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Can anyone explain the vinyl renaissance?

mhardy6647

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Polonium 210 decays with the production of alpha particles (helium nuclei) which are actually quite good for neutralizing (negatively charged) static.
The early Zerostat "guns" used polonium.

FWIW I think the use of jaguar hair is way weirder -- especially from the ecologically-conscious perspective of nowadays. ;)
 

oceansize

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Polonium 210 decays with the production of alpha particles (helium nuclei) which are actually quite good for neutralizing (negatively charged) static.
The early Zerostat "guns" used polonium.

FWIW I think the use of jaguar hair is way weirder -- especially from the ecologically-conscious perspective of nowadays. ;)
Also quite good for neutralizing troublesome dissidents.
 

Angsty

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Polonium 210 decays with the production of alpha particles (helium nuclei) which are actually quite good for neutralizing (negatively charged) static.
The early Zerostat "guns" used polonium.

FWIW I think the use of jaguar hair is way weirder -- especially from the ecologically-conscious perspective of nowadays. ;)
Not really convinced that I want it in my house...

"Polonium-210 (Po-210) is a radioactive material that occurs naturally in the earth’s crust at very low levels. Po-210 is a product of the radioactive decay of uranium-238, which decays to radon-222 and then to polonium. Polonium 210 has a half-life of 138 days. Po-210 emits alpha particles, which carry high amounts of energy that can damage or destroy genetic material in cells inside the body. ...

Po-210 is naturally present in soil at very low concentrations which are not harmful to humans or animals. It can be emitted into the atmosphere since it is a product of the decay of radon gas, or during the production of phosphorus, but is generally also in very small quantities. ...

Po-210 is a radiation hazard only if it is taken into the body through breathing or eating or by entering a wound. If large quantities are inhaled or consumed in a fairly short period of time, this “internal contamination” can cause radiation exposure of internal organs, which can result in serious medical symptoms or death."

 

mhardy6647

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as is ricin - a molecule that I know a lot more about than I do about polonium. :oops:

1673996608886.png


My first job in biotech was with a company that was, at the time, making immunotoxins for cancer chemotherapy using an interestingly modified version of ricin. We had on the order of 500 grams of ricin on-site at our clinical manufacturing facility in those days.
 

mhardy6647

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Not really convinced that I want it in my house...

"Polonium-210 (Po-210) is a radioactive material that occurs naturally in the earth’s crust at very low levels. Po-210 is a product of the radioactive decay of uranium-238, which decays to radon-222 and then to polonium. Polonium 210 has a half-life of 138 days. Po-210 emits alpha particles, which carry high amounts of energy that can damage or destroy genetic material in cells inside the body. ...

Po-210 is naturally present in soil at very low concentrations which are not harmful to humans or animals. It can be emitted into the atmosphere since it is a product of the decay of radon gas, or during the production of phosphorus, but is generally also in very small quantities. ...

Po-210 is a radiation hazard only if it is taken into the body through breathing or eating or by entering a wound. If large quantities are inhaled or consumed in a fairly short period of time, this “internal contamination” can cause radiation exposure of internal organs, which can result in serious medical symptoms or death."

It used to be common in smoke detectors, but I think the ones that use radioactive materials ("ionization detectors") have mostly switched to americium-241.
 

antcollinet

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as is ricin - a molecule that I know a lot more about than I do about polonium. :oops:

View attachment 257906

My first job in biotech was with a company that was, at the time, making immunotoxins for cancer chemotherapy using an interestingly modified version of ricin. We had on the order of 500 grams of ricin on-site at our clinical manufacturing facility in those days.
So enough to kill about 2.5 million people at 0.2mg each :eek:
 

oceansize

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as is ricin - a molecule that I know a lot more about than I do about polonium. :oops:

View attachment 257906

My first job in biotech was with a company that was, at the time, making immunotoxins for cancer chemotherapy using an interestingly modified version of ricin. We had on the order of 500 grams of ricin on-site at our clinical manufacturing facility in those days.
Rïcïnn? I've got this on vinyl - wonderful record!

 

MattHooper

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I said frustrated, not dishonest. Sheesh. Saying I thought dishonest, now that’s dishonest.

Even though I’m told that nobody here disputes that vinyl is surpassed and audibly so, all those same people get visibly upset when anyone says what is apparently not disputed. The best explanation for this contradiction is that they very strongly do dispute it, privately, but won’t say so in the forum because they know they can’t justify it.

