After major disappointment with audio of ARCAM Sr-250 AVR, & similar disappointments reading terrible measurements on AVRs, what do I turn to for TV s

[Gringoaudio1]

Try listening to your Arcam on Direct mode.
That whole generation of Arcam had a badly designed digital board. They crap out. Everything goes through that board unless you switch to Direct. I can no longer listen to mine unless I play it through Direct stereo.

 

[Chrispy]

No, I didn’t realize that. But I do usually buy BluRay when I invest in a DVD. I just bought a BluRay version of The Grey Fox.

FWIW dvd and bluray aren't the same thing at all except they are optical discs. A dvd isn't a bluray nor is a bluray a dvd.....

 

[Echolane]

I almost bid on a Krell 4k Foundation processor on eBay. It found a very nice review on its it and it has all the latest 4k capability, and it has component video input as well as lots of analog audio input, so would satisfy my needs. But it can only be serviced by Krell. Will Krell be around in five years? What if I didn’t like the audio. Darn, I hated to pass on it, but I did. And the problem getting really good Audio with these TV devices is still a big provlem in general. HDMI is noisy. Very noisy Making good audio very very difficult. So I’m giving up on buying an AVR. I am going to look for a better HDMI switching device and that decision will keep $4k in my pocket.

 

[Chrispy]

Why get worked up about an Arcam avr to begin with? They're generally behind the 8-ball so to speak

 

[Echolane]

Why get worked up about an Arcam avr to begin with? They're generally behind the 8-ball so to speak

it was my first AVR so I was naive. Its advertising emphasized its great audio, like a true stereo receiver and targeted for people like me who are still two channel. So its deficiency in audio really caught me by surprise and it was very disappointing. Once burned, twice shy, you might say.

 

[Echolane]

Try listening to your Arcam on Direct mode.
That whole generation of Arcam had a badly designed digital board. They crap out. Everything goes through that board unless you switch to Direct. I can no longer listen to mine unless I play it through Direct stereo.

I wish I could! But it’s “dead”. It won’t power on.

 

[abdo123]

Now we know why AVR manufacturers put those analogue video inputs on AVRs sold in 2022...

A lot of people have video game consoles from their childhood that they want to use. VCRs .etc

 

[Vict0r]

Check out Amir's review on the Denon x3600h: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ds/denon-avr-x3600h-av-receiver-review.12676/

I use the x2600h (because I'm too much of a cheapskate to invest in the 3600), and I'm very satisfied with the performance for both music and media. I can only imagine how well the 3600 would perform.

 

[Beershaun]

Ls50 wireless 2? It has an HDMI eARC input and bass management with a subwoofer out. Plus other wireless and digital inputs Seems like the ultimate 2.1 system for a multi purpose tv room.

 

[Echolane]

I thought I was going to call it quits on a hunt for an AVR or an SSR and go on a renewed search for a decent HDMI switch, but I quickly got side tracked. It all came about because I phoned Crutchfield to see if they had a decent switch and was directed to one that looked a lot better than the one I have. But then I asked the agent to do a search for an AVR with at least five HDMI inputs and at least two component inputs and up came a very interesting Denon. It’s a new product as of late last year and it has 4 8k inputs along with 4 4k inputs and only 7 channels! Very nice future proofing with the 8k inputs. And the component inputs I want along with way more bells and whistles than I will use, but I’m resigned to that. The price is a very reasonable $699.

Denon AVR-X1700H

7.2-channel home theater receiver with Wi-Fi®, Bluetooth®, Apple AirPlay® 2, and Amazon Alexa compatibility

www.crutchfield.com

Then I came across another Denon product that seems made for me, an AVR stereo receiver with 5 HDMI inputs !! And two channels !! Just what I want!!

Denon Launches AV Receiver Just For Audiophiles Who Demand Pristine Stereo Sound​

https://www.forbes.com/sites/marksp...demand-pristine-stereo-sound/?sh=5b141adc5308

Of course the almost perfect product is missing something I want - component inputs, but otherwise it is a plausible choice and a product I didn’t think existed.

