TRUTHEAR x Crinacle Zero IEM Review

[SalutaryGraveness]

I would not say "far more shouty" but 3-4 dB is "noticeably more shouty".

My same graph above but now using the ThieAudio Monarch Mk.2 as reference, which Crinnacle himself rated as "S+" tonality, looks like this below.

Again the yellow Zero is above the others in the pinna gain shout area, along with the Harman target.

AudioScienceReview's measurements are likely more accurate:

That massive 4-6db gain shown for the Zero in the super reviews database is unlikely to be real life.
It is not 'shouty' compared to the other iems

 

[Matias]

My take on the Truthear Zero IEM

Preamp: -2.0 dB
Filter 1: ON PK Fc 20 Hz Gain 2.4 dB Q 2.200
Filter 2: ON PK Fc 80 Hz Gain -3.6 dB Q 0.800
Filter 3: ON PK Fc 100 Hz Gain -1.0 dB Q 2.000
Filter 4: ON PK Fc 175 Hz Gain 1.8 dB Q 1.800
Filter 5: ON PK Fc 1100 Hz Gain -0.6 dB Q 2.000
Filter 6: ON PK Fc 2750 Hz Gain -3.7 dB Q 1.000
Filter 7: ON PK Fc 5000 Hz Gain -4.5 dB Q 2.000
Filter 8: ON PK Fc 7500 Hz Gain -4.2 dB Q 5.000
Filter 9: ON PK Fc 10000 Hz Gain 2.0 dB Q 3.000

Your EQ is very close to a ThieAudio Clairvoyance (740 usd).

Below your EQ'ed Zero as reference.

 

[GaryH]

AudioScienceReview's measurements are likely more accurate

Not necessarily.

 

[oleg87]

Your EQ is very close to a ThieAudio Clairvoyance (740 usd).

Out of curiosity, did you manually find a close match or is there some feature I'm overlooking in the Crinacle graph tool that can find IEMs best-fit to some target?

 

[Matias]

Out of curiosity, did you manually find a close match or is there some feature I'm overlooking in the Crinacle graph tool that can find IEMs best-fit to some target?

From the several I listed above, after applying his EQ to the Zero, I saw it was fairly close to the Clairvoyance. So I removed the others and chose the option below to set the EQ'ed Zero as the reference. But it was luck that I had the Clairvoyance in the selected IEMs to compare with. I am not aware of an automated "closest match" feature. Would be awesome though (hint @crinacle ).

 

[xavx]

Yes, the seal is fine. You know when the background is mostly blocked out, like you're underwater or wearing earplugs. You'll know if you don't have that, or if you don't have bass. The bass with my EQ mostly matches my main 2.1/7.1.4 home theater system.

I'm not sure I agree with that.

Since you have a good seal, too high trebles might be due to a damaged filter or no filter in the nozzle (just behind the grid).

 

[Chromatischism]

AudioScienceReview's measurements are likely more accurate:
View attachment 239203

That massive 4-6db gain shown for the Zero in the super reviews database is unlikely to be real life.
It is not 'shouty' compared to the other iems

Well the problem is there are a lot of us who are hearing it, so something is off: either Amir's measurements, or the Harman target is just not neutral for us.

I thought about sample variation, but Crinacle only showed a lot of sample variation in the bass region.

 

[Phoney]

Well the problem is there are a lot of us who are hearing it, so something is off: either Amir's measurements, or the Harman target is just not neutral for us.

I thought about sample variation, but Crinacle only showed a lot of sample variation in the bass region.

I allways use harman target for headphones, but never really liked it for IEMs. Oratory1990s IEM target sounds more neutral to me, except from the lower mids, which I had to tune down a little (around 1-1.5 db).

 

[SalutaryGraveness]

Well the problem is there are a lot of us who are hearing it, so something is off: either Amir's measurements, or the Harman target is just not neutral for us.

I thought about sample variation, but Crinacle only showed a lot of sample variation in the bass region.

I am telling you I have both the Zero and the Blessing 2 and that big 4~6dB
difference that the super review data is trying to show is not there, it is not real, just fantasy. I would notice, trust me.
Amirm's data on the other hand agrees with what I actually hear: no such differential at that region between the Zero and B2, not even close.
So right off the bat I can say that the super review measurements aren't accurate enough and I can't trust it to compare iems,
let alone to generate eqs

And I am bit puzzled by people insisting on using data generated with inferior clone couplers when amirm is providing
data generated with a genuine, calibrated and superior measurement device and equipment.