My position has been to acknowledge the obvious fact digital is the technically superior medium, but also that I enjoy playing records for many reasons, including that I often like the sound too.

There is no "contradiction." It's a figment of your imagination.

What you are saying is that, even though I have often explained that I don't dispute the technical superiority of digital (and how this can benefit sonically), IN FACT I "very strongly do dispute it" but won't say so. Thus, in what I write, I'm being dishonest about my actual beliefs are. I actually believe the opposite.

So please, no "what, lil' old me? I never called anyone dishonest" act. Nobody would be buying it.

That is, presuming I am one of "all those same people" you keep referring to. If I'm not, say so.

And then, why not actually show who "those people" are that you are actually talking about, so we can see if this isn't yet another strawman.

Basically it seems you want to keep "some people" in some weird anti-digital camp and should they hold a nuanced position that doesn't allow you to do so,
you fall back to just saying "well, they believe what I think they do anyway!"

Yeesh.
 
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teashea

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As I type, I'm listening to a Tone Poet jazz reissue with a new-to-me SUT using a Shibata-tipped cartridge. Say all you want about how digital is more accurate than vinyl (it is), but I am enjoying the hell out of what I'm playing!

That's what the vinyl renaissance is all about, Charlie Brown.
No one is saying you cannot enjoy vinyl. But viny does not reproduce the source material as accurately as digital. I listen vinyl (eight turntables and >20 cartridges) and enjoy it but I do not suffer the delusion that it is an accurate reproduction. It is fun and enjoyable. The harmonic distortion and rolloff of the frequencies do make it sound pleasant. Not true to the source but pleasant.
 

Angsty

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The harmonic distortion and rolloff of the frequencies do make it sound pleasant. Not true to the source but pleasant.
Perhaps I’d say, vinyl is “true to the source” with a wider margin of error than digital. Music over vinyl still sounds like music; sometimes spectacularly so.
 

mhardy6647

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So enough to kill about 2.5 million people at 0.2mg each :eek:
easy-peasy. :)
We had to get special dispensation from the government (via then Senator Ted Kennedy) to have that much of the stuff.
We actually had a very interesting and elegant way to irreversibly modify the carbohydrate-binding B chain, essentially by affinity labeling, to reduce the non-specific cytotoxicity of intact (two chain) ricin when attached to (in our case) a monoclonal antibody designed to target cancer cells (B cell lymphomas, in the case of the proof-of-concept drug). Long story short, it was very promising in animal studies and in Phase I trials, but failed in pivotal trials. I'll spare all y'all the details, as there was absolutely no vinyl involved. Cyanuric chloride, yes, but no vinyl chloride. ;)

mfcd00006046-medium.png


Ricin is a really elegant molecule, designed by evolution ;) to kill cells with incredible efficiency. The B chain binds to cell surface carbohydrate (my specialty, you see) and is involved in the internalization and intracellular targeting of the toxic "payload". The toxic part of ricin (the A chain) is an enzyme (a glycosidase, interestingly enough) that cleaves a specific residue in one of the RNA molecules that makes up the ribosome (the protein synthesis machinery) in eukaryotes, so it could catalytically kill a cell by halting protein biosynthesis. As my boss used to say, one molecule of ricin can kill a cell.

The LD50 ("lethal dose" at which 50% of a cohort of lucky animal "volunteers", in this case, mice) for injected ricin is ca. 1 microgram per kg of, umm, victim mass.

I should mention that ricin (found in castor beans) and other related plant toxins (e.g., abrin, modeccin, and the toxic lectin of mistletoe) are believed to function as a sort of proto-immune system in seeds to protect the seed - or perhaps more to the point, ultimately the generic material therein - from environmental pathogens (i.e., threats) such as molds.
 
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levimax

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The harmonic distortion and rolloff of the frequencies
Harmonic Distortion OK but please provide source for your "rolled off highs" claim. Measurements I have made with my modest set-up and a test record show no signs of HF roll off .... in fact I usually see the opposite. See actual measurements below of both distortion and FR. I am not ever sure distortion is audible on actual music at these levels.

AT33PTG2_SUT_SL1310_STR100.png
 

pablolie

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Maybe DACs should offer a "vinyl filter" as an option? Only problem is that then recordings that for some reason inject vinyl noise artifically -a practice I despise- would definitely suck with the double whammy... :-D
 

Angsty

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Measurements I have made with my modest set-up and a test record show no signs of HF roll off .... in fact I usually see the opposite.
Depends on the cartridge


 

Angsty

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Maybe DACs should offer a "vinyl filter" as an option? Only problem is that then recordings that for some reason inject vinyl noise artifically -a practice I despise- would definitely suck with the double whammy... :-D
The Topping D90LE had “valve” and “transistor” filters which emulated the distortion of some types of electronics. One problem of emulating vinyl is that the cartridge and phonostage FRs, noise and distortion curves can be quite different over models and combinations.
 