So to sum things up, I am finally on a path I am comfortable with for to one or the other or these two Denon products.

 

[Echolane]

Rescued by a savvy Crutchfield advisor! Turns out the component inputs I have been obsessively insisting on for next AVR will not be useable to me after all! I need component inputs for my two vintage video components but Denon does NOT translate component to HDMI internally. Instead, to make the component inputs on the Denon useful, I need to have matching component inputs on the TV! My new Sony TV not surprisingly does not have component inputs.

I am beginning to think I should give up hunting for an AVR that will fit my needs.

 

[DonR]

Rescued by a savvy Crutchfield advisor! Turns out the component inputs I have been obsessively insisting on for next AVR will not be useable to me after all! I need component inputs for my two vintage video components but Denon does NOT translate component to HDMI internally. Instead, to make the component inputs on the Denon useful, I need to have matching component inputs on the TV! My new Sony TV not surprisingly does not have component inputs.

I am beginning to think I should give up hunting for an AVR that will fit my needs.

That has usually been the preserve of higher-end models. Like 2XXX and up. Digging in a little it looks like Denon has been moving conversion up the chain for years. 10 years ago a 2XXX and even a 19XX could do video upconversion. Now you have to step up to a X4700h to get it, Last year the X3600 could do it. That is very sad to see.

 

[Echolane]

Digging in a little it looks like Denon has been moving conversion up the chain for years. 10 years ago a 2XXX and even a 19XX could do video upconversion. Now you have to step up to a X4700h to get it, Last year the X3600 could do it. That is very sad to see.

I have to clarify…the Denon x1700h I had earlier thought was so great was mischaracterized on the Crutchfield website as having component I/O. That turned out to be error in their specs as it has no component I/O. The next one up, the x2700h does have component I/O, and so on up the line from that point, BUT at least in the x2700h it does not internally convert component to HDMI. I have assumed it’s the same all the way up the model line from there. I’m not sure why they bother to include component in their products and there is no warning that I’ve seen that it is not converted to HDMI. Very odd.

 

[CapMan]

i am horribly disappointed in the audio of my AVR, an Arcam SR-250. It’s muddy sounding and unmusical and I’m a music lover that spends about 75% of the time listening to music via Roon or QOBUZ or DVD rather than watching TV. The Arcam is almost six years old now and it went down just past its five year warranty. Im not inclined to have it repaired. I came here hoping to find a replacement AVR but was disappointed to see how bad they were measuring. I turned to SSPs or Pre-Pros which are reported to be better sounding and was about to buy the Marantz SR-7705 when I saw the perfectly dreadful measurements. Where to go from here?

I have five video sources, one more than my TV will accomodate. Plus I think TVs are clumsy at switching and access to HDMI sockets on wall mounted TVs like mine are nearly impossible to reach if something needs attention or I need to make a change. So I’ve always been lusting after an AVR. I finally bought the ARCAM SR-250. It’s a two channel AVR which I chose deliberately because I have zero interest in surround sound. I don’t watch the kind of movies where surround sound is featured, and besides that as I said before, I am a music lover, especially I like opera and classical music and I listen to music most of the time via Roon or DVD. All this is to say I like really good quality audio.

to get around the bad audio on the Arcam I unboxed my vintage Pioneer SX-1050 Stereo Receiver. It had been stored in my closet for about 30 years. I ran RCA composite cables between all my video sources to the Pioneer and voila! I got excellent audio! The Arcam is now just an expensive video switcher and now that the Arcam is down, I bought a cheap 5x1 HDMI switch to replace it and I am getting by this way, but I worry that this cheap little switch will fail. The reviews on Amazon are pretty bad. And I also am wondering if I am transferring noise and distortion to my music Via that cheap little switch,

So to my point: Are there any surround sound processors (Pre-Pros) that have decent audio? If not, am I missing something else I could be doing? My vintage Pioneer is actually working quite well but it has some limitations, it has no remote control, it is shy one audio input for my needs and it is too big to fit in a compartment on my video console, I’ll probably keep it anyway, but I’d sure like something to replace that little HDMI switch.

