• Welcome to ASR. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Topping B200 Monoblock Amplifier Review

Rate this amplifier:

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 9 2.3%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 12 3.1%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 49 12.7%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 316 81.9%

  • Total voters
    386
Exactly. If you go from the Clearly Lying spec sheet it is 200W on 4 and 8Ohm
And as amir said

"You would need even more voltage for 8 ohm" means in vice versa you need less voltage for 4 ohm to reach max power


View attachment 433893

If you go from the measurements you posted

not that i said

What is a "demanding 4Ohm load" well i did not specify... So lets say 4Ohm 60deg inductiveView attachment 433895

24V On 4 ohm vs 38V on 8ohm
24V = ~27.5dBV -22dB gain =5.5dBV =~1.9V
38V = ~31.6dBV -22dB gain =9.6dBV =~3V

plenty of Laptop chargers out there that are class 1 and don’t have a earthed metal chassis
Hahaha....pretty funny. Okay so this is not the amp for you. Try this one.

With current pricing it is quite close to two of these horrible Topping monoblocks in the stereo version. Has more power, and maintains voltage and current better. Not quite the SOTA levels of distortion and noise, but were I personally buying something right now would be on my short list. Or maybe one of the Buckeye's. The three channel model didn't vary voltage by more than .1 volts over the entire reactive load test at all impedances from 2 to 8 ohms. It protects at 1 ohm.

1741313724190.png


1741313739730.png


1741314180182.png
 
Thanks! I like the Horizontal red line labeled "ideal"
I would interpret this as ideally the voltage is Constant Load independent. (as this is what i would call ideal!)

Now notice how this is not the case for the topping amp.


With this amp the output voltage drops with higher and more demanding loads.
This is what i would call non ideal.
 
the gods forbid anyone using something non-ideal
I did not say this.
perfectly satisfactory.
Yeah for some cases it is.

But if we look for "engineering excellence" i tend to look for things like this before i look for practicably meaningless SINAD differences at -120dB or there about.

Or If a Specification given by the manufacture is clearly wrong that alone is a big negative point for me.
For Example 200W in 4 ohm and 8Ohm with a 4A 60V power supply... I’m curious how toping is trying to pull this of with a class AB amp.
Class B has a maximum theoretical efficiency of π/4 (≈ 78.5%).
Class AB sacrifices some efficiency over class B in favor of linearity, thus is less efficient (below 78.5% for full-amplitude sine waves in transistor amplifiers
so from the 240W PSU an ideal Class B Amp can get <190W
but they claim 200W for 8Ohm AND 4Ohm ...

For excellence i expect "under promise over deliver"

systematically tweaking values because 200W sounds better then 190W in the marketing is borderline scam

But SINAD Performance in a resistive Load surly is Excellent
 
Last edited:
Well u are in luck then because the NCx500 datasheet literally says 700W at 4ohm and 380W at 8 ohm
 
Well u are in luck then because the NCx500 datasheet literally says 700W at 4ohm and 380W at 8 ohm

That's the data sheet for the Hypex module, isn't it? The output power of a complete amplifier obviously also depends on the power supply.

Speaking of which, I fail to see how an amplifier with a 64V DC power supply can produce a peak-to-peak output voltage of more than 64V? For a sinusoidal output signal of relatively low distortion like 1% that would mean 22.63V RMS, i.e. 64W and 128W into 8 and 4 ohm (resistive), respectively. Even if we allow for heavy clipping, to the point of resembling a square wave, the RMS output voltage cannot be higher than 32V.

I cannot square that with these measurements:

1741317856220.png




Moreover, these power measurements:

1741317896146.png


are at odds with the graphs (rather than the commentary) in those:

1741317922589.png

(where does anyone see 193W here?)

1741317950662.png



I suppose they were the results of different measurement methods. However, when two measurements of the same quantity don't agree with each other then either or both of them are flawed. I'd really like an explanation of this discrepancy. As it stands, I'd call the B200 a 150W/160W amplifier. I'd also appreciate if someone could explain how the amp's output can exceed its rail voltage without the use of output transformers.
 
This post is to illustrate what the problems are with measuring amplifier using a reactive load.

