Topping PA5 Review (Amplifier)

[Billy Budapest]

I just noticed that the L50 has passthrough connections. I'm sure John put them there with the PA5 in mind. The E50 + L50 + PA5 are the ultimate desktop stack for only $850. Tempting…and leaves plenty of money for Wilson TuneTots and Dan Clark Stealth headphones. ;-)

Wilson TuneTots? ROTFL!!!!

 

[Calleberg]

I’m not sure why it wouldn’t.

Well I guess it could, even though the "picture" does look suspiciously faked.
What it is not, though (and when I re-read what you wrote you never said it was) is the amp-chip.

 

[dsnyder0cnn]

Just wish this had a volume bypass because I hate gain matching

I assume setting the volume to the max is, effectively, a bypass.

 

[Billy Budapest]

Well I guess it could, even though the "picture" does look suspiciously faked.
What it is not, though (and when I re-read what you wrote you never said it was) is the amp-chip.

It’s been photoshopped to give it a haze effect, but in that regard it’s not any different than photos Topping has produced in the past which accurately portrayed the insides of their amps.

As for exactly what the potted unit is, I have no idea. That’s kind of the motivation for potting something.

 

[Calleberg]

It’s been photoshopped to give it a haze effect, but in that regard it’s not any different than photos Topping has produced in the past which accurately portrayed the insides of their amps.

As for exactly what the potted unit is, I have no idea. That’s kind of the motivation for potting something.

The text in that picture talks about their newly developed Class- D amplification circuit... and sort of implies that the black blob is IT... That was what I reacted upon, and also what I assumed you meant, sorry about that.

buuuut, the text also talks about "novel optimization techniques" so the blob is more likely related to this (unless its ALL marketing hogwash), which makes more sense, as that IS something topping probably could develop themselves. That could also explain the placement at the front just by the volume pot .

 

[Billy Budapest]

The text in that picture talks about their newly developed Class- D amplification circuit... and sort of implies that the black blob is IT... That was what I reacted upon, and also what I assumed you meant, sorry about that.

buuuut, the text also talks about "novel optimization techniques" so the blob is more likely related to this (unless its ALL marketing hogwash), which makes more sense, as that IS something topping probably could develop themselves. That could also explain the placement at the front just by the volume pot .

I wasn’t drawing any conclusions as to what the potted unit is. I just thought it was odd.

 

[Billy Budapest]

That's cheating! This picture was posted in the other PA5 thread before the amp was even released.

I didn’t know there was another PA5 thread.

 

[Proberts911]

Are we saying the PA5 is better than the other "heavy hitters" its compared against in Amari's SINAD's chart? That's not intuitive at all. Even if you eliminate price differences, what about class A & AB? Or weight? Aren't there basic design and component differences that something like the PA5 just can't complete against? If I'm looking for an amp to play at low to moderate volumes in a traditional two channel setup (with stand mount or floor standing speakers, not near field), has my search ending with the PA5. Sorry, but having trouble getting my head around this.

 

[antcollinet]

Are we saying the PA5 is better than the other "heavy hitters" its compared against in Amari's SINAD's chart? That's not intuitive at all. Even if you eliminate price differences, what about class A & AB? Or weight? Aren't there basic design and component differences that something like the PA5 just can't complete against? If I'm looking for an amp to play at low to moderate volumes in a traditional two channel setup (with stand mount or floor standing speakers, not near field), has my search ending with the PA5. Sorry, but having trouble getting my head around this.

If by better - you mean better measured performance, then yes. Most here also are of the view that better measured performance also results in higher fidelity sound.

Some Class D amps are now performing as well as or better than class A and AB amps. Then, why on earth do you think weight should be a determinant of performance? Class D typically doesn't use, or need the large/heavy transformers or heat sinks used by traditional designs.

 

[NiagaraPete]

Hope they’ll get rid of the red volume knob on their future black products.

I like the red, just saying.

 

[dsnyder0cnn]

If I'm looking for an amp to play at low to moderate volumes in a traditional two channel setup (with stand mount or floor standing speakers, not near field), has my search ending with the PA5. Sorry, but having trouble getting my head around this.

I think things work best when they are used for the purpose designed. The PA5 Seems to have been designed as a desktop amp to be paired with the E50 DAC, possibly, an L50 headphone amp sandwiched between the two. Combine that stack with passive desktop speakers and headphones, and you have a brilliant system that's within arm's reach. Lack of remote control on the PA5 is of no concern in such a setup.

According to Amir's measurements, the PA5 has 83 watts of clean output into 4Ω and 48 watts into 8 Ω. Assuming the speakers you have in mind are reasonably efficient and well-behaved, by these epcs, the PA5 should drive them nicely. Since there's no remote, and only two pairs of inputs, you'll probably end up pairing it with a preamp or DAC/pre, which means leaving the volume set to max. Not ideal, but workable, I suppose.

