Haha you know I like graphs and read them all, obviously. Since you asked, I would say it would be better if you could post the before and after so we can see the effects of ART in a relative sense. ART is supposed to help in reducing room induced resonances, in ways better than DLBC alone can do, such effects are measurable and the REW graphs should be able to show the differences that are easily visible. How much the differences would translate into audible differences or not would depend on the individual listener, and, obviously their rooms. Some rooms are naturally better in terms of resonances, room modes, reflections etc., and those that don't do as well should understandable benefit more by ART.There are also some senior (aka knowledgable) members that were surprised with REW results. I can tell you, for whatever it is worth, that ART has a sound signature that is very different than Audy or DLBC. It will announce its presence and it will be acknowledged.
I spend like 3 hours setting up ART and 2 days to test with movie content as had to travel, but what I heard is amazing. I still do have some questions, but on a first date I did fall in love.
Not sure if you have seen these. For 3 hours of tweak, this is more than I could ever hope for. More to come in due time.
Dirac ART is now running on beta FW for Denon Xx800H AVRs!
Could CEC from some connected HDMI device somehow cause this problem? As i have Pc and Bluray in and only Pc screen on output.
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Denon AVR-X4700 AVR Review (Updated)
- Thread starter amirm
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Will do DLBC vs ART once back home.
But not going back to Audy. That was great setup but never produced really great graphs. And really difficult to explain how it works and how different settings impact the output - which at this point is more irrelevant than ever. This is what was available with REW and Audy (or Storm) trying to do something remotely similar, but quite different, to what ART does. Ditching the crossovers and distributing the bass load - although we were not really able to do it nearly as good as ART does.
But not going back to Audy. That was great setup but never produced really great graphs. And really difficult to explain how it works and how different settings impact the output - which at this point is more irrelevant than ever. This is what was available with REW and Audy (or Storm) trying to do something remotely similar, but quite different, to what ART does. Ditching the crossovers and distributing the bass load - although we were not really able to do it nearly as good as ART does.
Wish I had my Audy-Editor graphs to post but lost it in a computer death by lightning a couple years back. I kept procrastinating over remeasuring it but now it's all gone along with the Denon 4700 it was in. I can say I thought it was very impressive for the Editor. With Editor loaded and run on my computer with Bluestacks emulation on a 32" monitor, making small minor adjustments to the curves was easy-peasy, unlike most folks trying to do so on a tiny smartphone screen.
Time will tell.
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Trying to setup on phone would drive most people nuts, even a pad, so I definitely get it.Wish I had my Audy-Editor graphs to post but lost it in a computer death by lightning a couple years back. I kept procrastinating over remeasuring it but now it's all gone along with the Denon 4700 it was in. I can say I thought it was very impressive for the Editor. With Editor loaded and run on my computer with Bluestacks emulation on a 32" monitor, making small minor adjustments to the curves was easy-peasy, unlike most folks trying to do so on a tiny smartphone screen.
Time will tell.
Going by memory though, was the result better/worse than mine, with 1/12 smoothing?
That's less than 2 dB peak to peak, or less than +/- 1 dB, 20-125 Hz. All done by the $20 app, and using Ratbuddssey to enter the boosts/cuts (mainly cuts obviously), and verifed with REW after each time, so trial and error to some degree. It would have much easier/faster to get similar results with the $200 MultEQ X but then I would have gotten 1/4 of the fun by paying $180 more.
Looking that good that I could marry that graph - but that was without LFE+main and LFE distribution right? Also, did you sweep at some higher SPL levels?Going by memory though, was the result better/worse than mine, with 1/12 smoothing?
That's less than 2 dB peak to peak, or less than +/- 1 dB, 20-125 Hz. All done by the $20 app, and using Ratbuddssey to enter the boosts/cuts (mainly cuts obviously), and verifed with REW after each time, so trial and error to some degree. It would have much easier/faster to get similar results with the $200 MultEQ X but then I would have gotten 1/4 of the fun by paying $180 more.
View attachment 483498
Pretty sure that one was just Main (Front left/right+sub1 and sub2), ie. stereo. I have swept 7.2 as well but that was long time ago when I was using the AVR-4308CI, AV7005 and AV8801. With the X4400H and AVM70, I didn't bother checking with REW on anything other than, FL, FR, FL+FR+Sub1+Sub2. Yes I have used higher SPL levels but usually around 75 dB.
