Inside Yamaha amps

[ZolaIII]

Really badly designed/manufactured (amp). I would use fans as a last resort, with 12 V wall adapter. Otherwise get money back or another amp.

It's quite other way around. All stereo Yamahas I ever encountered had a good worked out passive cooling and good optimised PCB placement paired with good quality capacitors, even the cheep ones. Transformers are either iron core or toroidal and quite good quality and noise characteristics. Usually they don't get uncomfortably hot on tuch even driven relatively hard.
Thing is if you can lower down capacitor temperature for 20° they will last more than twice as long. And this is easy and cheap enough too do with active cooling still keeping the noise under residential level and avoiding pitch low fundamental which can be annoying. If you love your equipment you will do it. The from factory fans are far from great usually old durable double ball bearing producing grinding sound and not pressure optimised.

 

[Viriatusrex]

Really badly designed/manufactured (amp). I would use fans as a last resort, with DC wall adapter. Otherwise get money back or another amp

Well, on this website, someone wrote the following about the A-S 2100
"But I digress, the AS-2100 is nothing special. It may look the goods from the outside, but I am going to bet they will be landfill in 10-15 years due to the entire amplifier being run by a completely unnecessary micro and riddled with SMD electros"
That made me worry a bit but I hoped the A-S2200 would improve on some realiability complaints the previous series seemed to have, (from what I read from several other posts)
I just find really weird that this amp has some sort of A Class thermal behaviour which of course it shouldnt, so I still wonder if theres more to it, if theres something deeply wrong with the one I got, since for example Dualazmak reported above that his A-S 3000 (even more powerful than the A-S 2200 doesnt get hot. Actually theres a video on the youtube channel Stereopolice where the channel owner made a direct temperature comparison between an A-S 1100 and a couple of Class A amps and he showed the Yammy wasnt hot and , according to his words, "Never gets hot" ...
All in all... this A-S 2200 adventure isnt going as expected, to say the least...

 

[Viriatusrex]

It's quite other way around. All stereo Yamahas I ever encountered had a good worked out passive cooling and good optimised PCB placement paired with good quality capacitors, even the cheep ones. Transformers are either iron core or toroidal and quite good quality and noise characteristics. Usually they don't get uncomfortably hot on tuch even driven relatively hard.
Thing is if you can lower down capacitor temperature for 20° they will last more than twice as long. And this is easy and cheap enough too do with active cooling still keeping the noise under residential level and avoiding pitch low fundamental which can be annoying. If you love your equipment you will do it. The from factory fans are far from great usually old durable double ball bearing producing grinding sound and not pressure optimised.

Well I can say that my A-S 501 (still have it) never, ever got even remotely close to the temperature this one gets, and that was with far less space above it, if compared with this one

 

[mhardy6647]

I am very, very late to this party -- but I do have a thought to share (for better or for worse ). @Viriatusrex, what is your source componenet?
Is there any chance that there could be DC riding on the input signal?

Apologies if I am clutching at straws -- it popped into mind as I skimmed the last couple of pages & so I figured it wouldn't hurt to mention.
YMMV, of course.

 

[Doodski]

I am very, very late to this party -- but I do have a thought to share (for better or for worse ). @Viriatusrex, what is your source componenet?
Is there any chance that there could be DC riding on the input signal?

Apologies if I am clutching at straws -- it popped into mind as I skimmed the last couple of pages & so I figured it wouldn't hurt to mention.
YMMV, of course.

It's a very interesting idea. Usually the low level RCA inputs have a capacitor on the input to block any DC and to AC couple before leading to a OP amp buffer or a input IC switching IC. But one never knows exactly until seeing a service manual schematic. If it does have DC on the input that is creating offset at the speaker terminals it could be metered with a multimeter although it would be a very rare case.

 

[mhardy6647]

It's a very interesting idea. Usually the low level RCA inputs have a capacitor on the input to block any DC and to AC couple before leading to a OP amp buffer or a input IC switching IC. But one never knows exactly until seeing a service manual schematic. If it does have DC on the input that is creating offset at the speaker terminals it could be metered with a multimeter although it would be a very rare case.

Usually -- indeed.

