Neumann KH 150 Monitor Review

[Trell]

[snip images]
Realistically how much louder is the KH310 vs KH150?

Max SPL vs frequency from soundandrecording.de reviews.

 

[SlothRock]

@amirm I know you don’t rate performance based off of price but I know you’ve heard and measured both the KH 120 and 150. If the application was just desktop music listening on your computer, is the performance that much better to justify a $3500 purchase when you already own the KH120 or is the performance increase to $$ ratio not worth the upgrade in your opinion?

 

[oversky]

@amirm I know you don’t rate performance based off of price but I know you’ve heard and measured both the KH 120 and 150. If the application was just desktop music listening on your computer, is the performance that much better to justify a $3500 purchase when you already own the KH120 or is the performance increase to $$ ratio not worth the upgrade in your opinion?

KH 150 is not suited for computer desktop, as Neumann suggested.

 

[enricoclaudio]

KH 150 is not suited for computer desktop, as Neumann suggested.

The KH150 is a near field monitor so it's totally suitable for desktop use. The "laptop" icon you have marked with red box means "portable" which in the case of the KH150 is totally right as the size and weight could be a limitation for many but on the other hand, the "iMac" icon shown on the KH120 and KH150 means "Desktop" use. The only limitation I see for the KH150 is the size of your desk and distance from listening position.

 

[Pearljam5000]

It's a lot bigger than i thought lol

 

[fuzzychaos]

View attachment 249607View attachment 249608
It's a lot bigger than i thought lol

The white looks great.

 

[oversky]

The KH150 is a near field monitor so it's totally suitable for desktop use. The "laptop" icon you have marked with red box means "portable" which in the case of the KH150 is totally right as the size and weight could be a limitation for many but on the other hand, the "iMac" icon shown on the KH120 and KH150 means "Desktop" use. The only limitation I see for the KH150 is the size of your desk and distance from listening position.

Hovering the mouse on the icon shows "Computer Desktop".
As to the distance, KH 150 is the same as KH 120
Recommended listening distance starts from 1 .0 m
Min listening distance starts from 0 .75 m

 

[danbei]

At which SPL levels do you want to listen?

I usually listen between 60 dB(C) and 75 dB(C) at ~1m. But this does not change my previous statement, which was only about max output matching.
I use one KH 750 and it has clipped a few times on bass heavy material, even at those level that might be considered not that high: the KH 750 does not get really loud.

 

[CMB]

I usually listen between 60 dB(C) and 75 dB(C) at ~1m. But this does not change my previous statement, which was only about max output matching.
I use one KH 750 and it has clipped a few times on bass heavy material, even at those level that might be considered not that high: the KH 750 does not get really loud.

Could be said that the limitations of the KH750 is a weakness of the KH150?

 

[voodooless]

Could be said that the limitations of the KH750 is a weakness of the KH150?

How? The KH150 just has higher SPL capability than a single KH750 (within their respective bandwidths). It just can’t keep up.

 

[Sokel]

How? The KH150 just has higher SPL capability than a single KH750 (within their respective bandwidths). It just can’t keep up.

They probably follow the principle that a sub is to add range,not SPL.

 

[voodooless]

They probably follow the principle that a sub is to add range,not SPL.

Well then, use a 3” sub. You can EQ it to 20 Hz flat. It just won’t go very loud. It still don’t see how one could blame the KH150 for that failure?

 

[Sokel]

Well then, use a 3” sub. You can EQ it to 20 Hz flat. It just won’t go very loud. It still don’t see how one could blame the KH150 for that failure?

I don't blame it at all,just pointing out that this is the right way (not 3" of course,it must at least match the satelites better still with a 3-way so the usual 100-200Hz hole not to exist and have the midbass who distinguishes the "big" sound).

 

[Pearljam5000]

Doesn't it makes more sense to go for the KH310 instead of getting the KH150 + subs?

 

[Sokel]

Doesn't it makes more sense to go for the KH310 instead of getting the KH150 + subs?

That's what audiocheck net states about subs.And I think it's the right way to see it.

 

[voodooless]

Doesn't it makes more sense to go for the KH310 instead of getting the KH150 + subs?

Maybe? SPL capabilities between the KH310 and KH150 (excluding the sub) are very similar:

Vs

Only below 50 Hz you’ll gain a bit with the KH310 because it’s a closed design. But as you see above, the SPL capabilities diminish quickly even there. Probably good for close range monitoring. Not to fill a room with a decent 30 Hz.

