Let's share diagrams (and photos) of our total physical audio system and the whole signal path, with a few words and/or links

[fatoldgit]

Used to spin vinyl and all flavour of silver disc...dropped vinyl, ripped the silver discs and have the following setup. Note the diagram doesnt specifically show the orientation of the side speakers relative to the fronts.. which is part of my "secret sauce" that makes it work.

I have for 20 years run a four channel speaker system (noting all source material is 2 channel)...this is to increase stereo spread in my dedicated room esp for stereo recordings made before pan potting in mixing desks become ubiquitous... which is maybe 80% of my collection... before pan pots the images were placed hard left, hard right and center. Also works well for modern pan potted mixes.

Room is extensively treated with lots of experiments over the years with regard to speaker placement, treatment placement. Room is 8m by 5m.

Nothing funky in play (like using some processor to fake the side channels), just run the side speakers out of phase with the fronts and use the integrated to control the volume balance between front and sides.

This controls the stereo spread I get which I easily change on a per album basis. The streamer provides the master volume.

The image spread is wall to wall... in fact it really forms an arc so has width and depth but all imaging is in front of me... you never hear the sides although they are approximately inline with ears. BUT... its all very natural and not supersized... just the space between everything is spread apart.

Have 5000 ripped CD's (50%/49% split between Blues and Jazz, the rest Rock) and 500 ripped music DVD's (I dont watch movies, tv etc anywhere so the system is purely for music playback).

Peter

 

[Blumlein 88]

Was really hoping that whole wireless streaming thing would work out.

 

[dualazmak]

Diagram, maybe pics later:

View attachment 387626

Oh, your concept and system are very much similar to mine including the vinyl LP listening!

Only if possible, I would also highly appreciate if you would also kindly share your diagram of DSP configuration (XO-Fq/XO-Type/Slope/EQ/Gain/Grp-Delay/Invert/etc.) in-detail, just like my Fig.12 in the top post.

In my case, the system-wide one-stop DSP center "EKIO" is also working/effective for live vinyl LP listening (ref. here #688 and #758). On the other hand, in your system, you have no DSP control on LP listening, right? Or, your MSB PAD-1 ADC has some DSP capabilities?

 

[dualazmak]

Was really hoping that whole wireless streaming thing would work out.

View attachment 387638

LOL,
At least in my case, I essentially do not like wireless things except for only keyboard and mouse to my PC.
In my posts #895, #906 and #931 on my project thread, you can see backside wiring views of my amps, DACs, 12-VU-Meter Array, PCs, etc. as well as backside wiring view of my SP system.

Spoiler

By the way, on Sunday last weekend, I did my regular semi-annual complete/intensive cleaning and re-tightening of all the metal-to-metal contacts/connectors in my whole audio system (ref. here #671 and #895); it took about continuous five (5) hours.

I use solely IPA (Isopropyl Alcohol), and I (at least I myself) believe that we should not use Caig DeoxIT DN5 and/or similar protective(?) materials (refer to posts #676, #677, #680, #682 on my project thread).

 

[Doodski]

By the way, on Sunday last weekend, I did my regular semi-annual complete/intensive cleaning of all the metal-to-metal contacts/connectors in my whole audio system (ref. here #671 and #895); it took about continuous five (5) hours.

I use solely IPA (Isopropyl Alcohol), and I (at least I myself) believe that we should not use Caig DeoxIT DN5 and/or similar protective(?) materials (refer to posts #676, #677, #680, #682 on my project thread).

Good job. That will protect the tweeter(s) from snapping sounds due to poor connections.

 

[Blumlein 88]

LOL,
At least in my case, I essentially do not like wireless things except for only keyboard and mouse to my PC.
In my posts #895, #906 and #931 on my project thread, you can see backside wiring views of my amps, DACs, 12-VU-Meter Array, PCs, etc. as well as backside wiring view of my SP system.

Spoiler

View attachment 387648

View attachment 387649

View attachment 387650

View attachment 387651

View attachment 387652

By the way, on Sunday last weekend, I did my regular semi-annual complete/intensive cleaning of all the metal-to-metal contacts/connectors in my whole audio system (ref. here #671 and #895); it took about continuous five (5) hours.

I use solely IPA (Isopropyl Alcohol), and I (at least I myself) believe that we should not use Caig DeoxIT DN5 and/or similar protective(?) materials (refer to posts #676, #677, #680, #682 on my project thread).

