GabrielPhoto
Senior Member
- Joined
- Jul 14, 2020
- Messages
- 402
- Likes
- 216
Yeah a very classy post. I screenshot it lol
-
WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!
Tekton M-Lore Speaker Review
- Thread starter amirm
- Start date
DSJR
Major Contributor
This must be around ten years or so ago now, but a sound engineer (documentaries and so on) acquaintance of mine told me a tale of a small mastering studio he knew, that had an early set of these speakers and how good he thought they were at communicating the music - sadly the price all but doubles getting them here from the US and I think the product is quite a fair deal for $750pr - those bass-mid drivers can't be as cheap as the plastic chassis/soft plastic coned alternatives other makers often use..
Certainly in this test, the performance isn't so far from what I imagined and I bet there's many a small 'starter' passive speaker setup that would sound great with these floor-standers placed not too far from the wall behind them. Not everyone wants KH80's or similar stuck on tall 'stalks' and most away from here don't have desktop systems with an effin' huge monitor in between
No idea what some panel damping inside could do, or maybe tinkering a little with crossover frequencies if the tweeter can handle going down a little lower (not all can, especially cost-effective ones). I do feel there's a huge danger of wanting to do 'upgrades' on speakers like this and ending up getting something double the price and unrecognisable from the original...
P.S. Thirty years or so ago, TDL launched a cheapskate range called RTL (Reflex Transmission Line) and the middle model was the RTL2. The original version had an Elac made (I think) 6" driver with the small cloth dome Vifa tweeter (Rega and others used it too). Crossover was a four element or so type and these little floor-standers were basically a long ported cheap chipboard enclosure with 'bubble wrap' plastic film veneer, saved as the the RTL bit was a port at the bottom front, fed into a long 'port' which acted as a full width brace across the lower half of the enclosure. They used to sound amazing if a little bright, but it worked for us and our clients and we sold dozens of pairs at £250pr. I'm sure they measured okay too but there is one reprint I have which shows the response is absolutely dire!!! Thing is though, it was easy to get a really nice sound in the home from a more modest system which kept you listening for hours.
P.P.S. Another smallish floor-stander I got on well with at around five hundred quid the pair and got to know how to deal with their 'character' was the Rega Jura. I bet this latter would be a disaster if measured here (the later models are far more neutral), but again, designed for pleasurable listening at home, rather than forensic studio monitoring
Certainly in this test, the performance isn't so far from what I imagined and I bet there's many a small 'starter' passive speaker setup that would sound great with these floor-standers placed not too far from the wall behind them. Not everyone wants KH80's or similar stuck on tall 'stalks' and most away from here don't have desktop systems with an effin' huge monitor in between
No idea what some panel damping inside could do, or maybe tinkering a little with crossover frequencies if the tweeter can handle going down a little lower (not all can, especially cost-effective ones). I do feel there's a huge danger of wanting to do 'upgrades' on speakers like this and ending up getting something double the price and unrecognisable from the original...
P.S. Thirty years or so ago, TDL launched a cheapskate range called RTL (Reflex Transmission Line) and the middle model was the RTL2. The original version had an Elac made (I think) 6" driver with the small cloth dome Vifa tweeter (Rega and others used it too). Crossover was a four element or so type and these little floor-standers were basically a long ported cheap chipboard enclosure with 'bubble wrap' plastic film veneer, saved as the the RTL bit was a port at the bottom front, fed into a long 'port' which acted as a full width brace across the lower half of the enclosure. They used to sound amazing if a little bright, but it worked for us and our clients and we sold dozens of pairs at £250pr. I'm sure they measured okay too but there is one reprint I have which shows the response is absolutely dire!!! Thing is though, it was easy to get a really nice sound in the home from a more modest system which kept you listening for hours.
P.P.S. Another smallish floor-stander I got on well with at around five hundred quid the pair and got to know how to deal with their 'character' was the Rega Jura. I bet this latter would be a disaster if measured here (the later models are far more neutral), but again, designed for pleasurable listening at home, rather than forensic studio monitoring
- Joined
- Feb 10, 2024
- Messages
- 42
- Likes
- 10
Agreed. Yes, we do.
I think this is the first time I've actually thought about putting an IGNORE on an actual speaker designer. FWIW, while I don't really believe in rating speakers based on Amir's review, if pressed I'd give a 2.5 as in OK and could even consider a 3. It doesn't deserve a 1/Poor IMO. The problem is that Mr. Alexander is stuck in the past. Few if any makers will combine an 8 inch woofer with a flat tweeter combined with a simple crossover and a high crossover frequency. That was a standard formula in the 1970's and 80's. The few who do cater to the 'audiophile' crowd and I have no problem with that business model. Since many audiophiles typically came of age in that era this sound 'right' to them.
P.S. Per the old expression, you'll attract more flies with honey than vinegar so maybe you can just put ASR on 'IGNORE'.
P.S. Per the old expression, you'll attract more flies with honey than vinegar so maybe you can just put ASR on 'IGNORE'.
Last edited:
HetRegentDiamanten
Member
- Joined
- Apr 30, 2023
- Messages
- 7
- Likes
- 5
Where does the 'audio company' label come from ? Is that verified by email domain or something ? Are we sure this is the actual Tekton guy doing some very bad PR, not some other company/random troll ?
As I have mentioned before, there is a lot of talk with no substance. Still waiting on:
1) Why the measurements are "botched," how should it be measured and why
2) And based on what specifically is "audiophile" sound that these speakers are designed from, what makes a speaker to have audiophile sound?
I guess I can wait for this YouTube video to drop and see if there is any scientific substance on that video but I am willing to bet it will not.
