Revel M105 Bookshelf Speaker Review

[AudioKC]

After 6 weeks I am surprised how much better these speakers sound as they break in. They sounded great out of the box but the off-axis and low listening levels are excellent. The clarity let’s me listen at low levels and I can still hear everything.

I added a second subwoofer yesterday so there is one underneath each speaker now almost making them 3-ways.

Great! I'm enjoying them as well.

About sub placement, this is not the best placement for subs. Comb filter from front wall giving you a cancelation in 35-50hz somewhere, a big dip in 5-8db... If you have ability to measure, just check it. It's better to move second sub dynamic in a place with different distance from front wall.

Anyhow, I did not want to make your enjoyment any less valuable. But it is something that I encountered lately, sub bass cancelation from front wall.

 

[AudioKC]

An example of my measurement. See the deep in 46-50hz for about 7db. You can solve it with second sub, by placing it differently than the first one.

 

[anotherhobby]

About sub placement, this is not the best placement for subs. Comb filter from front wall giving you a cancelation in 35-50hz somewhere, a big dip in 5-8db... If you have ability to measure, just check it. It's better to move second sub dynamic in a place with different distance from front wall.

This depends on your definition of "best placement." I have dual subs under my M105's as well in my near field setup. I can hear where my subs are located with an 80 Hz crossover when listening to music. Having the subs anywhere other than under/inline with the mains in my near field setup sounds worse, because the lower bass is not coming from the same space as the mid/upper bass, and I can hear it. Measurements mean nothing here, because it's a subjective human experience. It's not just frequency, it's location as well. I think that subs that are balanced in line with the stereo image sound better and more natural when listening to music, even if you could get the frequency response to measure "better" somewhere else in the room.

 

[Chromatischism]

Great! I'm enjoying them as well.

About sub placement, this is not the best placement for subs. Comb filter from front wall giving you a cancelation in 35-50hz somewhere, a big dip in 5-8db... If you have ability to measure, just check it. It's better to move second sub dynamic in a place with different distance from front wall.

Anyhow, I did not want to make your enjoyment any less valuable. But it is something that I encountered lately, sub bass cancelation from front wall.

Right. The best place for subs is against the wall, where you completely avoid the problem.

 

[Chromatischism]

This depends on your definition of "best placement." I have dual subs under my M105's as well in my near field setup. I can hear where my subs are located with an 80 Hz crossover when listening to music. Having the subs anywhere other than under/inline with the mains in my near field setup sounds worse, because the lower bass is not coming from the same space as the mid/upper bass, and I can hear it. Measurements mean nothing here, because it's a subjective human experience. It's not just frequency, it's location as well. I think that subs that are balanced in line with the stereo image sound better and more natural when listening to music, even if you could get the frequency response to measure "better" somewhere else in the room.

Measurements can show it, but you need to take the right measurements. I can clearly see the problem when I do a speakers+subs measurement and disconnect the speakers. The rolloff isn't fast enough and you get audible sound beyond even 200 Hz from the sub.

You have good ears since you're picking up on it, but it isn't what you think

 

[YSC]

An example of my measurement. See the deep in 46-50hz for about 7db. You can solve it with second sub, by placing it differently than the first one.

sometimes I just wonders, in multiple sub, say I use dual sub with high pass for each channel, in 2.1 setup I only need to set up one sub, level match it with the channels and it's done and fine, but in dual sub, will I need to lower the second sub for the volume match? I would imagine if I connect sub L to L channel, sub R to R speaker, with each of it individually matching the main spaker, wouldn't sub 2 fill in the null of sub 1 but at half the volume?

 

[Elk]

2 subs gives very good results when placed at mid points on opposite walls, in my case front and back walls. I have experimented with other placements for long periods of time and return to this arrangement. Yes, if I move to the back wall, I can localize the sub there, but, maybe because it is nearly 10' behind the listening position, I am not aware of its output when seated in my listening positions, just smooth bass throughout the area. I refer you to section 4 paragraph 3 of the following research paper:

https://audioroundtable.com/misc/Welti_Multisub.pdf

 

[YSC]

2 subs gives very good results when placed at mid points on opposite walls, in my case front and back walls. I have experimented with other placements for long periods of time and return to this arrangement. Yes, if I move to the back wall, I can localize the sub there, but, maybe because it is nearly 10' behind the listening position, I am not aware of its output when seated in my listening positions, just smooth bass throughout the area. I refer you to section 4 paragraph 3 of the following research paper:

https://audioroundtable.com/misc/Welti_Multisub.pdf

that sounds great, I was wondering how to optimize the level of each sub to the main monitor, with LFE channel or with say, dac->sub with high pass-> main monitors, I was kind of wondering if using dual sub, the sensitivity/volume of the subs should be halved or just keep the same as using only single sub.

 

[Elkerton]

I’m sorry. I can’t help you with that. I use Audyssey DSP, and it does it automatically.

 

[AudioKC]

Right. The best place for subs is against the wall, where you completely avoid the problem.

You have distance of cabinet. Which makes dynamic be not against the wall. It’s the reason for my deep in 40hz. To know that you don’t have that problem you have to measure at home. Otherwise it is all wishful thinking unfortunately.