I think this was a good idea for a thread. I don't feel so bad now seeing how complexly some other people have put together systems. Also how neatly some of you have posted so it is all clear. I started and just gave up on posting mine.

If you saw the music video someone posted a few days ago with a woman singing about her husband wasn't getting any more gear one thing really spoke to me. She sings something like, "just to play a CD would require an instruction manual I wouldn't understand". Certainly true of my gear and several audiophile friends. Since I combined my music and home theater system there are ways I can do so many things. Explaining it to someone else so they could do it? Forget about it!

I might walk in with a laptop and play music over a Roku using a Plex server. Or play a movie, or a music video. I might whip out my Babyface and connect it to the laptop along with plugging in XLRs on a switchbox I keep handy for most direct playback. Or plug in a mic and do some karaoke with friends. And heck, just too many things to list. It is an amazing time we live in. So I am going to enjoy my geekiness rather than worry about it. The picture I posted seems to express how I feel like my system setup is.

 

[dualazmak]

Used to spin vinyl and all flavour of silver disc...dropped vinyl, ripped the silver discs and have the following setup. Note the diagram doesnt specifically show the orientation of the side speakers relative to the fronts.. which is part of my "secret sauce" that makes it work.



View attachment 387632

I have for 20 years run a four channel speaker system (noting all source material is 2 channel)...this is to increase stereo spread in my dedicated room esp for stereo recordings made before pan potting in mixing desks become ubiquitous... which is maybe 80% of my collection... before pan pots the images were placed hard left, hard right and center. Also works well for modern pan potted mixes.

Room is extensively treated with lots of experiments over the years with regard to speaker placement, treatment placement. Room is 8m by 5m.

Nothing funky in play (like using some processor to fake the side channels), just run the side speakers out of phase with the fronts and use the integrated to control the volume balance between front and sides.

This controls the stereo spread I get which I easily change on a per album basis. The streamer provides the master volume.

The image spread is wall to wall... in fact it really forms an arc so has width and depth but all imaging is in front of me... you never hear the sides although they are approximately inline with ears. BUT... its all very natural and not supersized... just the space between everything is spread apart.

Have 5000 ripped CD's (50%/49% split between Blues and Jazz, the rest Rock) and 500 ripped music DVD's (I dont watch movies, tv etc anywhere so the system is purely for music playback).

Peter

Very nice to see your diagram!

I too use 10-m-long optical HDMI cable from my PC into PANASONIC 4K OLED TV TH-55HZ1800 which works as 2nd PC monitor of 4K (3840x2160 pixel) resolution, refresh rate 60 Hz (ref. Fig.21 in my post #931 on the project thread). I assume your TV is also primary (or secondary) PC monitor in your diagram, right?

Spoiler

Related to this TV utilization, my post here #59 on the remote thread would be our reference regarding a kind of “reverse thinking” utilization of 4K OLED TV connected to PC in DSP-based multichannel audio rig for viewing and listening TV program and other video (YouTube, etc.), DVD movie, blue-ray-Disc movie, and so on.

 

[DWPress]

in your system, you have no DSP control on LP listening, right? Or, your MSB PAD-1 ADC has some DSP capabilities?

The PAD-1 has AES output into the DAC8-Pro which then sends the signal via USB to the Mac mini for DSP processing and then back to the Okto via USB again for distribution to the amps. I use @mitchco's Hang Loose Convolver to host the various plugins. In the first image is a visual of plugins active on the desktop and where I've been playing with DLBC. The second image shows an alternative graph that has an A/B switch (VST) for the exact same filters done in PEQ and FIR to compare responses in the time domain and pre-ringing. By merely disabling DLBC (or any DRC with a plugin) I can instantly compare the same calibrated SPL and delay times vs my own EQ attemps.

I do a lot of beta testing so some of these apps or plugins are experimental but it's extremely flexible for working out crossovers and other interesting things.



Pics of the room and gear, the tube gear on the 2nd shelf is just display. The 18" sub is below the left speaker and the SVS sub is in the corner diagonal and closer to the MLP. Some pics from various times so some are taken during assembly/cable management and now the cloud is more complete and I'm building another "dif-sorber" for the front wall behind the speakers. is It's a 16x24 foot room with 11.5' sidewalls and the listening position is 12' from speakers. Room treatment is mostly diffusion, this is part of my studio space so I like even sound throughout the room but of course it's best in the main LP. I guess I forgot to add the projector to the diagram but it's all Airplay to the Mac mini so gets lumped into the digital domain.

