Do all Studio Monitors sound the same?

[guy soundy]

I know the title sounds a bit stupid, but what I am really asking is: Studio monitors are designed to be neutral so does that mean they all are very close in the way the sound to one another regardless of the components and box design? I was thinking of getting other Studio Monitors after having tried the Kali 8-IN (which imo sounded a bit to hollow when vocals came in play), but if others are not too different there wouldn't be much of a point with bothering.

 

[mj30250]

No. Whether designed to be or not, not all studio monitors actually are neutral on-axis. Even if they were, there a plenty of other areas where performance can deviate, such as:

Off-axis performance
Directivity
Dispersion width
Distortion / compression
Maximum SPL
Bass extension

Also, some can be tuned using proprietary manufacturer room correction, such as GLM (Genelec) and MA 1 (Neumann). Others require a manual process.

 

[fpitas]

I'll add, the label "Studio Monitor" has been stretched to the breaking point by manufacturers of cheap small speakers. Caveat emptor.

 

[DVDdoug]

No. I don't actually know how close they can be, but I'd say it's very rare for any two (different) monitors/speakers to sound the same in a blind listening test... I've never personally heard two speakers that sounded the same and I've never heard of different speakers that sound the same.... Maybe.... But I've never heard of it.


But with good monitors (and a good acoustic space) there shouldn't be any major defects or deficiencies. And monitor with an 8-inch woofer would need a subwoofer to go-along with it in order to get deep, strong, accurate, "realistic" bass...

If a mixing or mastering engineer is working in a new or unknown studio they will have to learn the monitors (and the room) and learn how to make good mixes on them. But they usually have a known-good reference track (or two) so they can adapt to the differences. And most pros will check their mix on multiple ("less perfect") setups before releasing their production, so they are not just relying on the studio monitors.

And they might decline an "upgrade" because it would learning the new monitors.

 

[mj30250]

I'll add, the label "Studio Monitor" has been stretched to the breaking point by manufacturers of cheap small speakers. Caveat emptor.

The breaking point has already been breached. A "high-definition studio monitor" just posted today:

 

[kemmler3D]

Good studio monitors should sound pretty close, if you sit nearfield and use them in a room that diminishes the influence of off-axis sound. Even so, to find two speakers that sound "the same" you'd have to find two speakers that have less than (say) 1dB difference in frequency response both on AND off-axis... i.e. not only the FR but the polars look the same, both with virtually inaudible distortion. I am not sure if such a pair of monitors exists.

Under the right conditions I am sure you could find some monitors that are sorta hard to tell apart, but I'd be quite surprised if you could find any that are IMPOSSIBLE to tell apart.

 

[guy soundy]

The breaking point has already been breached. A "high-definition studio monitor" just posted today:

View attachment 299777

Good studio monitors should sound pretty close, if you sit nearfield and use them in a room that diminishes the influence of off-axis sound. Even so, to find two speakers that sound "the same" you'd have to find two speakers that have less than (say) 1dB difference in frequency response both on AND off-axis... i.e. not only the FR but the polars look the same, both with virtually inaudible distortion. I am not sure if such a pair of monitors exists.

Under the right conditions I am sure you could find some monitors that are sorta hard to tell apart, but I'd be quite surprised if you could find any that are IMPOSSIBLE to tell apart.

No. I don't actually know how close they can be, but I'd say it's very rare for any two (different) monitors/speakers to sound the same in a blind listening test... I've never personally heard two speakers that sounded the same and I've never heard of different speakers that sound the same.... Maybe.... But I've never heard of it.


But with good monitors (and a good acoustic space) there shouldn't be any major defects or deficiencies. And monitor with an 8-inch woofer would need a subwoofer to go-along with it in order to get deep, strong, accurate, "realistic" bass...

If a mixing or mastering engineer is working in a new or unknown studio they will have to learn the monitors (and the room) and learn how to make good mixes on them. But they usually have a known-good reference track (or two) so they can adapt to the differences. And most pros will check their mix on multiple ("less perfect") setups before releasing their production, so they are not just relying on the studio monitors.

And they might decline an "upgrade" because it would learning the new monitors.

I'll add, the label "Studio Monitor" has been stretched to the breaking point by manufacturers of cheap small speakers. Caveat emptor.

So how should someone know where to draw the line in wherever it's worthy of the label and which are just plastered on despite being of lesser quality?

 

[Pearljam5000]

Even Genelecs and Neumanns sound completely different

 

[kemmler3D]

So how should someone know where to draw the line in wherever it's worthy of the label and which are just plastered on despite being of lesser quality?

I would say the minimum spec for something that I would use for monitoring myself: Should be flat (say +/- 2dB from 100hz to at least 18khz, ideally 20khz) on-axis with very low distortion at 85dB SPL, and it should be capable of peaks of 95-100dB @ 1m without anything weird happening to the sound.