Right - shows great response and perhaps that sometimes less is more. I have been digging deep into the full Audy capabilities, with some cool results. But as noted in some other posts, this is not really useful with ART being widely available.
What we did before was just a rebellion against the crossover and bass distribution concept as that never made sense - but luckily it all get solved by ART. We can safely forget about the past. It was a start, but obviously not the end of it.
What we did before was just a rebellion against the crossover and bass distribution concept as that never made sense - but luckily it all get solved by ART. We can safely forget about the past. It was a start, but obviously not the end of it.
By the way, I swept my DLBC stereo setup yesterday and got the following:
You can see that it did a good job with frequency response, but the spectrograms did not look as good as yours, that's why I was hoping you would do one with DLBC vs ART. I know the ART one would have a cleaner spectrogram but curious to see how much better it would look.
For comparison purposes, mine's for L+R+ two subs.
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I will definitively do one, but might take a while as traveling. Will also try to do sweeps at 85 and 115dB, as sure they will look quite different. My subs are great at 85dB, but they will add quite a bit of delay at 115dB with both DLBC and ART.
We are often looking at these charts, but not don't really have a common anchor SPL point. I can extrapolate to some extent, but that's really just the effect of the too much info I got to deal with these thighs. As I am sure you have experienced the same or similar.
We are often looking at these charts, but not don't really have a common anchor SPL point. I can extrapolate to some extent, but that's really just the effect of the too much info I got to deal with these thighs. As I am sure you have experienced the same or similar.
I would have never attempted to sweep at such high level, but found one that was at around 80 dB average back in 2020 when I was using the X4400H, no tweaking, just ran XT32 SubEQ HT, don't remember it I used the App or just the AVR, mostly the App though.
From memory, level at up to the 85 dB level (average), I never notices it made any differences in the measurements, except when I swept the tiny Fosi amp, the V3 or the BT20A, but that's understanding because I was using it with the LS50 that are not very sensitive and would dip quite low at the deep bass range, that's where I could easily see the effects of the level it was sweep with.
I could not find one that I kept everything the same except changing the sweep level, definitely had done those but it's hard to find them from so many.
@Oddball , just thought of something, "compression", depending on how you did it, if you went as high as 115 dB (assuming you were wearing ear protection stuff?) the results could well be quite different due to compression, among other possibilities.
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WaynesterUK
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Hi folks
I have had an issue with my Denon AVC-X4700H in the last 4 weeks, speakers suddenly making a loud popping sound and then going into protection mode (flashing red light) with the Audyssey setup screen then appearing on my TV and the units display
I did a full factory reset, unplugged everything and it hasn’t done it again.. checked every speaker cable, every HDMI, etc etc
How can a factory reset fix my protection mode issue? Or will this issue return ?
or if anybody else has this issue, what was causing the issue or fault ?
See video here of the issue
share.icloud.com
I then recalibrated everything on my iPad using the Audyssey app
My AV receiver was bought December 2024 from Richer Sounds in Oxford, it was a “trade in” item
They refuse to help fix it
My system is as follows
2 x Front floor standing speakers
1 x centre speaker
2 x upward firing Dolby Atmos speakers
(Sit on top of my floorstanders)
2 x surround speakers
1 x Subwoofer
all Monitor Audio Bronze 6G Speakers but with a BK Electronics Subwoofer
65” LG C4 OLED TV
I have had an issue with my Denon AVC-X4700H in the last 4 weeks, speakers suddenly making a loud popping sound and then going into protection mode (flashing red light) with the Audyssey setup screen then appearing on my TV and the units display
I did a full factory reset, unplugged everything and it hasn’t done it again.. checked every speaker cable, every HDMI, etc etc
How can a factory reset fix my protection mode issue? Or will this issue return ?
or if anybody else has this issue, what was causing the issue or fault ?