The giant work table in the middle of the room doesn't help much but - it's part of the space along with all the other heavy metal in the office/bindery.

With the Roon app on an extra iPad I can just give any visitor the device and they can dive into the abyss.



A peak into the press room next door:

 

[Robin L]

There are other arrangements possible, but this is what I listen to 99.9% of the time:

 

[dualazmak]

The PAD-1 has AES output into the DAC8-Pro which then sends the signal via USB to the Mac mini for DSP processing and then back to the Okto via USB again for distribution to the amps.

Understood well!
Your total system is really wonderful and amazing...

 

[DWPress]

Here are some graphs from REW to show a recent project letting DLBC take full control of the XO:





I've moved on from this experiment but a general idea what can be done.

 

[AwesomeSauce2015]

Here's the program that runs on my Biamp TesiraForte AVB TI DSP.
Lots of sources, lots of destinations.
My main speakers (Kef Q100) are powered by a Crown CTs 1200 (turned WAY down), with balanced connections to the DSP. The Subs (JBL 550P) are connected by unbalanced RCA connections.
The Focusrite Scarlett input is balanced, but the headphone return is unbalanced (I had old wires laying around). The AVB connections are made using a spare ethernet cable direct to the mac. The TV signal is unbalanced, noisy, and low in level, but does work for the weather channel, which is all that really matters for my use.
The noise generator in the bottom left corner can generate white or pink noise in the DSP, but is not used as I prefer silence to noise when my neighbors are being obnoxious.
The input "Uber Filter" blocks aren't used, aside from a slight boost around 2-3khz (Presence region) on the TV input to improve intelligibility.
The level control blocks before the mixers are used for overall level control for their respective sources. The mixer blocks allow individual level and mutes for each source, on a per-mix basis.

All in all, the Tesira software claims that this abomination uses around 90% of the DSP resources, and through clever (ab)use of the delay equalization function, I supposedly have under 2ms of latency from the Scarlett analog inputs to the speaker outputs. The AVB links operate at 1ms of latency, so they are also basically imperceptible latency.

Any questions? If you want I can also add my Biamp Canvas control surface, but it only controls the stuff you see here.

 

[StigErik]

 

[dualazmak]

Here's the program that runs on my Biamp TesiraForte AVB TI DSP.
Lots of sources, lots of destinations.
My main speakers (Kef Q100) are powered by a Crown CTs 1200 (turned WAY down), with balanced connections to the DSP. The Subs (JBL 550P) are connected by unbalanced RCA connections.
The Focusrite Scarlett input is balanced, but the headphone return is unbalanced (I had old wires laying around). The AVB connections are made using a spare ethernet cable direct to the mac. The TV signal is unbalanced, noisy, and low in level, but does work for the weather channel, which is all that really matters for my use.
The noise generator in the bottom left corner can generate white or pink noise in the DSP, but is not used as I prefer silence to noise when my neighbors are being obnoxious.
The input "Uber Filter" blocks aren't used, aside from a slight boost around 2-3khz (Presence region) on the TV input to improve intelligibility.
The level control blocks before the mixers are used for overall level control for their respective sources. The mixer blocks allow individual level and mutes for each source, on a per-mix basis.
View attachment 387681
All in all, the Tesira software claims that this abomination uses around 90% of the DSP resources, and through clever (ab)use of the delay equalization function, I supposedly have under 2ms of latency from the Scarlett analog inputs to the speaker outputs. The AVB links operate at 1ms of latency, so they are also basically imperceptible latency.

Any questions? If you want I can also add my Biamp Canvas control surface, but it only controls the stuff you see here.

Wowoo, Oh my God...

This should be detailed flowchart inside the DSP software processing with your caption explanations!? Just amazing.

In my DSP-based multichannel audio setup, in upstream digital domain, JRiver MC (as music player), VB-AUDIO MATRIX (as system-wide ASIO/VASIO/VAIO routing I/O center) and DSP "EKIO" (as system-wide DSP center) are working similarly in digital audio processing. If I were the actual programmer of these software tools, I might have drawn the similar diagram(s) for black-box portions of digital domain in my audio setup, but fortunately (or unfortunately?) I am just a superficial end-user of these digital audio software tools just enjoying their excellent background processing job for which I cannot draw the details as yours!

Any questions? If you want I can also add my Biamp Canvas control surface, but it only controls the stuff you see here.

