NAD M33 Streaming Amplifier Review

[Hoeksel]

Have you also checked the following points?:

LCD Temporary Display:
Enabled mode will turn off display temporarily after 1 minute of non-user interface.

GROUND TERMINAL:
The M33 can be connected to ground by connecting a ground lead wire or similar to this terminal.

Just tried the LCD Temporary Display option, no change in coil noise at all.

 

[jaymusic]

Just tried the LCD Temporary Display option, no change in coil noise at all.

Same
Screen makes no difference - off or on.
Mine is Uk spec - so 240V
How would one go about using the ground connection??

 

[fcracer]

I think NAD thinks I expect to much from a 5500 euro unit ;-).

You should see what Apple thinks about the same issue on their Mac Studio computers. The high pitch noise (around 2.2kHz) from the power supply of those is even less excusable given Apple’s unlimited R&D budget.

 

[pogo]

How would one go about using the ground connection??

In germany, we do this usually via a 'Potentialausgleichsschiene'
I do not have these problems and therefore have not tried ground connection.

 

[likehifi]

I have an issue with my M33 that I’m hoping somebody could check on their system. I recently noticed that it’s cutting off the first few notes of a song, about a second or so, when choosing to play a song through BluOS. If you choose that same song again, it plays it fine but if you then choose a different song from a different album, the issue happens again. This also seems to happen with a different source connected through coaxial or optical input. But playing through Roon is fine, AirPlay also works well. I’m on the latest version of firmware and I have also performed Factory Reset and reinstalled the firmware but the issue is still there.

The post quoted is quite old now. Can anyone confirm that the issue has been fixed by now?

 

[jaymusic]

I have taken my M33 back to Sevenoaks in the UK because of the electrical whining noise from the unit itself.
They didn't know anything about the 'replacement board' or known issues, but it's been left with them.
Hopefully they can fix it as I can't live with an audible whining noise that you can hear in between tracks.
Fingers crossed as I really like the unit otherwise.

 

[jaymusic]

Well the world of audio is a funny old game.

I actually got my NAD M33 to replace a Rega Elicit-R/Schitt Gungnir MB/Metrum Accoustics Ambre Streamer combo.
Took me a long time to find the NAD M33 as everything I had auditioned didn't quite justify any change - until the M33.
Buy I kept the other system and it was bubble wrapped in storage.
With the NAD M33 at the shop because of the buzzing/whine, I set up my old system and it sounds so good I am thinking of keeping it now and selling the M33.

Maybe I just got upgraditis before and got sold by the convenience of the M33? Don't know, but the 'old' system seems to have much better control of the music, especially the bass which sounds incredibly deep and tight. Maybe the Rega sound is just what does it for me and I had forgotten how good it sounded? The only thing that changed from when I was using it before is that I swapped out Kef speakers for Sonus Faber's - perhaps the Rega just pairs really well with the SF's? Perhaps the Metrum or the Gumby just provide a better streamer/DAC combo than the M33?

Conundrum.

 

[fcracer]

Maybe I just got upgraditis before and got sold by the convenience of the M33? Don't know, but the 'old' system seems to have much better control of the music, especially the bass which sounds incredibly deep and tight. Maybe the Rega sound is just what does it for me and I had forgotten how good it sounded? The only thing that changed from when I was using it before is that I swapped out Kef speakers for Sonus Faber's - perhaps the Rega just pairs really well with the SF's? Perhaps the Metrum or the Gumby just provide a better streamer/DAC combo than the M33?

Conundrum.

It’s pretty rare for a modern amp to be so bad that you’d hear a difference between amps. However, a change in speakers will surely impact the sound by orders of magnitude more than almost any other part of your audio chain. I’d chalk up the difference to the Sonus Fabers.

The M33 also brings Dirac into the picture which, when setup properly, will have a significant positive impact on the frequency response, especially the bass. The issue however at first with Dirac is that we get used to having lots of bass and room modes. When Dirac does its job, the bass initially feels lacking.

Give it some time and you’ll never go back to one-note bass again. From my personal experience, this is what impacts sound in order of significance:
1. Room and speaker position
2. Speakers
3. Room correction

 

[jaymusic]

It’s pretty rare for a modern amp to be so bad that you’d hear a difference between amps. However, a change in speakers will surely impact the sound by orders of magnitude more than almost any other part of your audio chain. I’d chalk up the difference to the Sonus Fabers.

The M33 also brings Dirac into the picture which, when setup properly, will have a significant positive impact on the frequency response, especially the bass. The issue however at first with Dirac is that we get used to having lots of bass and room modes. When Dirac does its job, the bass initially feels lacking.

Give it some time and you’ll never go back to one-note bass again. From my personal experience, this is what impacts sound in order of significance:
1. Room and speaker position
2. Speakers
3. Room correction

Your'e probably right that its the speakers.
Let me be clear, though, I really liked the NAD M33 and think it is an excellent sound, but the Elicit-R with the SFs just sounds better than the M33 with the SFs. I am talking about the overall combination, not amp vs amp, which would be hard to do as I am not sure you can bypass the M33's DAC (?)
To kind of emphasise your point - I think I should have upgraded my speakers and not the amp. That's what I am hearing.

So Gumby > Elicit > KEF vs NAD M33>KEF I made the decision to change. Later added the SF's to the NAD - better still. By chance because of the whine/buzzing noise in the M33 that meant it's gone to the service centre, I discovered that the Gumby>Elicit >SF sounds the best of all combo's. (of course, without side by side / blind tests.. though I do listen for hrs every night purely focused on the music)

On DIRAC - I tried it and I found that using it actually lowered the dB by about 7-8. Not a major problem, but I also found I could get better results via Roons DSP prior to sending the data to the M33. I am sure DIRAC experts could do better than me, though.