 

[Viriatusrex]

Guys, honestly im speechless with your will to help! Really thank you! Ok , heres the full chain from power outlet to speakers:
Supra lorad power chord- Supra lorad powerstrip (6 slots) , stock power chord to the amp.
Yamaha Cd-S with Supra Lorad power chord into the supra strip, and into the amp cd In with QED Qunex RCA.
Pioneer Pl -600 into the supra slot with stock cable-> Pro Ject phono Box RS2 (powered by a pJ linear Power Box which is then powered by the supra strip), the phono rs balanced Out into Amp's balanced In with Sommer Epilogue XLR.
Chord Epic Reference-> wharfedale linton 85

 

[Viriatusrex]

I am very, very late to this party -- but I do have a thought to share (for better or for worse ). @Viriatusrex, what is your source componenet?
Is there any chance that there could be DC riding on the input signal?

Apologies if I am clutching at straws -- it popped into mind as I skimmed the last couple of pages & so I figured it wouldn't hurt to mention.
YMMV, of course.

Folllowing your post and as an answer ive posted my chain just above, thank you very much

 

[Audiofire]

It's quite other way around. All stereo Yamahas I ever encountered had a good worked out passive cooling and good optimised PCB placement paired with good quality capacitors, even the cheep ones. Transformers are either iron core or toroidal and quite good quality and noise characteristics. Usually they don't get uncomfortably hot on tuch even driven relatively hard.

Oh well. We can agree that Yamaha has done good work. I was thinking about this unit that has issues.

 

[Viriatusrex]

It's quite other way around. All stereo Yamahas I ever encountered had a good worked out passive cooling and good optimised PCB placement paired with good quality capacitors, even the cheep ones. Transformers are either iron core or toroidal and quite good quality and noise characteristics. Usually they don't get uncomfortably hot on tuch even driven relatively hard.
Thing is if you can lower down capacitor temperature for 20° they will last more than twice as long. And this is easy and cheap enough too do with active cooling still keeping the noise under residential level and avoiding pitch low fundamental which can be annoying. If you love your equipment you will do it. The from factory fans are far from great usually old durable double ball bearing producing grinding sound and not pressure optimised.

Nope... Use 2 fans... Both above the heatsink(s) in the amp. That way they can rotate slower, make less noise and move more air doing that. Yamaha is dragging it's feet on this one. That is if it got the first message you sent them. If you go 140mm use 2 again above the heatsink(s). The idea is to stop thermal protection from engaging and to extend the life of this beautiful amp. The cooler the amp runs the longer it lives.

Hello everyone!
A quick update after my vacation:
I've been using the amp leaving more space over it (about 30cm/1 foot), and so far I haven't noticed any soundgaps, however it still gets quite hot so Ill get the fans to cool it down.
I still dont understand how is it possible that so many people have gear stacked over these amps in enclosed spaces...
From my contacts with Yamaha the only thing they did was reffering me to a list of tech support suppliers in my country... nothing else.
The toroidal still makes the hum so Im just waiting to find a dc blocker+ at a decent price to install it, are there any risks of letting the amp hum for some time more?

 

[DSJR]

Hello everyone!
A quick update after my vacation:
I've been using the amp leaving more space over it (about 30cm/1 foot), and so far I haven't noticed any soundgaps, however it still gets quite hot so Ill get the fans to cool it down.
I still dont understand how is it possible that so many people have gear stacked over these amps in enclosed spaces...
From my contacts with Yamaha the only thing they did was reffering me to a list of tech support suppliers in my country... nothing else.
The toroidal still makes the hum so Im just waiting to find a dc blocker+ at a decent price to install it, are there any risks of letting the amp hum for some time more?

Silly question, but on the 'DC on input vibe, can you disconnect all inputs, turn volume to minimum and then power on to see if it warms up the same?

I had a CA1000mk2 thirty years ago, gifted back to me by the gent I sold it to in 1976... Set to 'Class A,' it got very warm to the touch on its air vents, but certainly not to egg-frying temperatures as say, the awful Musical Fidelity A1 did on its fluted top cover (these latter things became a cult product and measurements were the pits, deliberately I reckon)

 

[dualazmak]

I do believe your A-S2200 is still under its warranty period, and the "heating-up" is definitely abnormal. I highly recommend you to contact with the dealer and/or Yamaha requesting replacement with brand new A-S2200. After you would receive new A-S2200, you again may discuss with them for the return/shipping (on their cost) of your defect A-S2200 to Yamaha.

