"Stand Subwoofers" like the Genelec W371, Kii BXT, etc. Ideally with DSP & Multi-Drivers

[pierre]

pmc : I don’t know if the sound is good but they are imposing.

 

[stevenswall]

Genelec 8030C + Genelec 7040A
View attachment 95071

I wonder if after GLM that sounds almost identical to the 8350 with more SPL?

 

[stevenswall]

View attachment 95088
pmc : I don’t know if the sound is good but they are imposing.

What model is that? Is there a driver on the back or just the one?

 

[bunnyfuzz]

I wonder if after GLM that sounds almost identical to the 8350 with more SPL?

These are just "Classic" models. GLM is not compatible with these. Room correction is via dip switches and dual subs evening out room modes.

 

[Sprint]

These are just "Classic" models. GLM is not compatible with these. Room correction is via dip switches and dual subs evening out room modes.

Do you use any correction for subs?

 

[bunnyfuzz]

Do you use any correction for subs?

No, I don't. Just plug and play, and I don't fret too much over it since it sounds very good as is.

 

[Sprint]

No, I don't. Just plug and play, and I don't fret too much over it since it sounds very good as is.

Thanks! I guess the cross over is then handled in your subs, correct? From what I see, the signal is notebook -> subs -> monitors. correct?

 

[bunnyfuzz]

Thanks! I guess the cross over is then handled in your subs, correct? From what I see, the signal is notebook -> subs -> monitors. correct?

Yes, the crossover is in the Genelec subs (85 Hz). Source is Mac > Apple USB C dongle (£8) > 3.5mm to stereo XLR's > TC Electronic Level Pilot > Genelec 7040's > Genelec 8030's. A three-way system that goes down to 30 Hz (-6dB). All for less than £1600 excluding the computer.

https://www.genelec.com/7040a
https://www.genelec.com/8030c

 

[digitalfrost]

If DIY is an option, building something like this is fairly easy. I'm currently looking into it I found these Scan Speak chassis which are available in 10" and 12" with a fitting passive radiator:

https://www.scan-speak.dk/product/26w-4558t00/
https://www.scan-speak.dk/product/30w-4558t00/

Here is an example of implementation: http://www.troelsgravesen.dk/26W-4558T00.htm

You could simply build the cabinets higher or even use two chassis per side. Or make them less deep and put the passive membrane on the front to get more height (while keeping volume equal).

 

[Frank Dernie]

What model is that? Is there a driver on the back or just the one?

The add on sub here is just a second transmission line cabinet as the main MB2 speaker but without the mid and tweeter making it a MB3

 

[Sprint]

Yes, the crossover is in the Genelec subs (85 Hz). Source is Mac > Apple USB C dongle (£8) > 3.5mm to stereo XLR's > TC Electronic Level Pilot > Genelec 7040's > Genelec 8030's. A three-way system that goes down to 30 Hz (-6dB). All for less than £1600 excluding the computer.

https://www.genelec.com/7040a
https://www.genelec.com/8030c

yep the sound quality thrashing a 5 times more expensive speakers.

 

[richard12511]

I really like the idea of the W371, and I plan to order a couple someday to go under my 8351s. I don't consider the W371 as a "stand subwoofer", though. I suppose you could call it that, but "stand subwoofer" is somewhat of an oxymoron in my eyes .

A true subwoofer(in my view), should only be playing sub 100Hz content, so that way it can be moved around the room independently to generate the most accurate response, without the fear of it being localized. The W371 performs well much higher in the frequency range than typical subwoofers, but to use that capability, you have to co-locate it with the front speakers.

Also the W371A only extends (-6) to 23Hz, and I generally look for (-3)16-18Hz extension. Very little music has sub 20Hz content, but it does exist, and it's an awesome feeling to listen to at high volumes.

I view the W371 essentially as a way to turn your Genelec stand mount speakers into Genelec tower speakers. Instead of selling a Revel Gem2 and Revel Salon2 in the same speaker line, Genelec just sells a Gem2, with the option of converting it into a Salon2 as a separate charge.