 

[AudioKC]

This depends on your definition of "best placement." I have dual subs under my M105's as well in my near field setup. I can hear where my subs are located with an 80 Hz crossover when listening to music. Having the subs anywhere other than under/inline with the mains in my near field setup sounds worse, because the lower bass is not coming from the same space as the mid/upper bass, and I can hear it. Measurements mean nothing here, because it's a subjective human experience. It's not just frequency, it's location as well. I think that subs that are balanced in line with the stereo image sound better and more natural when listening to music, even if you could get the frequency response to measure "better" somewhere else in the room.

I will test it (stereo placement or somewhere placement) after getting my second Monolith THX sub and Dirac Bass Control.

This probably solvable by 3-4 subs

 

[Chromatischism]

You have distance of cabinet. Which makes dynamic be not against the wall. It’s the reason for my deep in 40hz. To know that you don’t have that problem you have to measure at home. Otherwise it is all wishful thinking unfortunately.

Yeah, I eliminated the cabinet so I could have perfect bass. Worth it

 

[Narnian]

I still have the subs next to the M105s on each side and they sound fantastic - upgraded the subs from 8” Kantos to 12” SVS SB-1000. Jazz never sounded so good.

Using the Denon X3800H and Audyssey showed only a 10db dip around 40Hz and Audyssey cleaned that right up. My room has lots of furniture and rounded log walls so reflections are greatly dispersed so sub placement seems to have less of an impact than a room with flat walls.

Still looking for a final amp to run the M105s on and one I have not tested is a Class D one like NAD. Do they match well with the Revel speakers? I believe those are essentially Hypex designs now. Also curious about the Cambridge CXA85 amp as well.

 

[DMill]

I still have the subs next to the M105s on each side and they sound fantastic - upgraded the subs from 8” Kantos to 12” SVS SB-1000. Jazz never sounded so good.

Using the Denon X3800H and Audyssey showed only a 10db dip around 40Hz and Audyssey cleaned that right up. My room has lots of furniture and rounded log walls so reflections are greatly dispersed so sub placement seems to have less of an impact than a room with flat walls.

Still looking for a final amp to run the M105s on and one I have not tested is a Class D one like NAD. Do they match well with the Revel speakers? I believe those are essentially Hypex designs now. Also curious about the Cambridge CXA85 amp as well.

The Revels should be fine regardless of your amp. I have heard your speakers with a NAD388 I think? Or something in that line. Sounded good to me. Any good amp with the power you need is going to sound great. Even a bad amp with those speakers and subs is going to be better than you think. Might need room correction if you move away from an AVR?

 

[Narnian]

The Revels should be fine regardless of your amp. I have heard your speakers with a NAD388 I think? Or something in that line. Sounded good to me. Any good amp with the power you need is going to sound great. Even a bad amp with those speakers and subs is going to be better than you think. Might need room correction if you move away from an AVR?

Most stereo systems don’t have room correction (except for expensive ones). I would probably upgrade the subs from the SB-1000 to the SB-100 Pro to add profiles with the DSP app to manage the bass between the two systems.

 

[AudioKC]

I still have the subs next to the M105s on each side and they sound fantastic - upgraded the subs from 8” Kantos to 12” SVS SB-1000. Jazz never sounded so good.

Using the Denon X3800H and Audyssey showed only a 10db dip around 40Hz and Audyssey cleaned that right up. My room has lots of furniture and rounded log walls so reflections are greatly dispersed so sub placement seems to have less of an impact than a room with flat walls.

Still looking for a final amp to run the M105s on and one I have not tested is a Class D one like NAD. Do they match well with the Revel speakers? I believe those are essentially Hypex designs now. Also curious about the Cambridge CXA85 amp as well.

I’m using Hypex Ncore 252MP with Revel and I like it.

 

[Reed]

Finally got my “mini theater” with M105 and C205 rolling. Currently using an old Marantz NR1506 and a Pioneer sub. This is a new extension to our den. In fact, we still have painters and other trades in the room but I couldn’t wait. The front wall is 15’ wide. 10’ ceiling. I’ll upgrade the AVR, sub and will add rears in-ceiling. Wires were run during construction. So far so good. I use Genelec 8030c in another room so the Revels aren’t that different from what I’m used to. I wanted a big upgrade from the old soundbar but I didn’t want the equipment to dominate the room. Happy listener.

 

[Chromatischism]

Nice, now get some absorption on the walls behind those speakers!

 

[Narnian]

Got a Cambridge CXA81 to try and it is clearly the best sounding amp I have ever heard. It is also the first toroidal amp I have ever tried as well. It does match very well with the Revel M105s.

it is also one of the most frustrating. Ergonomically whomever designed the useless display, the flakey remote and the touchy power knob seemed to have forgotten that people are going to use this thing. Unless I find something better I can live lwith the bad design because the sound is so good.

Anybody have an experience with the Arcam SA20? It seems to be slight better in features and it looks better ergonomically.

 

[Narnian]

My final evaluation was the Cambridge CXA81 versus the Arcam SA20. The CXA81 had a slight edge on loud playing and rock but the SA20 won on mid-low volumes and did better with jazz and folk. Classical was a tie. Also I used no subs for testing and the Arcam SA20 seemed a little tighter and the CXA81 a bit beefier. Apart from the ergonomics it was very similar and I would have been probably just as happy with either one but when the wife piped in I now have an excuse if I ever want to replace it …

Currently listening to Dave Brubeck at a moderate volume and boy does it sound great on my Revel M105s - very happy.

The Cambridge has been returned. And since the sale at Crutchfield is off they can resell it for $200 more than I paid as a scratch and dent.