Klipsch Heresy IV Speaker Review

[gino1961]

Good morning and sorry I promise the last rambling
I would expect a better control of distortion from a speaker this famous (and much lauded by everyone)
Maybe I am reading badly the graph
But the performance is debatable especially in the important midrange

 

[Henry53]

OH look, is he wearing a white lab coat?
He must be a scientist or doctor right? LOL

As to the video, nothing new to be learned there unless you're a believer in audiophool BS.
It's what we've been telling folks for a long long time, properly designed audio electronics with a digital front end has
been a solved problem for decades, they all sound alike.
Are there some that can sound different, sure. Because they've been purposely designed to sound different, particularly tube
electronics which most all exhibit measurable linearity and distortion issues. They could be designed to be transparent, but they aren't.
No one buys tubes to get something that sounds the same as good SS.

I guess some people can accept that all hifi is an illusion, there really isn't a band or orchestra in your lounge. The danger is this illusion becomes a delusion that somehow it is real. So for some tubes don't sound as good as SS they sound better. Pick the fake you like.

 

[Sal1950]

I guess some people can accept that all hifi is an illusion

But the reason for High Fidelity's creation and existence was to create that illusion as best as possible.
That is what was captured on the source, distort it at your own peril.

 

[Henry53]

But the reason for High Fidelity's creation and existence was to create that illusion as best as possible.
That is what was captured on the source, distort it at your own peril.

Its all 'distorted' pick the one you like!

 

[Ludovic]

Bonjour et désolé je promets le dernier bavardage
Je m'attendrais à un meilleur contrôle de la distorsion d'une enceinte aussi célèbre
Peut-être que je lis mal le graphique
Mais les performances sont discutables, surtout dans les médiums importants.

here are two other themes concerning these speakers:
The distortion, for me it seems obvious that they do not provide a sound as clean as a cabasse or kef type speaker.
This is where we come to the second theme, high fidelity.
For me in terms of distortion and in terms of frequency balance, image and they are not at the top but it is far from disgusting (read my comparison with the kef meta above). Now I also compared them with bw, ellipson, triangle, qacoustic audio monitor and I'm bored with all these columns. The measures make sense and we should definitely not put them aside, but in my opinion, we do not all have the same expectations and the same habitats.
After thinking about this subject, I think that to have a good fidelity speaker, you need to buy a pair of wide field monitoring with DSP.
I looked at atcs, the good ones cost tens of thousands of dollars.
Or buy each pair of monitoring speakers, for each album produced on it.
When comparing the columns during my choice, it was sometimes very hard to differentiate them from each other.
My installation is undoubtedly very far from neutrality, but it allowed me to reconcile myself with rock that is perhaps poorly produced.
My main measurement on this subject being the number of CDs purchased since I owned these speakers.
Otherwise no one can answer my question regarding Erin's sentence regarding difficult amplification via an AVR? something I've been doing for a long time...

---

 

[gino1961]

personally i think that horn design is very challenging When the design is wrong the sound can be awful Even painful
I tend to prefer a less aggressive approach like waveguides or lenses
However when done right the result could be just sublime That feeling of effortless power that no conventional drivers can match
Maybe something the ATC dome But it is more an exception than the standard mid dome

 

[Sal1950]

Its all 'distorted' pick the one you like!

Wrong

 

[Sal1950]

The minimum impedance dips to about 3.6 Ohms below 5Hz so keep this in mind. But, realistically, this speaker is closer to a 5 Ohm nominal load. A standard AVR would not be recommended for powering these speakers. A separate amplifier is recommended to drive this speaker to typical playback volumes.

Otherwise no one can answer my question regarding Erin's sentence regarding difficult amplification via an AVR? something I've been doing for a long time...

Is the above quote what you refer to ?
I'm not sure I get it either. The impedance can be a bit taxing for really cheaply designed amps but when taking in the relatively high sensitivity (94db+ as measured) I'm not sure this can be seen as a serious issue for any decent AVR? Heresy's have there problems but amplifier eaters they aren't.