I'd use it with subs but I wouldn't want the roll-off any higher than 60hz or so on the monitor itself.

I'd also really prefer something with very smooth off-axis response if I were going to use it for mixing, but I wouldn't say that's a minimum qualification for the cheapest item you could legitimately call "a monitor".

 

[theREALdotnet]

Even Genelecs and Neumanns sound completely different

I wouldn’t even be surprised if two speakers of a pair sounded different. Sample variation is an important characteristic of a production speaker model, but not something that is usually evaluated (for obvious reasons).

 

[SuicideSquid]

So how should someone know where to draw the line in wherever it's worthy of the label and which are just plastered on despite being of lesser quality?

Is it sold by a reputable dealer of professional recording equipment? Is it manufactured by JBL, KRK, Yamaha, Neumann, Dynaudio, Mackie, Adam, Focal, ATC, or Genelec? It's an actual studio monitor.

Is it a brand you never heard of being sold on Amazon for >$200? It's a powered speaker, but it's not a studio monitor.

 

[BeerBear]

I wonder if the label "studio monitor" makes any sense at all, in terms of sound characteristics. Even decades ago there were tests that failed to spot any obvious patterns between "hi-fi" and "monitor" speakers: https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/monitors-vs-hi-fi-speakers-part-1

I guess distinguishing between nearfield, midfield and farfield speakers makes sense, because it indicates the optimal setup. But... monitors? Why not just drop this label and stop confusing people.

 

[DSJR]

Problem over here is being able to listen to a pair, let alone a comparison.

 

[Josq]

Even Genelecs and Neumanns sound completely different

"Slightly different" would not surprise me, but "completely different" does surprise me. What kind of differences?

 

[Pearljam5000]

"Slightly different" would not surprise me, but "completely different" does surprise me. What kind of differences?

KH120 vs 8030C
KH120 sounder darker to me , that's why I sold them
8030 were.brighter and more detailed
I don't want to go into that whole Sennheiser veil , but It felt like it was happing a little with KH120.
KH120 had more bass , but tonality felt different between them overall
I felt the Genelecs sounded more natural

 

[FrantzM]

Even Genelecs and Neumanns sound completely different

Based on?

Peace.

 

[Pearljam5000]

Based on?

Peace.

hearing both

 

[fineMen]

Under the right conditions I am sure you could find some monitors that are sorta hard to tell apart, but I'd be quite surprised if you could find any that are IMPOSSIBLE to tell apart.

You implicate the conclusion that nobody at home will be able to listen to a recording as it was intendend to sound by the studio. Do you give up the idea of high-fidelity?

 

[Ellebob]

I think the term monitor is not good and except for pro purposes they should drop nearfield, midfield, etc

Coincidentally, I was just at a customers yesterday who is down sizing and due to WAF is not taking his Thiel towers with him. He has been demoing book shelf speaker but has been hesitant as he doesn't think a book shelf speaker can fill his room with sound. Others on forums like this keep telling him if you sit more than 6 feet away you need big speakers. We told him except for bass a bookshelf will be fine and might want to supplement with a small sub. He said he has been reading and they are only good if you sit close.

We wanted to him to hear some Genelecs but he said he would definitely not go with them due to aesthetics. We said why don't you try these Kali that we have in stock here and see if bookshelves will work for you. So, we brought him a pair of IN-8s with WS-12 sub. He was shocked. We played material for 3 hours with and without the sub and we let him keep them for a while even though we know he will go with someone else. The KH120 and KH150 he would consider. He is looking for speakers in white.

He was shocked, he couldn't believe bookshelves would work. They played louder than he would ever play and we were sitting 14 feet away. He will never come close to reference level. For certain material he said it was fine without a sub but for other material he appreciated it. He would definitely go with a small sub but is fine with bookshelves now. He also likes the Kali better than his Thiels which surprised him and me.

His search will continue and I recommended some brands and models for him to try. Where I work is not a retail store so we don't do a lot of demos. We can order speakers and equipment but don't have a lot in stock. We are not offended if he buys elsewhere.

Anyway, all the talk that you need some large speaker if you sit more than 2m away is doing an injustice for people that will never listen loud. I understand why the pro market labels near field, etc. But, in reality there is nothing different about a bookshelf speaker and studio monitor and either is fine for the home depending on one's desires.

 

[bodhi]

Anyway, all the talk that you need some large speaker if you sit more than 2m away is doing an injustice for people that will never listen loud. I understand why the pro market labels near field, etc. But, in reality there is nothing different about a bookshelf speaker and studio monitor and either is fine for the home depending on one's desires.

Well said! Bookshelves have their limits and some of the small for-desktop speakers just don't cut it in medium/large rooms, but many of the affordable bookshelf speakers that are appreciated here will work great for most people in most situations.

Most people are not everyone, but they are (amazingly) majority of people.