See video here of the issue
iCloud Photos - Apple iCloud
View, organize, and share photos and videos with iCloud Photos on the web. Changes will sync across your devices with iCloud.
share.icloud.com
I then recalibrated everything on my iPad using the Audyssey app
My AV receiver was bought December 2024 from Richer Sounds in Oxford, it was a “trade in” item
They refuse to help fix it
My system is as follows
2 x Front floor standing speakers
1 x centre speaker
2 x upward firing Dolby Atmos speakers
(Sit on top of my floorstanders)
2 x surround speakers
1 x Subwoofer
all Monitor Audio Bronze 6G Speakers but with a BK Electronics Subwoofer
65” LG C4 OLED TV
If the factory reset solved the issue hard to know if its permanent or will return. I'd have tried a simple soft reset first (unplug the avr from power for a bit) before a full reset. Glitches happen.Hi folks
I have had an issue with my Denon AVC-X4700H in the last 4 weeks, speakers suddenly making a loud popping sound and then going into protection mode (flashing red light) with the Audyssey setup screen then appearing on my TV and the units display
I did a full factory reset, unplugged everything and it hasn’t done it again.. checked every speaker cable, every HDMI, etc etc
How can a factory reset fix my protection mode issue? Or will this issue return ?
or if anybody else has this issue, what was causing the issue or fault ?
See video here of the issue
iCloud Photos - Apple iCloud
View, organize, and share photos and videos with iCloud Photos on the web. Changes will sync across your devices with iCloud.
I then recalibrated everything on my iPad using the Audyssey app
My AV receiver was bought December 2024 from Richer Sounds in Oxford, it was a “trade in” item
They refuse to help fix it
My system is as follows
2 x Front floor standing speakers
1 x centre speaker
2 x upward firing Dolby Atmos speakers
(Sit on top of my floorstanders)
2 x surround speakers
1 x Subwoofer
all Monitor Audio Bronze 6G Speakers but with a BK Electronics Subwoofer
65” LG C4 OLED TV
Steve Dallas
Major Contributor
Hi folks
I have had an issue with my Denon AVC-X4700H in the last 4 weeks, speakers suddenly making a loud popping sound and then going into protection mode (flashing red light) with the Audyssey setup screen then appearing on my TV and the units display
I did a full factory reset, unplugged everything and it hasn’t done it again.. checked every speaker cable, every HDMI, etc etc
How can a factory reset fix my protection mode issue? Or will this issue return ?
or if anybody else has this issue, what was causing the issue or fault ?
See video here of the issue
iCloud Photos - Apple iCloud
View, organize, and share photos and videos with iCloud Photos on the web. Changes will sync across your devices with iCloud.
I then recalibrated everything on my iPad using the Audyssey app
My AV receiver was bought December 2024 from Richer Sounds in Oxford, it was a “trade in” item
They refuse to help fix it
My system is as follows
2 x Front floor standing speakers
1 x centre speaker
2 x upward firing Dolby Atmos speakers
(Sit on top of my floorstanders)
2 x surround speakers
1 x Subwoofer
all Monitor Audio Bronze 6G Speakers but with a BK Electronics Subwoofer
65” LG C4 OLED TV
Mine had exactly those symptoms. The support team said at least one amp was failing and had me send it to a repair center to be fixed. I sold it as soon as I got it back and bought a 4800.
If the issue came back and it turns out to be a Denon amp issue, I would be tempted to try using the 4700 in full preamp mode with an external amp. It's possible by passing the internal amps might extend its useful life.
Well, with my 4700, I will rarely hear a loud pop sound while watching a movie but it doesn't repeat. I am running a 5.1 system and I have separate amps for my front L/R and center speakers, so I don't understand why it would be clipping any channel. The only speakers driven by the 4700 are the surround L/R speakers. But the sound does not seem to come from behind. Other than that extremely rare pop sound, it seems to work fine. But it still doesn't sound as good as the 5200 I had.
Denon has made great strides in the performance of their AV line since 2014.
I would imagine any real differences you perceive might come from different DRC (Audyssey?) setup curves.
Otherwise it's often true that a nostalgic but flawed human memory sees things thru rose colored gasses.
Thanks, well, I don't use DRC or Audyssey. I set them up the same way and there was immediately a difference in the sound, with the 5200's musicality missing from the 4700. Right, I know it's a subjective term. But it was most noticeable on musical scores in Blu-ray movies.Denon has made great strides in the performance of their AV line since 2014.
I would imagine any real differences you perceive might come from different DRC (Audyssey?) setup curves.
Otherwise it's often true that a nostalgic but flawed human memory sees things thru rose colored gasses.
Uh huh.