 

[Ludovic]

La citation ci-dessus est-elle celle à laquelle vous faites référence ?
Je ne suis pas sûr de comprendre non plus. L'impédance peut être un peu contraignante pour les amplis de conception vraiment bon marché, mais compte tenu de la sensibilité relativement élevée (94 dB+ telle que mesurée), je ne suis pas sûr que cela puisse être considéré comme un problème sérieux pour un AVR décent ? Les hérésies ont leurs problèmes, mais pas les mangeurs d'amplificateurs.

Merci

Is the above quote what you refer to ?
I'm not sure I get it either. The impedance can be a bit taxing for really cheaply designed amps but when taking in the relatively high sensitivity (94db+ as measured) I'm not sure this can be seen as a serious issue for any decent AVR? Heresy's have there problems but amplifier eaters they aren't.

thank you for your response! yes it was this sentence I was talking about.
To me, this is an error that confirms that measurement interpretations can be misleading.
I have no problem amplifying these speakers.
this adds to everyone's perceptions.

 

[Henry53]

here are two other themes concerning these speakers:
The distortion, for me it seems obvious that they do not provide a sound as clean as a cabasse or kef type speaker.
This is where we come to the second theme, high fidelity.
For me in terms of distortion and in terms of frequency balance, image and they are not at the top but it is far from disgusting (read my comparison with the kef meta above). Now I also compared them with bw, ellipson, triangle, qacoustic audio monitor and I'm bored with all these columns. The measures make sense and we should definitely not put them aside, but in my opinion, we do not all have the same expectations and the same habitats.
After thinking about this subject, I think that to have a good fidelity speaker, you need to buy a pair of wide field monitoring with DSP.
I looked at atcs, the good ones cost tens of thousands of dollars.
Or buy each pair of monitoring speakers, for each album produced on it.
When comparing the columns during my choice, it was sometimes very hard to differentiate them from each other.
My installation is undoubtedly very far from neutrality, but it allowed me to reconcile myself with rock that is perhaps poorly produced.
My main measurement on this subject being the number of CDs purchased since I owned these speakers.
Otherwise no one can answer my question regarding Erin's sentence regarding difficult amplification via an AVR? something I've been doing for a long time...

---

Having used DSP in a previous set up it helped to integrate two subwoofers. In my current system DSP is totally unnecessary. I would suggest that many resort to DSP to try to solve other issues better solved by dealing with the actual causes, room acoustics, set up, equipment mismatch or simply a system configuration that does not sound as you may wish.

 

[Sal1950]

I would suggest that many resort to DSP to try to solve other issues better solved by dealing with the actual causes, room acoustics, set up, equipment mismatch or simply a system configuration that does not sound as you may wish.

Do you have measurements of the bass range in you room?
Controlling room modes using things like bass traps and such has always been minimally successful
Using analog eq was the same.
DSP has proven to be a God-sent for controlling the wild swings in bass response.

 

[Henry53]

Do you have measurements of the bass range in you room?
Controlling room modes using things like bass traps and such has always been minimally successful
Using analog eq was the same.
DSP has proven to be a God-sent for controlling the wild swings in bass response.

I had a room purpose built, this includes bass traps, angled walls, both hard, soft and multifaceted surfaces etc. The room is smaller 4.5 x 3.3 m. I have Audio Physic Sitara 25 speakers designed for smaller rooms, I replaced very high powered Vincent Pre / Power hybrid with Primaluna EVO 400 and replaced iFi doc with Denafrips, I removed the DSP from the system. I now get better results than with previous set up in previous room. My previous bass problem has disappeared, the soundstage and imaging have improved.

 

[Henry53]

I had a room purpose built, this includes bass traps, angled walls, both hard, soft and multifaceted surfaces etc. The room is smaller 4.5 x 3.3 m. I have Audio Physic Sitara 25 speakers designed for smaller rooms, I replaced very high powered Vincent Pre / Power hybrid with Primaluna EVO 400 and replaced iFi doc with Denafrips, I removed the DSP from the system. I now get better results than with previous set up in previous room. My previous bass problem has disappeared, the soundstage and imaging have improved.

Try listening to this

, it is one of the best illustrations about actually hearing as distinct from measurement.

 

[Sal1950]

I had a room purpose built, this includes bass traps, angled walls, both hard, soft and multifaceted surfaces etc.