 

[hege]

Doesn't it makes more sense to go for the KH310 instead of getting the KH150 + subs?

For bass I would just go for 1032C..

 

[DJBonoBobo]

Doesn't it makes more sense to go for the KH310 instead of getting the KH150 + subs?

AFAIK, you have an untreated 3x4m room, very little interest in getting a subwoofer and even less interest and no experience in room acoustics or doing measurements in your room.

Also, you want a cheap, but state of the art system. Your dream speakers are the Genelec 8361, but they are too expensive. You are looking into other Genelec options, but they are also expensive and have drawbacks, like the more limited bass capability of the smaller Ones.

Because of this, i think for you the KH150 + MA1 would be better than the KH310.

• I expect it to be way easier for you to get the KH150 + MA1 sound "right" in your room because of better directivity and the automatic alignment.
• If you are getting the KH310 without the KH750+MA1, it will be difficult in your room - i think i know what i´m talking about. I think you will probably be disappointed.
• If you don´t believe it, try for yourself, like @thewas wrote.
• The KH150 is "state of the art" in the sense that it is currently the best in class product without any reasonable compromises or important drawbacks (that i know of). You can tell everyone you have a system in your room close to what´s possible within reasonable borders. It surely is "good enough" for every realistic pro or non-pro use case in a small room.
• You can make a good start for around 3,400 EUR (2 KH150+MA1 using bundle options), but you could easily add 1 or 2 KH750 later, if needed (i suspect so). So, for around 5,000 EUR you can get a fullrange system, that is very close to what´s possible in a small room. Most importantly, you may get out of your obsessive (sorry, but this is how it looks) loop of searching for "the" best speaker.
• From there on, the most important limiting factor is the room itself. A lot can be achieved with treatments, though.
• If you want it to be even better, you´d have to invest much more money: e.g. for a Genelec One (+GLM and Sub) system, a multisub system or something like Kii or D&D 8c. I don´t know any of those speakers, but i doubt any of this will be worth it in a small room like yours.

Looks familiar?
17 people liked this answer i gave to you on Sept. 17th. Did you ever read any of the answers you got?

 

[changer]

If it's so irrelevant than why is Genelec using mostly aluminum?

When Genelec introduced their new MDE aluminium enclosures after they had been working with rounded cabinets already in the 90s, it happened after the great-greatuncle of one of the founding fathers had visited his great-grandchild at the headquarters:

He told the story how when in German war captivity, he had to work the big forges that produced the aluminium forgings enabling German air superiority at the early phase, when the Reich was still doing relatively well -> youtu.be/hpgK51w6uhk Devoid of iron ore and so many decisive resources, this relatively small, lunatic state still managed to squeeze out maximum military performance out of inferior metals. Deeply impressed, the great-grandchild retold this a couple of times at lunch break and the story soon began circulating in the higher management of Genelec. A plan was created how to seize world market domination with aluminum castings.

Neumann, however, was not uninformed about this episode of engineering history either. However, they decided against the use of such a technology. Why? Well, technology is not neutral! A truly antifascist company, that states in its corporate mission it is striving for world peace, social and economic justice (as well as unlimited economic growth), they are deeply critical to advance with any Nazi technology and hence chose a different manufacturing approach.

All of this is true, you can ask their leading engineers.

 

[CMB]

Doesn't it makes more sense to go for the KH310 instead of getting the KH150 + subs?

The global Neumann offer, for me is really a dilemma:

KH420 = Such an extremly good perfect speaker.
No in-house DSP on board; such a shame (no white / nor aluminium (just a running gag));
In-house solution, none (KH750 doesn't suit).

Alternative A :
KH310 = Only horizontal use; not full range/nor DSP on board.
KH750 would help here, but their SPL would be a limiting factor as it seems below.

From the Neumann site:​

KH 750 DSP/AES67 Maximum SPL at 1m (Red: 10% THD, Green: 3% THD, Blue: 1% THD)​

NEW Alternative B (Game changer?):
KH150 = again a "state of the art" Neumann speaker + with DSP on-board!
Available in white!!! (though no aluminium (still running gag))
Let me buy it, no wait, can I make it full-range with an in-house solution?
KH850 wouldn't work with DSP.
KH750; and we have the same SPL limitation as above again.

Note :
I am not desperate, I have a pair of 8361 now.
But I also have other rooms, family and friends that would love to see alternatives to Genelec ;-).
Just trying to hint Neumann towards a coherent system (toolbox).