EJ3

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EJ3

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Your PC is fine for the job.
You need a web browser (Microsoft Edge comes as default with Windows 10) which will handle the download.
Storage space (2TB means you should have plenty of space - you can always add an external drive if needed). Windows has a default Music folder. Use that. Be organised - I have separate folders for each artist and each album goes into it's own folder within that.
A file manager (Windows Explorer) does everything you need, though I use 7-Zip for extracting zipped folders. (Albums generally arrive as a zipped file, though sometimes you have to download each track individually)
A music player! foobar2000 and MusicBee are both excellent choices for Windows... and there are countless others. As well as playing them, foobar can do pretty much everything you need to do with your files - it plays just about any file format, tagging, convert formats, etc - but there is a learning curve to use it to it's full potential.
If you decide that you are going to store your CDs on your computer, Exact Audio Copy is the gold standard CD ripper.

And there is plenty of help available on the net - just use Google or the search engine of your choice.
Thanks, I'll dig into this this weekend, time permitting (am being laid off Feb 1, so job hunting or side gigs may interfere with my weekend time)
 

USER

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Harmonic Distortion OK but please provide source for your "rolled off highs" claim. Measurements I have made with my modest set-up and a test record show no signs of HF roll off .... in fact I usually see the opposite. See actual measurements below of both distortion and FR. I am not ever sure distortion is audible on actual music at these levels.

View attachment 257926
You are right in contesting the idea of rolled of highs being a medium specific quality of turntables if that is what op was suggesting. The effects mentioned are related more to cartridges, though of course there is a limit to how little distortion they can reproduce and we know what the medium is capable of. From what I have seen the majority of modern cartridges have prominent highs (after the 1980s)--often due to cheaper and cheaper materials being for used for cantilevers. (MC carts generally have some peaking, no?) For the sake of fairness, the earliest stereo cartridges like most of those in this video had rolled off highs (because the technology wasn't there).


And some extremely popular and well-liked cartridges have rolled off highs, including the following:

Stanton 681EEE III - Denon DP-30L II - 1.png

Nagaoka MP-500.png

The above is from watchnerd's file on the MM v MC thread.



One funny thing is that harmonic distortion is not one of the major factors that distinguishes listening to records to me. Of course the difference is there, but I would be upset if I was aware of ooey gooey sound (like that made by a Conrad Johnson amp I used to own years and years ago). Granted I am lucky to be able to use really good cartridges.
 

drmevo

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No one is saying you cannot enjoy vinyl. But viny does not reproduce the source material as accurately as digital. I listen vinyl (eight turntables and >20 cartridges) and enjoy it but I do not suffer the delusion that it is an accurate reproduction. It is fun and enjoyable. The harmonic distortion and rolloff of the frequencies do make it sound pleasant. Not true to the source but pleasant.
Likewise, no one is saying that (the part I bolded) here at ASR. That’s the point being made by @MattHooper and others. Can you find anyone here saying vinyl has superior fidelity? It’s even admitted that it is lower fidelity in the post you’re responding to. I think we all get it.

There might be some folks conflating ASR with other audio forums, I guess, but their need to constantly and falsely assign this belief that “vinyl is superior” to the general population that enjoys the format is very tired.
 

Newman

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no one is saying that (the part I bolded) here at ASR. That’s the point being made by @MattHooper and others. Can you find anyone here saying vinyl has superior fidelity? It’s even admitted that it is lower fidelity in the post you’re responding to. I think we all get it.

There might be some folks conflating ASR with other audio forums, I guess, but their need to constantly and falsely assign this belief that “vinyl is superior” to the general population that enjoys the format is very tired.
“regarding accuracy, who is to say that digital does impose a reduction thereof by capturing only the essence of, rather than the full range of, the original tone?” ASR, Nov 2022

“Vinyl can sound more like the recording when a more natural dynamic range is preserved.” ASR, July 2022

“It does (records sound so much better than digital). It's more dynamic, natural, live, the instruments are clearer in space….” ASR, Apr 2021

That took 5 minutes. I won’t say if I dedicated a week to it I might continue to find more every 5 minutes, or maybe not, but the point is made.
 
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