Excellent approach, one that not many can afford.
You surprise me by putting all that money and effort into hopefully getting an accurate bass response and then throw
a tone control and harmonic distortion generator for an amplifier into the path. Your choice.

Primaluna EVO 400

Any experience with this integrated amplifier kind folks? Trying to choose between an Odyssey Candela, Khartooga combo or a Primaluna EVO powering a pair of T+A Criterion speakers. Thanks

www.audiosciencereview.com

, it is one of the best illustrations about actually hearing as distinct from measurement.

Well, he got the importance of a good room right.
But you can foul up the sound in the worlds best room with poor equipment.

 

[Henry53]

Excellent approach, one that not many can afford.
You surprise me by putting all that money and effort into hopefully getting an accurate bass response and then throw
a tone control and harmonic distortion generator for an amplifier into the path. Your choice.

Primaluna EVO 400

Any experience with this integrated amplifier kind folks? Trying to choose between an Odyssey Candela, Khartooga combo or a Primaluna EVO powering a pair of T+A Criterion speakers. Thanks

www.audiosciencereview.com

Well, he got the importance of a good room right.
But you can foul up the sound in the worlds best room with poor equipment.

You hear what you hear, none else can tell you what you hear, no one can measure what you hear. The Primaluna sounded much better to me than any SS amp at the same price, that's it.

 

[Sal1950]

no one can measure what you hear.

Wrong, we can measure exactly what your hearing, and tell you how close it resembles what was recorded on the source.
If you prefer a distorted reproduction over an accurate one, your perfectly entitled to that.
High Fidelity Music Reproduction in the home is a science, not magic.

 

[Ludovic]

Wrong, we can measure exactly what your hearing, and tell you how close it resembles what was recorded on the source.
If you prefer a distorted reproduction over an accurate one, your perfectly entitled to that.
High Fidelity Music Reproduction in the home is a science, not magic.

indeed everything is scientific in this world.
But a distinction is made here between what the devices measure, and what our ears hear.
Or rather on which aspects of sound our brain pays attention.
An interesting comment from a forum member in this thread.
It has heresy and more conventional speakers.
Even if he prefers conventional ones, he still needs a period of adaptation between the two types of speakers.
Measuring instruments have no adaptation period. No device will tell us, that’s what I like!
The only study that seems serious was launched by harman. But I have the clear impression that it is our brain that can be influenced. And he's the one who takes the upper hand anyway.
After all, who could say here that he is not influenced by the measurements.
I didn't hear any resonance in my heresy before reading Erin's report.
And if I had read it before buying my AVR, I could have believed its deductions from the measurements.

 

[Audio Science Pal]

A few years back, I was a volunteer (one of many, many people) listening to music from a deluxe surround sound audio system, for research on how the shape of the outer ear influences the frequency response inside the ear. The apparatus included a tiny microphone suspended inside each ear canal, held in position by an elaborate, delicate spring-loaded ear clip.

Interesting that one of the audio giants spent a lot of effort to account for the fact that everybody receives sound waves in an individual way.

If someone claims that brand X sounds better to them than brand Y, then good for them.

 

[Henry53]

Wrong, we can measure exactly what your hearing, and tell you how close it resembles what was recorded on the source.
If you prefer a distorted reproduction over an accurate one, your perfectly entitled to that.
High Fidelity Music Reproduction in the home is a science, not magic.

The problem with this analyses is that humans listen with their brain not with a meter. What you brain hears is unique to you. How your brain translates information is unique, to you. That is science, you can ignore it if you like and read your meter, that's fine but your brain listens to the music, not to the measurement.

 

[Ludovic]

The problem with this analyses is that humans listen with their brain not with a meter. What you brain hears is unique to you. How your brain translates information is unique, to you. That is science, you can ignore it if you like and read your meter, that's fine but your brain listens to the music, not to the measurement.

After reading your comments, we seem to agree that our brain can play tricks on us with audio.
What I see is that he has a certain resilience in the face of a loyalty gap.
High fidelity involves reproducing the recording as closely as possible to the mastering.
The mastering still has to be done on speakers with the same curve as ours. Not to mention that many masterings are also done to sound good on low-end equipment.
But I digress.
In any case, it's nice to chat with you. THANKS !
All that remains is to wait for serious studies providing answers to our questions.