For reference here it is a direct comparison that shows data and better data. People can figure out which one is it.

 

[GaryH]

And I am bit puzzled by people insisting on using data generated with inferior clone couplers when amirm is providing data generated with a genuine, calibrated and superior measurement device and equipment.

See here.

 

[oleg87]

And I am bit puzzled by people insisting on using data generated with inferior clone couplers when amirm is providing
data generated with a genuine, calibrated and superior measurement device and equipment.

I mean, as long as you're comparing apples to apples, does it matter? I don't know about SuperReviews, but Crinacle's measurements seem accurate enough below ~8000hz that I can make reasonably good tonal matches mapping the same EQ target to the various in-ears that he's measured and I own.
For reference, the same comparison with Crinacle's data:

 

[Chromatischism]

And I am bit puzzled by people insisting on using data generated with inferior clone couplers when amirm is providing
data generated with a genuine, calibrated and superior measurement device and equipment.

Remember, I didn't generate an EQ from measurements. I'm pretty sure the only one who did that was Maiky and it was based on Amir's data, and even that brought down the highs some. I actually took his and used it as my starting point. I then went through a lot of iteration, by 1) starting with a sine sweep to identify the hot areas that needed attenuation, and 2) a LOT of music listening over several weeks. What I hear on the sweeps mirrors what I hear with music, so there is agreement, for me.

When I listen to the Truthear Zeros stock, I hear this:

If it helps the discussion, I do not have high frequency hearing loss. I still hear capacitor whine in CRT TV's and my UPS unit which my PC is connected to.

I allways use harman target for headphones, but never really liked it for IEMs. Oratory1990s IEM target sounds more neutral to me, except from the lower mids, which I had to tune down a little (around 1-1.5 db).

Interesting, I will have to take a look at that.

Edit: according to this comparison, I would have to agree that Oratory's upper midrange and treble would be better for me, but I would not like the bass. In my experience, it shouldn't shelve up that high, but lower, something Harman gets right. They both get wrong the merge into the upper bass and lower midrange, which needs to be done by 100-125 Hz to preserve clarity.

 

[Matias]

Precog agrees with Crin, not so much as Super but more than ASR.

 

[_thelaughingman]

93 pages long, this thread has devolved into a mundane madness of back and forth about legitimacy of measurements, the Harman curve and which EQ is better? Is it really worth bickering over this product when it performs as well as it is advertised?

 

[nstzya]

I use these with the iPhone dongle and the volume for me doesn’t go past half before they get loud.

Perhaps it’s source dependent? Or iPhone model? With a lightning US dongle and a iPhone 7S, running Tidal HiFi as source, I need one click from max.

 

[_thelaughingman]

Perhaps it’s source dependent? Or iPhone model? With a lightning US dongle and a iPhone 7S, running Tidal HiFi as source, I need one click from max.

So this correlates in an odd way to what I have seen this behavior with US dongle on iPhone 14pro and an iPhone 8 that I use (Same dongle on both device) . Some odd reason the volume has to be cranked up to almost 90% on the iPhone 8 compared to about 40% on the iPhone 14 Pro. There's absolutely no reason for the voltage being put through the two lightning connector ports to be significantly different. Would love to see someone else correlate that with two iPhones on ASR.

 

[SalutaryGraveness]

93 pages long, this thread has devolved into a mundane madness of back and forth about legitimacy of measurements, the Harman curve and which EQ is better? Is it really worth bickering over this product when it performs as well as it is advertised?

Isn't that kinda the point of this forum? Data, measurement, discuss !

 

[Chromatischism]

Your EQ is very close to a ThieAudio Clairvoyance (740 usd)

Awesome, good to know I saved $690

 

[_thelaughingman]

Isn't that kinda the point of this forum? Data, measurement, discuss !

Yes, I'm all for open discussion, but I see pointless discussion about Harman Curve not being true curve, and measurements by Amir aren't correct to other sources. Same story over and over.

 

[SalutaryGraveness]

Yes, I'm all for open discussion, but I see pointless discussion about Harman Curve not being true curve, and measurements by Amir aren't correct to other sources. Same story over and over.

Yeah I feel kinda bad for contributing to the tediousness of the discussion. But I still find interesting what people has to say about the issue. Pinky promise I wont touch the issue anymore here.