Denon AVR-X3600H AV Receiver Review

[retro]

I seem to recall there was a company/person who modified AVR's to get digital out from all channels inc. Atmos..
This receiver seems like a perfect candidate for this. Just add the dac's of your choice and we're way above most expensive pre/pros. We could even stick a MiniDSP Dirac in between..

 

[Putter]

If you measured the temperature you would see that it wasn't that warm, certainly well below the set point for the build in fans. That's why I always put at least one fan on top of such devices. The equivalent SR6014 will be slightly warmer because it has the extra buffer stage, the HDAM modules.

I strongly suspect that the addition of a small fans allowed them to use better components in the power supply and processors, and that's the primary reason for the improvement in SINAD and digital processing over its predecessor, the 3500H.

 

[waynel]

Out of curiosity, what other components would one have to add to the Benchmark DAC and amp to give the bass management, speaker eq, and sub eq capability that would be necessary to match the fidelity of the Denon X3600 based system? Without this, there would be no comparison on sound quality. Also(and perhaps more importantly), what would the resulting measured signal of these addition(s) be compared to the Denon?

Bass management is the problem and I could come up with no way of adding bass management to my benchmark (dac3 + ahb2) without sacrificing measured noise or distortion. Room correction can be done upstream in the digital domain with an minidsp openDRC or DiracLive unit so that’s not a problem. I’ve been using a JL-CR1 analog crossover between the dac3 and the AHB2 but that dominates the noise and distortion in the electronic signal chain (not that I can hear it). Going to try an Anthem STR preamp into the AHB2 and lose the benchmark DAC, minidsp, and JL crossover. It’s disappointed me that Benchmark will not produce any non compromised solution for integrating subs. I have suggested it to them but they are not interested.

also, I intend to eventually get on of these Denon AVR 3600 to handle all home theater but use my existing amp and subs.

 

[Jukebox]

Glad to see this measures well, i bought this for my main system as a stand in until something better came along. I've been pretty happy with it so far, have it connected as pre to benchmark amp and nord amp to my revel studio2s and m126BE. I definitely noticed that clipping with pre-outs at first if you dont have the 11.1 channel mode enabled.

BTW, this goes on sale often down to 800$ range, and you definitely need that app for audyssey to get it to work well.

I have a 5.2.2 setup and was thinking of this with a power Amp for the front LR. The best way would be to enable 11.2 and then from the speaker setup to close (assign none) whatever 4 channels I am not using?

 

[amirm]

Denon told me, while inquiring about the internal sample rate of XT32 (which is 48 kHz), that all inputs sample rates are converted to 48 kHz unless you have all DSP functions turned off or in pure direct mode. So a native 48 kHz input skips that conversion process. I'm not sure if you did the 44.1 to 48 comparison in pure direct mode that might explain the difference in SINAD?

I did test in direct and pure mode. They made no difference.

 

[QMuse]

Bass management is the problem and I could come up with no way of adding bass management to my benchmark (dac3 + ahb2) without sacrificing measured noise or distortion. Room correction can be done upstream in the digital domain with an minidsp openDRC or DiracLive unit so that’s not a problem.

You can use MinIDSP nanoDIGI 2x8B to add 2 subs, just add one more DAC to connect subs to it.

 

[waynel]

You can use MinIDSP nanoDIGI 2x8B to add 2 subs, just add one more DAC to connect subs to it.

Where would one control the volume ?

 

[QMuse]

Where would one control the volume ?

You would have to do it digitally upstream.
I'm using Volumio running on Intel fanless mini PC and there I'm doing room EQ and volume control.

 

[Jukebox]

Bass management is the problem and I could come up with no way of adding bass management to my benchmark (dac3 + ahb2) without sacrificing measured noise or distortion. Room correction can be done upstream in the digital domain with an minidsp openDRC or DiracLive unit so that’s not a problem. I’ve been using a JL-CR1 analog crossover between the dac3 and the AHB2 but that dominates the noise and distortion in the electronic signal chain (not that I can hear it). Going to try an Anthem STR preamp into the AHB2 and lose the benchmark DAC, minidsp, and JL crossover. It’s disappointed me that Benchmark will not produce any non compromised solution for integrating subs. I have suggested it to them but they are not interested.

also, I intend to eventually get on of these Denon AVR 3600 to handle all home theater but use my existing amp and subs.View attachment 59273View attachment 59272

Very good ideea with the subwoofer integration for Benchmark Dac. I discussed with other high end manufacturers but not willing to implement such features although would be much appreciated.

 

[waynel]

You would have to do it digitally upstream.
I'm using Volumio running on Intel fanless mini PC and there I'm doing room EQ and volume control.

For usability I prefer a self contained system without a computer and a physical volume control with some kind of indication of the level. Not too much to ask I hope.