Whenever I do purchase the W371s, I'll treat the 8351 + W371 as a single speaker, and still cross it over to real subwoofers below 80Hz or so.

 

[onion]

Unfortunately, cardioide dispersion does not help you much in the room's resonating area. Standing waves will build up energy while bouncing around and will ignore the dispersion characteristics because there's no longer any controlled directivity to stop it once the initial wave hits the walls and reflects. In the resonating area the steady-state response is the best metric to use as a visual aid to see what we hear, and in the same steady-state response even Kii and the like will suffer from the same room-behavior as other speakers. Here's a few examples with the Kii;

View attachment 60177
https://www.stereophile.com/content/kii-audio-three-loudspeaker-measurements


View attachment 60178
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/high-end/1048540-kii-three-have-you-heard-them-23.html#post12588247


I have a ton of measurements demonstrating the same thing in my own room with Kii and other speakers. Differences can of course be seen, but they are completely dwarfed by the evilness of the room and could mostly be explained by small differences in placements.
Above about 200 hz the effects will begin to show.

Don't take this as criticism of Kii or any other cardioide speakers because it isn't.

Although I didn't take any measurements, I found the Kii three bass too difficult to control (boomy) in my small room. I put this down to the room, not the Kii three which I suspect sounds sensational in the right sort of room. My room. really needs flexible placement of low frequency emitters.

 

[Purité Audio]

You didn’t use the Kiis built in peq?
Keith

 

[onion]

I did but the result was not satisfactory (too little bass or too boomy with no happy medium). The right side of the front part of the room is too ‘enclosed’ as it has a bricked-over chimney stack on the side wall protruding out.

 

[Purité Audio]

I find them one of if not the most easily configured, boundary filters/peq and then the included baxendale filters.
Keith

 

[richard12511]

My room. really needs flexible placement of low frequency emitters.

I'd say the same is true for the vast majority of rooms.

 

[stevenswall]

I really like the idea of the W371, and I plan to order a couple someday to go under my 8351s. I don't consider the W371 as a "stand subwoofer", though. I suppose you could call it that, but "stand subwoofer" is somewhat of an oxymoron in my eyes .

A true subwoofer(in my view), should only be playing sub 100Hz content, so that way it can be moved around the room independently to generate the most accurate response, without the fear of it being localized. The W371 performs well much higher in the frequency range than typical subwoofers, but to use that capability, you have to co-locate it with the front speakers.

Also the W371A only extends (-6) to 23Hz, and I generally look for (-3)16-18Hz extension. Very little music has sub 20Hz content, but it does exist, and it's an awesome feeling to listen to at high volumes.

I view the W371 essentially as a way to turn your Genelec stand mount speakers into Genelec tower speakers. Instead of selling a Revel Gem2 and Revel Salon2 in the same speaker line, Genelec just sells a Gem2, with the option of converting it into a Salon2 as a separate charge.

Whenever I do purchase the W371s, I'll treat the 8351 + W371 as a single speaker, and still cross it over to real subwoofers below 80Hz or so.

Pretty sure that -6 at 23hz figure is in an anechoic chamber... My 8260 is quoted as 29Hz - 20 kHz +/-1dB, but in a room it's flat to about 18hz, and I'll be the W371 can do that at higher SPLs. That would be crazy to listen to though, but I'm curious how GLM would work with the W371 and subwoofers... Seems like you'd want to cross the subs over more around 40hz to allow the w371 to do its directional bass as low as possible before giving up and going to an omni sub.

Note: If the w371 is best used as a midbass module to increase SPL... My god, Genelec is a lost cause for anyone who isn't an SPL chaser. Praying that's not true and they don't continue to follow the crowd trying to push for higher SPLs at all costs to enable studios and theaters to destroy generations of art and hearing.

 

[Count Arthur]

 

[JustJones]

Genelec 8040b on a Rythmik FM8 and Minidsp with Dirac?