Unless you're in a rush, I'd wait to see what else John has in the works that is a better fit to your application. Reading this thread, I know I'm far from alone wanting to see a "PA9" amp from Topping that matches the casework of the D90SE DAC and Pre90 preamp with twice the power and SINAD that (finally) exceeds the Benchmark AHB2. Heck, I'd go for a pair of "MA9" monoblocks from Topping with the same AHB2-beating SINAD and 4x the power. Certainly should be possible.

 

[Enkay25]

I think things work best when they are used for the purpose designed. The PA5 Seems to have been designed as a desktop amp to be paired with the E50 DAC, possibly, an L50 headphone amp sandwiched between the two. Combine that stack with passive desktop speakers and headphones, and you have a brilliant system that's within arm's reach. Lack of remote control on the PA5 is of no concern in such a setup.

According to Amir's measurements, the PA5 has 83 watts of clean output into 4Ω and 48 watts into 8 Ω. Assuming the speakers you have in mind are reasonably efficient and well-behaved, by these epcs, the PA5 should drive them nicely. Since there's no remote, and only two pairs of inputs, you'll probably end up pairing it with a preamp or DAC/pre, which means leaving the volume set to max. Not ideal, but workable, I suppose.

Unless you're in a rush, I'd wait to see what else John has in the works that is a better fit to your application. Reading this thread, I know I'm far from alone wanting to see a "PA9" amp from Topping that matches the casework of the D90SE DAC and Pre90 preamp with twice the power and SINAD that (finally) exceeds the Benchmark AHB2. Heck, I'd go for a pair of "MA9" monoblocks from Topping with the same AHB2-beating SINAD and 4x the power. Certainly should be possible.

Like that idea - MA9 will be something to look out for.

 

[0bs3rv3r]

According to Amir's measurements, the PA5 has 83 watts of clean output into 4Ω and 48 watts into 8 Ω. Assuming the speakers you have in mind are reasonably efficient and well-behaved, by these epcs, the PA5 should drive them nicely.

Let me reinforce this. I think the small size of the case has people thinking this is a toy amp. It is not. There's heaps of power for most average listening situations/speakers/room size/genres.

 

[eardiggler]

I think things work best when they are used for the purpose designed. The PA5 Seems to have been designed as a desktop amp to be paired with the E50 DAC, possibly, an L50 headphone amp sandwiched between the two.

'Desktop' implies that the user will be using this next to their computer with smallish bookshelf speakers, nearfield. What will make the next more powerful version a non-desktop or main amplifier? Is it simply more watts to classify it as a non-desktop amp? The new version is likely going to be the same small form factor so it can stack up with all Toppings products. It's likely going to look like another desktop product.

 

[dsnyder0cnn]

What will make the next more powerful version of this a non-desktop amplifier?

There are plenty of admirable amplifiers with less than 50 wpc, including the Schiit Audio Aegir, First Watt F7, etc. For me, if it's going to act like an integrated amp, it needs more than two pairs of inputs and a remote control for input selection and volume. The PA5 lacks these features, but that's totally acceptable for desktop use.

If it's going to act like a power amp, the volume control is a little superfluous but not objectionable. But, I expect to see a single pair of balanced inputs or balanced plus single-ended inputs, possibly selectable via a toggle. A 12V trigger input/output to wake the amp from standby might be nice but is less common with Class D amps due to their high efficiency. Still it would be handy for home theater applications that could use a stack of amps.

A non-desktop amplifier does not have to be large. The Orchard Audio monoblocks that I'm using only weigh 22 oz (excluding the external power supply) and are not much larger than the PA5.

 

[Arvind]

I am waiting for something like PA9 from Topping. And with suffix 9, it has to be SOTA flagship obviously.

 

[PeteL]

The topping requires over 2v for full output, it has balanced inputs which would easily achieve this from many DACs but the chord is 3.5mm stereo so it probably wont be ideal. Theres figures into headphone loads way bellow 1v, im not sure how well it would perform into 10k.

Amir stated in the review that full power was reached at 2.5V, not 2. Wher is the 2V you stateos coming from? It’s a quite significant difference.

 

[mdsimon2]

Amir stated in the review that full power was reached at 2.5V, not 2. Wher is the 2V you stateos coming from? It’s a quite significant difference.

It depends on what you mean by "full power". If you are looking for 83 W at 4 ohm at 0.0005% THD+N then 2 V input will get you there, if you are looking for 116 W at 4 ohms at 1% THD+N then you need 2.4 V.

Michael

 

[SylphAudio]

Maybe two TPA3251 with PFFB ?

My guess is one chip based on the pic with potted unit. Might include an active PFFB in the input section that's why it's potted. I wonder how Bruno will respond to this.

 

[envydd]

Has someone done a subjective test of this vs a Purifi or a NC500 series amp? I need a power amp for my KEF LS50 and a SMSL M200 (as a dac/amp) for a 12'x12' room and was planning to get a buckeye/vtv.