances. Not sure if it's used in this Topping or not.
Holo Audio introduced a second resistor matrix that was used to compensate for the main ladder drift. I still have one of their early DACs with this implementation. It resulted in a very decent SINAD of about 108dB and good non-linearity, available over 6 years ago. Don't know what other innovation Topping introduced in their DAC, other than a slightly lower price point.
 
Yes, it can come from different directions, and recently with DAC's it has been channeled into chips using Delta-Sigma Modulation.

I just posted a reply about vinyl. I doubt the "vinyl revival" will last, but I don't think it started because of a love of crackle and pop! Or even album art and nostalgia.

In my case it came from finding that a majority of my records sounded better on my record player ... BUT BUT BUT ... that was 20 plus years ago.

More even. The 'kick up the butt' came from an outdated medium: vinyl records. Equipment had to improve.

A lot has changed since then. Including in the past 5 or so years. So, in my view, despite the perfection of the measurements, there has been innovation ...

And despite the current perfection there will no doubt be more!
High-quality vinyl and CD pressings have been recording increasing sales figures for years and have overtaken everything else in terms of increasing growth figures, currently including streaming.
 
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