Revel M106 Bookshelf Speaker Review

[azzy_mazzy]

Well as I said a selection of folks and to wit not all agree and would never expect or wish for that. Just to many different needs out there.
And thanks I had not heard of BlieSma.
Not sure if I like beryllium yet though.
I am looking for a tweeter that has no or very minimal breakup. Even well past hearing thresh-holds. As strange as it may seem, I am becoming aware that possibly those breakup modes are part of what doesn't work for me in a long term speaker.
Anecdotally, as an example... My Gf starting to feel sick on the couch while I did some ultra sonic testing (20k+), she had no idea what I doing and there where no audible sounds. Took all of 1 minute for this to happen and I also did not feel so hot. I have noticed some speakers I feel really good listening to (like a sound bath) and others, while I might enjoy them sonically I don't get that same good feeling and even sometime start to feel agitated.
Who knows, total conjecture right now.

couldn't you use a LPF above 20K?

 

[q3cpma]

What I find interesting, is that besides the KEF R3 losing bass output at ~120Hz and the difference of directivity, it is better in most every way by looking at all the graphs, yet even with the room mode correction, the listening impression was not as enthusiastic:

Mono testing overwhelmingly favours wide dispersion designs.

 

[HooStat]

I wonder what the Beryllium version of this one gets you. Twice the price but they appear to be very similar.

 

[azzy_mazzy]

Do you have a 1 Watt amp or something lol? Or just want to do permanent hearing damage with less power?

less need for a powerful amp, handles peaks better, can play in bigger rooms without fearing of over driving the speakers. also i watch a lot of movies most of them are in relatively normal listening levels but sometimes you listen a little louder and reach reference levels and i don't want for my speakers to stop me.

 

[MZKM]

less need for a powerful amp, handles peaks better, can play in bigger rooms without fearing of over driving the speakers. also i watch a lot of movies most of them are in relatively normal listening levels but sometimes you listen a little louder and reach reference levels and i don't want for my speakers to stop me.

88dB is fine for movies in most rooms.

12ft away and 50W would give you ~105dB.

That’s reference, I listen usually with ~100dB peaks, so ~15W. But I do occasionally go to reference.

Unless you use tube or Class-A amps, no one really needs >90dB sensitivity. In fact that could even be an issue for a lot of people as you would need an amp with a low noise floor (high SNR) or else you will get hissing.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

That makes sense to me.

The odd thing is my current selah speakers with beryllium tweeters, measure flat at the LP, yet I still don't find them as bright or sharp as any of the speakers I mentioned. I run them with a low q peq to create a 1db slope and that gets the tonality just right.

The interesting thing is that they have a 2.5db depressions centered at 2500hz. I think this helps with their smooth natural warm sound but they don't sound muddy. If I fix the depression with peq it still doesn't cause any of the wincing or fatigue I get with other speakers. Not entirely sure what's special about these speakers...

I'm gonna take your advice and try and roll.ofnthe top end even more and see what happens.

You also have to keep in mind that hearing is cumulative so if a driver has a bit longer delay this might make it sound more prominent to the ear even though it is not visible on freq response. Possibly this is why ribbons in hf are less offending (plus low thd)

 

[ROOSKIE]

couldn't you use a LPF above 20K?

Yes.
However it is easier if the system doesn't need that. It is hard to measure up there. I mean I could use some crazy high order crossover to be sure of the cut of course. In any case, yes the filter is an option.
Maybe even cut it at 15k.

 

[azzy_mazzy]

88dB is fine for movies in most rooms.

12ft away and 50W would give you ~105dB.

That’s reference, I listen usually with ~100dB peaks, so ~15W. But I do occasionally go to reference.

Unless you use tube or Class-A amps, no one really needs >90dB sensitivity. In fact that could even be an issue for a lot of people as you would need an amp with a low noise floor (high SNR) or else you will get hissing.

are sure about that? 88+10log(50) = 105dB but that is from one meter(3.28feet) away not 12 feet away, in my room i lose around 5-7db (not 100% accurate) at MLP so i need 150-250 watts(not going to happen).

 

[MZKM]

are sure about that? 88+10log(50) = 105dB but that is from one meter(3.28feet) away not 12 feet away, in my room i lose around 5-7db (not 100% accurate) at MLP so i need 150-250 watts(not going to happen).

