Topping PA5 II Stereo Amplifier Review

[Sokel]

So, in my set up, I get the volume I require with any one control at c.75% if the others are at 100%. So it’s not at its limit, but pretty high up.

If balanced increases gain, does that then give me a bit more head room?

The best and more accurate way to match them is measuring them right at the output with a DMM and write down the level so you can repeat it.
(doesn't have to be loud)

That will give you certainty and peace of mind.

 

[staticV3]

There could also potentially be a 6 dB level difference.

The PA5II's RCA input has 6dB higher gain to compensate for the 6dB lower level of RCA.

In practice, there should be minimal volume difference when switching inputs.
@Yorkshire Mouth

 

[Yorkshire Mouth]

Okay, I tried this today. Same DAC (Topping EX5), both balanced and vanilla RCA into the PA5ii. DAC switched to output both at once.

Flicking the right-hand side toggle switch on the amp between ‘SE’ and ‘BAL’.

Absolutely no perceivable difference whatsoever. I’d say identical.

Tried with several tracks of several volume levels, some with a wide dynamic range, some brickwalled. Some loud rock, some soft acoustic.

No difference.

 

[Yorkshire Mouth]

While we’re here, if someone else had been toggling the switch, I wouldn’t even know when it’d been toggled. There wasn’t even a click or gap.

Soooky. To the point where I set the DAC to RCA out only, then balanced out only, to make sure the toggle was wiring properly (it was, in one position music, the other silence).

 

[audioje]

While we’re here, if someone else had been toggling the switch, I wouldn’t even know when it’d been toggled. There wasn’t even a click or gap.

Soooky. To the point where I set the DAC to RCA out only, then balanced out only, to make sure the toggle was wiring properly (it was, in one position music, the other silence).

Glad to know that I am not missing anything with rca!

 

[Julf]

Glad to know that I am not missing anything with rca!

It would only matter if you had really long connections or ground loop issues.

 

[Sokel]

It would only matter if you had really long connections or ground loop issues.

Ground loops can occur with balanced too.
It's not a connection problem,it's a system problem.
Agreed 100% about long runs.

 

[Julf]

Ground loops can occur with balanced too.

Ground loop issues are rare with balanced connections.

Bruno Putzeys: The G word: How to get your audio off the ground

 

[Bleib]

Ground loop issues are rare with balanced connections.

Bruno Putzeys: The G word: How to get your audio off the ground

Yeah, but in case it happens then some products like Topping A70 Pro has a GND switch to prevent it from occurring

 

[Julf]

Yeah, but in case it happens then some products like Topping A70 Pro has a GND switch to prevent it from occurring

Cutting the ground is a rather poor solution. Did you read the piece I linked to?

 

[Bleib]

Cutting the ground is a rather poor solution. Did you read the piece I linked to?

I've never had the need to use a GND switch myself as I've never really encountered this problem myself whether its RCA or XLR.
Just adding to the information that some products have this for a reason.

 

[Sokel]

Ground loop issues are rare with balanced connections.

Bruno Putzeys: The G word: How to get your audio off the ground

There's not a passing week around audio forums without a thread about a balanced connection (usually with active speakers) carrying PC garbage with it,or hums,or,or...
Not so rare I would guess.

 

[Julf]

There's not a passing week around audio forums without a thread about a balanced connection (usually with active speakers) carrying PC garbage with it,or hums,or,or...
Not so rare I would guess.

There is also not a passing day around audio forums without a thread about how some "high end" cable makes a day and night difference. That doesn't make it true.

 

[Sokel]

There is also not a passing day around audio forums without a thread about how some "high end" cable makes a day and night difference. That doesn't make it true.

Hearing "differences" through cables has nothing to do with the everlasting described CPU/GPU,fans,even mouse activity through the speakers with no music playing.
It's a systematic error that knows no balanced or unbalanced connections and manifest itself through the good,old grounds loops.

People describe the same thing all the time and provide very similar recordings about it.
The fact that proper galvanic isolation completely eradicate it says it all.

 

[Julf]

Hearing "differences" through cables has nothing to do with the everlasting described CPU/GPU,fans,even mouse activity through the speakers with no music playing.
It's a systematic error that knows no balanced or unbalanced connections and manifest itself through the good,old grounds loops.

People describe the same thing all the time and provide very similar recordings about it.
The fact that proper galvanic isolation completely eradicate it says it all.

How can you have a ground loop with a proper, differential balanced input with even a halfway decent common mode rejection ratio?

 

[Sokel]

How can you have a ground loop with a proper, differential balanced input with even a halfway decent common mode rejection ratio?

The proper question is not "how" but 'why" .
And the answer is the same for both balanced and unbalanced connections:
a poor mix of electric insulation classes,usually class I and class II often inside the same device,poor electrical grid,etc.

Just search the forum with some key words to see how many they are,often inside other threads too.

 

[Julf]

The proper question is not "how" but 'why" .
And the answer is the same for both balanced and unbalanced connections:
a poor mix of electric insulation classes,usually class I and class II often inside the same device,poor electrical grid,etc.

Just search the forum with some key words to see how many they are,often inside other threads too.

That is why I specified "a proper, differential balanced input with even a halfway decent common mode rejection ratio".

 

[Yorkshire Mouth]

Hearing "differences" through cables has nothing to do with the everlasting described CPU/GPU,fans,even mouse activity through the speakers with no music playing.
It's a systematic error that knows no balanced or unbalanced connections and manifest itself through the good,old grounds loops.

People describe the same thing all the time and provide very similar recordings about it.
The fact that proper galvanic isolation completely eradicate it says it all.

To be clear, if you have a ground loop, you hear it, and you hear it obviously and clearly.

If you don’t hear it obviously and clearly there are no advantsges to ‘going balanced’ outside those already mentioned. Which aren’t usually applicable in home applications.

 

[Sokel]

To be clear, if you have a ground loop, you hear it, and you hear it obviously and clearly.

If you don’t hear it obviously and clearly there are no advantsges to ‘going balanced’ outside those already mentioned. Which aren’t usually applicable in home applications.

Yep.That's why I said it's a system error.
For decades now people use unbalanced for commercial audio with zero problems.
The trend for balanced as a band aid for home audio started with PC audio and what carries with it.

And some times balanced admittedly help people with such problems but also some times it doesn't.
It's not an all-cure.
It's a different story that companies took advantage of it to reduce noise though low gain,etc.That came after.

 

[Yorkshire Mouth]

Yep.That's why I said it's a system error.
For decades now people use unbalanced for commercial audio with zero problems.
The trend for balanced as a band aid for home audio started with PC audio and what carries with it.

And some times balanced admittedly help people with such problems but also some times it doesn't.
It's not an all-cure.
It's a different story that companies took advantage of it to reduce noise though low gain,etc.That came after.

I generally find, in ye olde dayes ™ no one feeding an amp from a CD player had a problem. I say ‘no one’, I mean ‘vanishingly few’.

Balanced was a solution, but never really proposed as one as the issue was so rare.

It’s becoming more common due to two issues, (a) the introduction of PCs into the loop, and (b) the introduction of multiple item in a chain (CD player/streamer to DAC, to preamp, to minidsp, to power amp).

When it was just source to amp to speakers, ground loops were astonishingly rare.