 

[fcracer]

Your'e probably right that its the speakers.
Let me be clear, though, I really liked the NAD M33 and think it is an excellent sound, but the Elicit-R with the SFs just sounds better than the M33 with the SFs. I am talking about the overall combination, not amp vs amp, which would be hard to do as I am not sure you can bypass the M33's DAC (?)
To kind of emphasise your point - I think I should have upgraded my speakers and not the amp. That's what I am hearing.

So Gumby > Elicit > KEF vs NAD M33>KEF I made the decision to change. Later added the SF's to the NAD - better still. By chance because of the whine/buzzing noise in the M33 that meant it's gone to the service centre, I discovered that the Gumby>Elicit >SF sounds the best of all combo's. (of course, without side by side / blind tests.. though I do listen for hrs every night purely focused on the music)

On DIRAC - I tried it and I found that using it actually lowered the dB by about 7-8. Not a major problem, but I also found I could get better results via Roons DSP prior to sending the data to the M33. I am sure DIRAC experts could do better than me, though.

Getting Dirac right takes a few attempts and has a bit of a learning curve. What should be a simple measurement exercise can easily turn into a mess with a few seemingly insignificant mistakes. A few measurements taken too close to a wall, or the main listening position being slightly off can have a big impact.

However, something not often talked about is that the positioning of the speakers is a very important starting point for a successful Dirac measurement. If the speakers are placed so that there are large nulls or large room modes, Dirac will do its best to correct, but you may lose gain or even get too much.

There is software called REW that I think should be required learning for all audio enthusiasts. In fact, for every dollar wasted on useless high end cables, I wish the author of REW received even 10% of that. He would become deservedly rich, and the end user would actually get something of value.

When you get the M33 back, I would suggest the following process:

1. Use REW to measure the speaker placement and try different positions to smoothen the frequency response as much as possible. You can use foam plugs supplied by the speaker manufacturer to test different bass responses. If the speaker is near a corner or back wall, try to move it away from the wall to smoothen the bass response.
2. Run Dirac measurement and apply a Harman +6db curve or the NAD Room Curve from https://nadelectronics.com/dirac-live/
3. Use REW to measure the before and after with and without Dirac Live engaged.

If all goes well, you should have an after frequency curve that is relatively smooth (it will never look as smooth as the after curve in Dirac because that's based on an average of several measurements vs. one measurement in REW from the main listening position. You can take an average of measurements in REW from different spots as well using a moving mic method, but suggest doing just 3 measurements to keep things simple around the main listening position.

After you've got a smooth frequency response, take some time to adapt to the "new" sound. It may sound flat and a little lifeless at first, but once you become accustomed to the nuances in the bass notes, you'll never want to go back to the intense room modes and nulls. It took me about 2-3 weeks to adapt to the new sound. I will admit however that I still keep a +10db Harman Curve in one of the filter slots for when people come over and need to feel the excess bass to enjoy music

Good luck with your M33. Hope NAD sorts out the whine issue. While my M33 isn't perfect, it's the best combination of features, power and looks on the market that I was able to find.

 

[pogo]

The interaction between AMP and SPEAKER should not be underestimated: Link

 

[pogo]

And if you know what your hearing preferences are, you can customize the whole thing under Dirac Live, e.g. Harman target curve.
No M33 has to go back

 

[pogo]

Since the middle of the year, the selling price of the M33 has increased by about 30% in germany!
Let's see where the journey will still go...

 

[NYfan2]

In the Netherlands the price has increased 23%!

 

[Marc v E]

What makes me wonder about this device is if I would buy it if I had passive speakers. Minidsp flex + dirac + audiophonics purify is 500 + 200 + 1500.

Only negative would be no hdmi and 2 instead of 1 box. Positive are better measurements and about 3000 euros extra to spend on speakers.

 

[pogo]

Don't be mistaken and the M33 has the better audible measurements: Link
All a matter of physical implementation and firmware
The miniDSP also does not work at full 192k with DL
The M33 can: Link

 

[Marc v E]

Don't be mistaken and the M33 has the better audible measurements: Link
All a matter of physical implementation and firmware
The miniDSP also does not work at full 192k with DL
The M33 can: Link

Well, the audiophonics purify has a Sinad of -105 to -108 db. Max power is 255 watt. The minidsp dac has a sinad of -110db. That is a lot better sinad than de m33 which has -93 db sinad.

The m33 has more power though, so in that respect it's better. If that's your main concern, though, you could get a nc500 hypex based design for the same price as the purify (or lower).

Everybody has it's own preference for design, but given the data the minidsp + hypex or purify seem unbeatable to me.

 

[pogo]

You shouldn't look so much at the data and if you would measure your proposed chain, you would have to reckon with a disillusionment in one or the other place
If you haven't heard an M33 yet, you really should. Even after the price increase, it's still unbeatable for me.

 

[Kachda]

You shouldn't look so much at the data and if you would measure your proposed chain, you would have to reckon with a disillusionment in one or the other place
If you haven't heard an M33 yet, you really should. Even after the price increase, it's still unbeatable for me.

The minidsp + hypex combo is $2k or thereabouts. You can add a wiim pro for 150.

The nad m33 costs 4k+ and measures slightly worse than the combo.

 

[Marc v E]

The m33 is nowadays 6800 euros in Europe: https://www.stassen.nl/versterkers-en-receivers/stereo-versterker/nad-masters-m33

6000 in the US. That makes a 4000 dollar difference between the minidsp/purify and the m33