Yes, I would highly appreciate if you could kindly prepare and share the total physical audio gear setup diagram from your inputs throughout SP drivers, including the above DSP portion in a simple rectangular box of "TesiraForte AVB", for my (and our) at-a-glance understanding and overview of your amazing audio system! If possible, I am expecting similar diagrams like my Fig.01 and Fig.03 shared in my very first post on this thread.


In your diagram, you kindly included several digital software "Peak Meter" features within the DSP tool. In my multichannel audio setup. I too have many software "Peak Meters" including JRiver MC's cosmetic meters, VB-AUDIO MATRIX's I/O meters and its I/O channel meters, as well as DSP EKIO's I/O peak meters; I can layout all of these peak meters on my PC Monitor screen while enjoying listening to music as shown in the screen shot in this diagram (ref. Fig.15 in my post #931 on my project thread).

In the above diagram, I also included photo of my DIY-built IEC60268-17 compatible 12-VU-Meter Array (ref. #535) which actually monitors "whole sum gain" of line-level output from DAC8PRO, line-level gain into active subwoofers, as well as actual SP high-level signal gains (after level-down to line level) of four amplifiers driving woofers, midranges, tweeters and super-tweeters. I shared video clips of "dancing" 12-VU-Meter Array in my posts #750, #751, #752 and #753 on my project thread.

 

[Multicore]

Used to spin vinyl and all flavour of silver disc...dropped vinyl, ripped the silver discs and have the following setup. Note the diagram doesnt specifically show the orientation of the side speakers relative to the fronts.. which is part of my "secret sauce" that makes it work.



View attachment 387632

I have for 20 years run a four channel speaker system (noting all source material is 2 channel)...this is to increase stereo spread in my dedicated room esp for stereo recordings made before pan potting in mixing desks become ubiquitous... which is maybe 80% of my collection... before pan pots the images were placed hard left, hard right and center. Also works well for modern pan potted mixes.

Room is extensively treated with lots of experiments over the years with regard to speaker placement, treatment placement. Room is 8m by 5m.

Nothing funky in play (like using some processor to fake the side channels), just run the side speakers out of phase with the fronts and use the integrated to control the volume balance between front and sides.

This controls the stereo spread I get which I easily change on a per album basis. The streamer provides the master volume.

The image spread is wall to wall... in fact it really forms an arc so has width and depth but all imaging is in front of me... you never hear the sides although they are approximately inline with ears. BUT... its all very natural and not supersized... just the space between everything is spread apart.

Have 5000 ripped CD's (50%/49% split between Blues and Jazz, the rest Rock) and 500 ripped music DVD's (I dont watch movies, tv etc anywhere so the system is purely for music playback).

Peter

What is that streamer?

 

[Multicore]

@StigErik wins. Superior diagram too.

 

[dualazmak]

View attachment 387694

My Wowoo, again!

I can easily understand that you are really an "extreme bass sound enthusiast", indeed!
You have 24 set of SEAS L26ROY, 12 in front and 12 in rear!! Really?? Are you shaking (or destroying) your room and house everyday?!

I myself too have once intensively "just considered" introduction/implementation of L26ROY in my multichannel audio rig (ref. #470, #471, #473 and #474 on my project thread).

I am (we are) very much curious about your listening room structure (photos, please) and acoustic treatments.
I would be also looking forward to, if possible, seeing your total signal path diagram just like my Fig.03 in my very top post on this thread.

 

[StigErik]

My Wowoo, again!

I can easily understand that you are really an "extreme bass sound enthusiast", indeed!
You have 24 set of SEAS L26ROY, 12 in front and 12 in rear!! Really?? Are you shaking (or destroying) your room and house everyday?!

I am (we are) very much curious about your listening room structure (photos, please) and acoustic treatments.
I would be also looking forward to, if possible, seeing your total signal path diagram just like my Fig.03 in my very top post on this thread.

Thanks a lot!

I prefer quality over quantity, so I usually listen at about 75 dB on average.

It's challenging to take good pictures of my setup and room, but I do have a couple of drawings showing the overall layout.

I'll definitely look into drawing up the whole signal path as you did in your post.

 

[boxerfan88]

"Downgraded" from discrete box HiFi to this simplified music system in 2023. Sound quality wise, it is a big upgrade.

PC - DAC - active speakers.

Only 3 out of 8 channels in the Topping DM7 DAC are used.

And my daily eye candy

.

 

[Multicore]

It's challenging to take good pictures of my setup and room,

Try a Ricoh Theta camera.