Here is a simple model of an amplifier connected to a speaker driver in LTspice. This model is copied from the MATLAB "Loudspeaker Modeling with Simscape" tutorial (the "simplified model"). The driver parameters used are from SB Acoustics SB10PGC21-4 3" full range driver. The voltage source V1 is the "theoretically perfect" amplifier, but with a 0.1 Ω source resistance. It generates a 3 cycle 100 Hz sine wave tone burst.
reactive_load1.png

reactive_load2.png

The green trace shows the amplifier voltage output. The red trace "V_out" is the voltage across the amplifier output (i.e. V1 in series with the source resistance). You can see that the red trace does not go to zero immediately when the tone burst terminated. The second picture had the vertical axis magnified to show the overshoot and decay of the red trace. The cause of the back EMF of the driver as it is a reactive load which can store and subsequently release energy. The voltage reading "V_out" is a combination of both "V1" and the back EMF.

The 0.1 Ω source resistance gives a damping factor of 40 into a 4 Ω load, while not super high, is fully adequate according to Dr Toole's "Damping, Damping Factor, and Damn Nonsense" article (20 was enough), if he is to be believed. Before anyone complains that amplifiers should have zero output impedance, let's consider taking the measurements at the speaker terminals instead. Now the speaker wire resistance is part of the source resistance, and the 0.1 Ω value is not unrepresentative of real-life setups.

Here are the FFT of both V1 and V_out, which shows the differences in their spectral compositions. The deviations of V_out from V1 will be interpreted by the analyzer as distortions (as linear and/or nonlinear distortions).
fft_vout.png

So, here we have a theoretically perfect voltage source (amplifier), but the measurements won't show it as perfect. It is obvious that attributing the "measured distortions" to the perfect voltage source/amplifier is a faulty interpretation of the results. Also, this analysis used a highly simplified linear speaker model. In real-life, speaker drivers are nonlinear — the spider/surround is a nonlinear spring, mechanical damping is nonlinear, the back EMF is nonlinear as the electromagnetics are nonlinear, etc. Therefore, it is likely that using a real speaker driver as the load will worsen these effects.

There are good reasons why the industry doesn't standardize on measuring amplifier distortions with reactive loads. If Occam's razor is to be believed, the simple reason is that it's usefulness is rather limited.


Regarding the assertion that amplifier performance is different when the load is complex, I'll point out the various TPA3255 amplifiers as example. The load dependent behavior of the frequency response can be solely explained by the response of the output LC filter. Because of that, we can deduced that the input to the filter is reasonably frequency independent. It is easy to understand how. The TPA3255 chip has its feedback taken at the chip output pins, and the feedback corrections work. However, without PFFB, the feedback circuit is blind to the effect of the load on the LC filter. The chip has no problem with "the correct output" at its output pins, even as the output LC filter together with the speaker/dummy load is always a complex load for the chip. It is the LC filter that causes the load/frequency dependency. So the amplifier chip works as intended and is always outputting to a complex load.

With basic PFFB, the load dependency can be, to a large extent, corrected in the audible range. However, for example, as in the cases of the Aiyimas, they are not fully corrected. The PFFB implementation per the TI app report is limited by the amount of feedback available. The TPA3255 chip has a gain of 21.5 dB. The app report implementation used 5.6 dB for feedback, and left the amplifier with a gain of 15.9 dB. For more complete correction, higher amounts of feedback (and possibly different implementation methods) are necessary.
 
That's the data sheet for the Hypex module, isn't it? The output power of a complete amplifier obviously also depends on the power supply.

Speaking of which, I fail to see how an amplifier with a 64V DC power supply can produce a peak-to-peak output voltage of more than 64V? For a sinusoidal output signal of relatively low distortion like 1% that would mean 22.63V RMS, i.e. 64W and 128W into 8 and 4 ohm (resistive), respectively. Even if we allow for heavy clipping, to the point of resembling a square wave, the RMS output voltage cannot be higher than 32V.

I cannot square that with these measurements:

View attachment 433904



Moreover, these power measurements:

View attachment 433905

are at odds with the graphs (rather than the commentary) in those:

View attachment 433906
(where does anyone see 193W here?)

View attachment 433907


I suppose they were the results of different measurement methods. However, when two measurements of the same quantity don't agree with each other then either or both of them are flawed. I'd really like an explanation of this discrepancy. As it stands, I'd call the B200 a 150W/160W amplifier. I'd also appreciate if someone could explain how the amp's output can exceed its rail voltage without the use of output transformers.
Bridged mode. That's how to get a square wave with RMS 64V.
 
Saturation is very fast: Aluminium and copper have roughly the same thermal properties. Any initial temperature differences between the “inside” and “outside” of the housing will be evened out in less than seconds! This means that Amir’s tests confirm the fact that there are no thermal issues.
That's not true -it takes time, of course.