Assuming room gain of 3dB.

 

[Thomas_A]

Indeed. Yet what I miss is exactly what I am getting in M106. If it is frequency response difference, we better damn try to find it as my impression of these two speakers is worlds apart.

Worlds apart indicates very different. Scientifically you should aim for a blind test to verify this.

 

[617]

I don't know that I'd call it the best tweeter ever. There are a lot of other excellent options to choose from. If you haven't seen or heard of BlieSma tweeters, you need to check them out. Incredibly linear on-axis response, high sensitivity and great directivity. Especially their Beryllium version.
http://www.bliesma.de/products.html

It's among the better tweeters for the money but there are a lot of good units in that price bracket from Peerless, Dayton and SB acoustics.

Do you know if transducer labs is back?

 

[azzy_mazzy]

Assuming room gain of 3dB.

still could be not enough for my room (i need to re do my testing), also no revel bookshelf has 88db Sensitivity.

 

[MZKM]

still could be not enough for my room (i need to re do my testing), also no revel bookshelf has 88db Sensitivity.

Woops, I guess I wasn’t paying attention, 50W was for 100dB. This is also considering mono, which is important for the center channel, but the left/right are playing 90% the same content.

 

[hardisj]

It's among the better tweeters for the money but there are a lot of good units in that price bracket from Peerless, Dayton and SB acoustics.

Do you know if transducer labs is back?

Man, I didn't even realize they were "gone". I've been out of the DIY game for about a year.

 

[MattHooper]

https://hometheaterhifi.com/reviews...ookshelf-monitor-loudspeaker-review-part-one/

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From Amir's review and the Home Theater Hi Fi review, this is clearly a truly excellent speaker!

I'd love to hear the M106 and would boogie down to my local Revel dealer to hear it, if we weren't in pandemic!

(Though I note my local Revel dealer has now switched from the Revel line to the new B&W speaker line instead. Bummer!).

BTW, reading through Amir's reviews, and especially the mind-numbing detail of the Home Theater review above, I have to laugh whenever audiophiles say "We are in this for the music! It's all about the music!" Ha. No, we have to admit the obvious: Audiophiles are gear-heads in one way or another, hypnotized by the technology.

And there's nothing wrong with that.

 

[restorer-john]

I have these and Infinity IL10

Time to pull the IL10s off the wall and do a sound preference check?

Best way to AB them ?

Use an amplifier with A/B speaker terminals and put one Revel speaker on the left channel, one Infinity on the right. Level match the speakers with say pink noise using the balance/gain controls on the amplifier.

Playing a mono source with one of each speaker side by side (single speaker of each) you can instantly switch between them using the A/B switch.

 

[McFly]

Even a lot of entry level AVRs have speakers terminals A and B or "Zone B" outputs which can work similarly

 

[napilopez]

Thanks Amir! Looks like a standout speaker.

Revel M106 ASR vs Harman Spin comparison, corrected the ER curves from the NFS for the Harman-style computation. Omitted the on-axis for graph intelligibility:

Good agreement up to about 4-5kHz, after which Harman shows about 2dB more energy. I think this has happened with a few of the Revels, I wonder what's up with that, especially after the super-old infinity showed basically perfect agreement.

Edit: And here's the M106 vs the IL10 (Listening Window in white)

You can see the relative lack of energy in the upper mids in the IL10, but idk if enough to explain Amir's different impressions.

 

[azzy_mazzy]

Even a lot of entry level AVRs have speakers terminals A and B or "Zone B" outputs which can work similarly

i remember that being slow switching. the faster the amp can switch the better people are at noticing differences.

 

[Senior NEET Engineer]

88dB is fine for movies in most rooms.

12ft away and 50W would give you ~105dB.

That’s reference, I listen usually with ~100dB peaks, so ~15W. But I do occasionally go to reference.

Unless you use tube or Class-A amps, no one really needs >90dB sensitivity. In fact that could even be an issue for a lot of people as you would need an amp with a low noise floor (high SNR) or else you will get hissing.

Sensitivity is not that useful imo. It only considers >300hz yet most power demand is going to be below 300hz especially for home theater. Below 300hz the distance is not going to matter compared to the size of the room. For a living room there might not be much especially with the large open area and high ratio of window vs wall surface area. Then even if you have all the power you need, you'll have to consider whether the woofer is happy with it.