 

[capt.s]

I did test in direct and pure mode. They made no difference.

Understood - Thx. It would be very interesting to see how the HDMI input compares to the coax if you had a chance......

 

[QMuse]

For usability I prefer a self contained system without a computer and a physical volume control with some kind of indication of the level. Not too much to ask I hope.

How do you play your music? Where is your DAC connected to upstream?

 

[waynel]

How do you play your music? Where is your DAC connected to upstream?

A streaming device.

 

[peng]

I have a 5.2.2 setup and was thinking of this with a power Amp for the front LR. The best way would be to enable 11.2 and then from the speaker setup to close (assign none) whatever 4 channels I am not using?

You missed at least one step, you need to:
1. Set assign mode to 11.1ch
2. Set floor layout to 5ch & SB
3. Set Height Sp to 4ch
4. Now you should be able to set Pre-out to Front regardless of your Layout for the Heights

Once that's done, you can exit that menu and then go back to the speaker menu and select your speakers according to your actual 5.1.2 setup, for example, set you Heights, Top speakers etc., to none.

 

[QMuse]

A streaming device.

Connected to DAC via coax SPDIF? If that is the case you could control volume via nanoDIGI as it has IR sensor. You cannot add bass management to your current system and continue to use volume control on DAC3.

 

[peng]

View attachment 59269View attachment 59268

I strongly suspect that the addition of a small fans allowed them to use better components in the power supply and processors, and that's the primary reason for the improvement in SINAD and digital processing over its predecessor, the 3500H.

No, as Amir explained, it measured better mainly because the 3600 let you disconnect the front left and right channel amps, otherwise at <1.5 V, say 1.2 V, the X3500H measured only a little poorer, like within 1-2 dB SINAD.

 

[Sancus]

I have a 5.2.2 setup and was thinking of this with a power Amp for the front LR. The best way would be to enable 11.2 and then from the speaker setup to close (assign none) whatever 4 channels I am not using?

E: These instructions are correct.

After that, in the Speakers -> Manual Setup -> Speaker Config menu you can turn off channels you don't need, and the AVR will only process for enabled channels. You can have 11.1ch mode enabled even if you only have a stereo pair, or any other combination.

It also doesn't matter if you make these changes before or after running Audyssey, Audyssey will ignore channels it hears no output from, but it runs faster if you have unused channels pre-disabled.

 

[Mauro]

As I mentioned before, Marantz has already confirmed pre out is not affected by ECO being "On". I can search and provide a link if you like.
I have also measured the preout with and without ECO on so I know it for a fact. It only affects the internal power amp.

Found it, see post#6:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-r...86-denon-s-eco-mode-what-does-do-exactly.html

Response By Email (NJ Customer Service & Support) (10/11/2016 12:08 PM)
Hi Michael,
When ECO Mode is used, voltage for the amp stage decreases about 1/3 and amplifier stage energy loss decreases about 1/6 compared to ECO Mode being OFF.
It is recommend when using external amplification to leave ECO Mode set to ON. This will reduce power consumption to less than 70W.
When using ECO Mode ON at lower volume levels (under 45 Absolute) power consumption is about 1/2 as compared to leaving ECO Mode OFF. This is useful if using the AVR at night and you do not want to disturb others.
When using ECO Mode Auto, the circuit will control the power supply voltage by a relay. If the volume level is more than 45 Absolute the circuit will cut off. If the volume is less than 45 Absolute the circuit will switch on automatically. If listening at the threshold level (45) you will hear the relay clicking on and off frequently. Voltage for the amp stage does not change here, so power consumption would be the same as normal.

Thank You,
D+M Custom Install

Peng enlightening as always!
But this just grows my curiosity. We still haven’t seen a newer Marantz with AK49xx dac tested here on ASR!

 

[peng]

Yes, Speakers -> Manual Setup -> Amp Assign -> Assign Mode: "11.1ch".
After that, in the Speakers -> Manual Setup -> Speaker Config menu you can turn off channels you don't need, and the AVR will only process for enabled channels. You can have 11.1ch mode enabled even if you only have a stereo pair, or any other combination.

It also doesn't matter if you make these changes before or after running Audyssey, Audyssey will ignore channels it hears no output from, but it runs faster if you have unused channels pre-disabled.

I think you might be also missing steps (unless those steps were implied). Please see my post#134 (especially step#4) just in case.

 

[Sancus]

I think you might be also missing steps (unless those steps were implied). Please see my post#134 (especially step#4) just in case.

I only have a 4500H, not this one, but when I enabled 11.1ch mode it was already selected to 5 speakers and height channels. That could be because it was using my speaker config, not sure. But there is also no explicit switch to pre-outs for fronts.

So perhaps the 3600H UI is just a bit different.

E: Not correct.