1) Why the measurements are "botched," how should it be measured and why
2) And based on what specifically is "audiophile" sound that these speakers are designed from, what makes a speaker to have audiophile sound?
I guess I can wait for this YouTube video to drop and see if there is any scientific substance on that video but I am willing to bet it will not.
It is probably the Tekton owner Eric himself, and not someone posing as him. I remember him being combative with posters over on the AVS Forum a few years ago. I have no experience at all with listening to any Tekton speakers, but just from how he presented himself over on AVS it turned me off to Tekton Design as a company.
Reminds me of Ted Denney's temper tantrum with Gene at Audioholics. When one is exposed for bad or no science, of course their rebuttal isn't going to be science, because there weren't any to begin with, and if there were, they would eagerly rebut with the science.
I just double-checked to make sure I have my FACTS straight, and it was not AVS where I remembered reading Eric himself posting and being directly combative, but rather it was a situation with a Youtube reviewer named Ron who has a channel there called 'New Record Day'. He initially posted a not so favorable review of a Tekton speaker, and Eric started responding in the comments of that video. The whole thing blew up into a weird sort of "audio review scandal". You can read the summary of it here if you are so inclined. The video where this all took place with the comments is no longer on Youtube.
What I do remember from AVS were the various reports of issues in getting Tekton speakers delivered by promised delivery dates, not getting grills when they were paid for by customers, and other reports of communciations with Tekton that did not put the company in a favorable light in my eyes. These were early days of Tekton though, and I imagine those issues do not really exist anymore.
What I do remember from AVS were the various reports of issues in getting Tekton speakers delivered by promised delivery dates, not getting grills when they were paid for by customers, and other reports of communciations with Tekton that did not put the company in a favorable light in my eyes. These were early days of Tekton though, and I imagine those issues do not really exist anymore.
Below is a snippet quote from the link provided above:
"According to him Eric Alexander approached him and there was some sort of deal on the part of Tekton to pay for this review. . . . He also supposedly expressed the backlash 'if anyone ever found out about the payment for the review'. "
"Later Eric states this was all and attempt to expose Ron's paid reviews...by creating a speaker, sending it to Ron for review, paying him, having him criticize it, pulling the model, and then making comments about it on his channel? It just seems far too bizarre of a scenario, as Eric defends the speakers at times and claims Ron was doing measurements wrong on purpose, and then later claims it was all a ruse to expose Ron. Nothing adds up here."
This does not shine a good light on Mr. Alexander. If I were him, I would do what some other speaker manufacturers do, suck it up with bad reviews, go make some capital investment on tools such as an NFS, learn the proper speaker design techniques and create impeccable products. There was a recent review of a speaker manufacturer that did just that, and now they can't even keep up with orders, they are so busy, the owner is barely getting enough sleep each night and presumably has made all of his money back from his capital investment.
Yeesh, this thread has been an object lesson for vendors in how not to interact with prospects and influencers. I'd suggest:
- Engage constructively and substantively with the audience, avoid ad hominem.
- Don't lose your temper or get snitty. Don't be seen as YELLING. Avoid demeaning the core beliefs of the audience, but propose alternatives.
- Provide gentle encouragement and persuasion to give the product a try.
- If you can't maintain the composure suggested above, don't post.
- Don't threaten to sue first if you see a mistake, point out the problem specifically and ask for a retraction or revision long before considering any legal action. See if you can turn it into a positive. Threats will harden everyone's position.
- If you still have grounds to litigate, consider whom you are suing (a not-for-profit review site run by a recognized expert) and the PR costs of doing so vs just ignoring the bad press. Also consider what losing would mean.
- Finally, business litigation sucks for everyone.
Last edited:
GabrielPhoto
Senior Member
- Joined
- Jul 14, 2020
- Messages
- 402
- Likes
- 216
10000000%
This is a second-hand account with some very serious allegations in it. Yikes. Treat with caution.
Mr. Alexander seems confident that he can prove in the court of law that the science in which this review is based on is flaw, while offering none of his own. That the industry standard CEA 2034 method is "botched." Also that the industry gold standard precision measure tool used is inadequate.
Mr. Alexander needs to prove the above. . .which will cost him a pretty penny and if such feat were even to be possible.
He would need to refute the standards of measurement would he not? Like including the physics standards?
What I suspect is that, Mr. Alexander will ask his attorney to send a threatening letter to have ASR to remove this review. Usually that works because people get concerned when they see letters like that. If so, it's all bark no bite.
If Mr. Alexander does decide to really take this to court, I see two routes he can take, (1) hire experts (i.e. PhD in physics specializing in sound wave, or someone like Dr. Toole) to testify that the scientific results are fundamental wrong or the methods used were intentional botched to cause harm (2) prove the subjective portion of the review is meant to cause intentional harm.
Either route is an uphill battle.
Last edited:
I think any judge with a modicum of sensibility which should be all of them would toss that or at the least demand clear and factual proof that is impossible to provide. Otherwise it would be a judgment on what appears to be a probable truth as in non-criminal law and using a business case law approach somewhat like what would be encountered in a small claims court? (I have little law experience but have taken multiple cases to small claims court and won judgement each time.)
This being the USA, legal litigation center of the universe, I would not amplify this side of the topic too much. To me the weird thing is that the designer goes to battle over a speaker that does not seem to implement the main differentiator he's known for, that multi-array tweeter/midrange thing. Whatever Amir's takeaway is, hey, deal with it, and know that many of us in ASR can take or leave Amir's final, personal recommendation - we know what his personal preferences and triggers are, and that section in the review does not necessarily reflect only measurements. And it's OK.
Similar threads