Video sources:
DISH Hopper DVR
Oppo USP-205 DVD
Roku Streamer (plus added gadget to strip off audio from HDMI and route it to Pioneer)
Pioneer Elite CLD-99 Laser Disc (Requires S-video or component cables)
Panasonic VHS Player (Requires component cables)

View attachment 177729

Have you thought about your room set up and speaker placement ? It doesn’t look ideal having speakers close to side walls and rear walls, and being set behind a large AV cabinet.

 

[tvart]

I had to join this forum just to reply to this Post! Your SR250 must have been broken if you found the sound disappointing for stereo listening! I mean each to their own but the SR250 is a gem, great clarity but unfatiguing. Maybe its the speaker pairing. I have tried several AV receivers including Pioneer SC LX89 and they come nowhere near the Arcam in terms of sound.

Have you considered the SA30, not sure on the number of HDMI inputs but a damn good integrated set up.

 

[oupee]

If I look at the photo, I would never judge the sound! The right speaker is in the corner, so it has more bass than the left but mainly more reflections from the right wall! Every dressing room needs space around it! The hifi table is right next to the speakers and is part of the boxes, including diffractions. If you have good ears, you must have the feeling that the right box plays louder, but overall you have a completely different sound than what the manufacturer of the reprobeden wanted to give you!

 

[Willem]

From what I understand, you have two issues:
1 getting old style video signals into the tv
2 getting decent audio

My suggestion would be to keep these two issues separate.
This is how I do all this, in a similarly audio centric system:
Bluray player video into tv, using hdmi, optical digital audio from BD player into external DAC,/audio system
TV digital audio into external DAC/audio system

You already have what seems to be a glorious vintage Japanese receiver. All it needs is a decent external DAC with optical and coaxial inputs.
What remains is the problem of how to get the legacy component video gear connected to the TV. There must be adapters for that (in fact I had some) but I don't remember.
If by any chance you need automatic switching for optical/coaxial inputs, this one is excellent: https://www.tindie.com/products/beni_skate/automatic-spdif-opticalrca-audio-switch/
Maybe I am overlooking something, because it does look like a complex puzzle.

 

[curiouspeter]

What about a Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 or 3400?

If your TV has HDMI ARC, just connect your sources directly to your TV and the ARC to the amp. I think the 3400 has HDMI switching.

RoomPerfect is really good at correcting the room. Today, I turned off room correction just for fun. The soundstage suddenly collapsed. I turned it back on, it was awesome again.

If not the Lyngdorf, get something with Dirac Live. However, if you only want 2 channels, Lyngdorf is like an obvious choice.

 

[tvart]

What about a Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 or 3400?

If your TV has HDMI ARC, just connect your sources directly to your TV and the ARC to the amp. I think the 3400 has HDMI switching.

RoomPerfect is really good at correcting the room. Today, I turned off room correction just for fun. The soundstage suddenly collapsed. I turned it back on, it was awesome again.

If not the Lyngdorf, get something with Dirac Live. However, if you only want 2 channels, Lyngdorf is like an obvious choice.

Ironically I find Dirac disappointing on the SR250, best sound quality for me is always with the least processing possible (also why i sold my LS50 Wireless for passive), unless in a highly compromised setting, which is close to what the OP has

 

[curiouspeter]

Ironically I find Dirac disappointing on the SR250, best sound quality for me is always with the least processing possible (also why i sold my LS50 Wireless for passive), unless in a highly compromised setting, which is close to what the OP has

You may want to give RoomPerfect a try. It uses a different approach and it does not target a particular curve. It tries to fix the room without fixing the response of the speakers.