If it didn’t, your car engine would be hot the moment you turn the key, and your panini grill would be ready the second you switch it on.

Physics doesn’t work the way you think. Systems have inertia.
 
I can't. I can only point to the source of the observation which is this review.

There isn't even a standard consensus as to what is the expected amount of heat or power. FTC created and then recently changed their standard but even then that standard is not being accepted by everyone on this forum.

And when there is no requirement, there is no basis for scoring and no meaning for scientific discussion.

This is different from, say, a computer CPU that has 15W to 150W operating modes and a 75W heatsink where the power trend is clearly defined.
And here are 87 pages on that topic. @KL....
Enjoy! :D

 
Folks, please don't zoom in too much in power measurements. They are not high accuracy numbers. To wit, I have told AP my loads are "4" and "8" ohms. In reality they are a bit lower or higher especially when the lead resistance is included. Same with my reactive load which has different impedance. So in my book, 190 watts and 200 watts are the same.
 
That's the data sheet for the Hypex module, isn't it? The output power of a complete amplifier obviously also depends on the power supply.

Speaking of which, I fail to see how an amplifier with a 64V DC power supply can produce a peak-to-peak output voltage of more than 64V? For a sinusoidal output signal of relatively low distortion like 1% that would mean 22.63V RMS, i.e. 64W and 128W into 8 and 4 ohm (resistive), respectively. Even if we allow for heavy clipping, to the point of resembling a square wave, the RMS output voltage cannot be higher than 32V.

I cannot square that with these measurements:

View attachment 433904



Moreover, these power measurements:

View attachment 433905

are at odds with the graphs (rather than the commentary) in those:

View attachment 433906
(where does anyone see 193W here?)

View attachment 433907


I suppose they were the results of different measurement methods. However, when two measurements of the same quantity don't agree with each other then either or both of them are flawed. I'd really like an explanation of this discrepancy. As it stands, I'd call the B200 a 150W/160W amplifier. I'd also appreciate if someone could explain how the amp's output can exceed its rail voltage without the use of output transformers.

It appears to be a 130-140W amplifier (4-ohm minimum) with a dynamic power of around 170W.

However, its sustained performance under load isn’t entirely clear. A user reported running it at 130W into 8 ohms for several minutes, while Amir’s test showed a power reduction during the 1-minute sweep, suggesting 130W might be a reasonable estimate for sustained power at 8 ohms. This would result in approximately 100W of heat dissipation per unit, which seems realistic and manageable.

Given a Class A/B efficiency of around 60%, the power drawn from the wall would be roughly 230W. This aligns well with the power supply rating of 60V, 4A = 240W. It's probably best not to fully load these enclosed bricks for long.

Given how clean the signal is, these power figures are quite good. Solid performance overall. In a nice solid enclosure that looks to be well built.
 
That's not true -it takes time, of course.

If it didn’t, your car engine would be hot the moment you turn the key, and your panini grill would be ready the second you switch it on.

Physics doesn’t work the way you think. Systems have inertia.
I didn’t say immediately, I said within seconds for this very small box.
 
this very small box
And this very small box has massive heat sinks, and the rest is not thin sheet metal but aluminum with an impressive wall thickness.
 
Question from me, the latest noob. How much of the circled section is audible? These amps seem to excel in everything except this (and slightly with SINAD, of course).

Screenshot 2025-03-06 at 10.07.40 PM.png
 
Question from me, the latest noob. How much of the circled section is audible? These amps seem to excel in everything except this (and slightly with SINAD, of course).

View attachment 433919
We've had some lengthy threads about that around here. Here's one:


There's another linked in the second post in that thread.

TL;DR version: general consensus is that the nonlinearities at higher frequencies are not something to worry about and are not audible.
 
systematically tweaking values because 200W sounds better then 190W in the marketing is borderline scam
What exactly is the relevance of this in practice?
The efficiency of the connected speakers is much more important for the overall system.

The volume (sound pressure level, SPL) of a loudspeaker increases logarithmically with the power supplied. Doubling the power leads to a level increase of 3 dB. At loudspeakers with an efficiency of 88db, the difference is therefore only 0.2 dB - this is practically imperceptible.

10 watts more power is negligible for the volume. Doubling the power to 380 watts, on the other hand, would only result in an increase of 3 dB, which is barely audible.

These 10 watts are not a fraud, especially if you compare it with power specifications of 1000 watts pmpo on department store hi-fi.

Most people have completely unrealistic ideas about what amplifier power ratings mean in practice.
 
Back
Top Bottom