I never have/had such abnormal heating-up issue at all with my A-S3000 and A-S301 even in this stacking layout.

 

[Viriatusrex]

I do believe your A-S2200 is still under its warranty period, and the "heating-up" is definitely abnormal. I highly recommend you to contact with the dealer and/or Yamaha requesting replacement with brand new A-S2200. After you would receive new A-S2200, you again may discuss with them for the return/shipping (on their cost) of your defect A-S2200 to Yamaha.

I never have/had such abnormal heating-up issue at all with my A-S3000 and A-S301 even in this stacking layout.
View attachment 388751

Yes, it is in warranty. I have just now sent an email to the retailer claiming for the replacement. Even with 30 cm above the AS-2200 after a couple of hours i notice the wood top above the amp is warm and this is not a class A amp. Awesome setup (actually the word "installation" is better!)!!

 

[dualazmak]

Awesome setup (actually the word "installation" is better!)!!

If you would be interested, please visit my post #931 on my project thread for the details of my latest multichannel audio system.

 

[Viriatusrex]

If you would be interested, please visit my post #931 on my project thread for the details of my latest multichannel audio system.

Yes, i've just went through it! Mindblowing! A true work of love! Congratulations!

 

[dualazmak]

My new thread started on August 19 would be also of your interest and reference, I assume.
Let's share diagrams (and photos) of our total physical audio system and the whole signal path, with a few words and/or links
- https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/lets-share-diagrams-and-photos-of-our-total-physical-audio-system-and-the-whole-signal-path-with-a-few-words-and-or-links.56410/

 

[Jmudrick]

The old MX-630 is a classic and was a real bargain at the time (about 1991/92).

I recently picked up a beautiful pair of Snell J/II speakers and an MX-630 for a song and am loving the experience. As noted the MX-630 doesn't even get warm.

 

[Audiofire]

 

[SacreDro]

I do believe your A-S2200 is still under its warranty period, and the "heating-up" is definitely abnormal. I highly recommend you to contact with the dealer and/or Yamaha requesting replacement with brand new A-S2200. After you would receive new A-S2200, you again may discuss with them for the return/shipping (on their cost) of your defect A-S2200 to Yamaha.

I never have/had such abnormal heating-up issue at all with my A-S3000 and A-S301 even in this stacking layout.
View attachment 388751

How does the Sony compare regarding thebother amps?

 

[dualazmak]

How does the Sony compare regarding thebother amps?

I assume you are focusing on Sony TA-A1ES quasi-class-A integrated amplifier I use as one of the four integrated amps in my multichannel audio rig (ref. #931 on my project thread), right? (Sony CANADA still has the English product web page for TA-A1ES.)

In my project, I selected and evaluated TA-A1ES mainly for driving tweeters and super-tweeters expecting high SINAD operation (or expecting high S/N in high-Fq due to Class-A mode) which does not request much amplifier "power". My post #435 would be of your interest in this regard;
- Even Greg Timbers uses "reasonable and budget" Pioneer Elite A-20 for compression drivers (super tweeters) in his extraordinary expensive multichannel stereo system with JBL Everest DD67000 which he himself designed and developed: #435

After having your kind understanding on the above, you would please find my evaluation on SONY TA-A1ES in my these posts on the project thread;
- Possibilities of Sony TA-A1ES (quasi class-A) and Yamaha A-S3000 (class-AB) in multichannel multi-amplifier project: #302, #305
- Yamaha A-S3000 (class-AB) and Sony TA-A1ES (quasi class-A)_Part-1_In single-amplifier + LC-network full range audio system: #307
- Yamaha A-S3000 (class-AB) and Sony TA-A1ES (quasi class-A)_Part-2_In In bi-amp + LC-network stereo system together with Accuphase E-460: #308
- Yamaha A-S3000 (class-AB) and Sony TA-A1ES (quasi class-A)_Part-3_In multichannel multi-amplifier stereo system together with Accuphase E460: #309
- (Provisional) Decision on amplifiers selection and photos of the listening environments: #311

This web article would be also of your reference, I assume; I hope your web browser would properly translate it into English;
- https://www.phileweb.com/review/article/201409/08/1344.html