• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Subwoofer integration without external DSP

tomita

Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2021
Messages
20
Likes
15
I'm planning adding a subwoofer to my system, but I don't want to use external DSP. Are there any guides I should follow in order to phase (/time) align the subwoofer to the mains solely by positioning and through the sub's own dsp settings (crossover, phase, etc.)?
Can it be done?

Thank you
 

fpitas

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jul 7, 2022
Messages
9,885
Likes
14,275
Location
Northern Virginia, USA
If the sub has DSP, what is the problem using that? Of course without knowing a lot more about its capabilities, maybe it's not good enough. Tough to say.
 

sigbergaudio

Major Contributor
Audio Company
Forum Donor
Joined
Aug 21, 2020
Messages
2,894
Likes
6,212
Location
Norway
You will get a better result if you can highpass your speakers. So ideally you should look into an external DSP solution. Phase/timing isn't necessarily a problem, true time aligning is impossible as the phase will vary with frequency.

You will have less issues if both subwoofer and speakers are sealed (not bass reflex).
 
OP
T

tomita

Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2021
Messages
20
Likes
15
If the sub has DSP, what is the problem using that? Of course without knowing a lot more about its capabilities, maybe it's not good enough. Tough to say.
No problem at all. I said I'm not going to use an external DSP. The subwoofer I'm considering is a SVS one, if that helps.
 
OP
T

tomita

Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2021
Messages
20
Likes
15
You will get a better result if you can highpass your speakers. So ideally you should look into an external DSP solution. Phase/timing isn't necessarily a problem, true time aligning is impossible as the phase will vary with frequency.

You will have less issues if both subwoofer and speakers are sealed (not bass reflex).
I know, but I don't want to go down that route. I want to make as much of a good integration as the interanl DSP of the subwoofer permits. The subwoofer will be sealed; the speakers, however, are ported – Kef R3.
 

fpitas

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jul 7, 2022
Messages
9,885
Likes
14,275
Location
Northern Virginia, USA
No problem at all. I said I'm not going to use an external DSP. The subwoofer I'm considering is a SVS one, if that helps.
That's a start. Got a link to a datasheet?
 

fpitas

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jul 7, 2022
Messages
9,885
Likes
14,275
Location
Northern Virginia, USA
Thanks. Their idea of a datasheet is a glossy sales cut-sheet, unfortunately. Unless I missed some serious technical description of the DSP.

SVS App Specs:​

  • Powerful Bluetooth-controlled subwoofer DSP app works with iOS, Android, and Amazon operating systems
  • Provides easy and convenient way to adjust crossover frequencies, parametric EQ, polarity, room gain and all other bass-management functions
  • Three convenient custom presets allow for perfect tuning in any room or system, from your favorite seat
  • Bidirectional-feedback shows adjustments in real time on both app and subwoofer rear panel interface
 

dasdoing

Major Contributor
Joined
May 20, 2020
Messages
4,405
Likes
2,893
Location
Salvador-Bahia-Brasil
If you don't want to high-pass the mains, you should match the low-pass of the subwoofer to the natural roll-off of the mains as well as possible. then you apply delay on a trial-and-error basis until you have the most SPL at the crossover. your sub will be probably a cycle too late though (360-degree shift), but most people won't hear that.
 

fpitas

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jul 7, 2022
Messages
9,885
Likes
14,275
Location
Northern Virginia, USA
If you don't want to high-pass the mains, you should match the low-pass of the subwoofer to the natural roll-off of the mains as well as possible. then you apply delay on a trial-and-error basis until you have the most SPL at the crossover. your sub will be probably a cycle too late though (360-degree shift), but most people won't hear that.
So far we're not sure the SVS app does delay.
 

dasdoing

Major Contributor
Joined
May 20, 2020
Messages
4,405
Likes
2,893
Location
Salvador-Bahia-Brasil
So far we're not sure the SVS app does delay.

the "phase" setting is probably delay, since there is polarity also

1695732658013.png
 

fpitas

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jul 7, 2022
Messages
9,885
Likes
14,275
Location
Northern Virginia, USA

dasdoing

Major Contributor
Joined
May 20, 2020
Messages
4,405
Likes
2,893
Location
Salvador-Bahia-Brasil
switch polarity first. leave polarity whatever gets most SPL before messing with the phase setting. if the polarity inversion gets you more SPL you will need less delay to match
 

fpitas

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Jul 7, 2022
Messages
9,885
Likes
14,275
Location
Northern Virginia, USA
I mean, what else would it be? an all-pass? I think these are generally delay when they are not simple polarity inversions
I'll take your word for it. This consumer grade stuff drives me crazy.
 
OP
T

tomita

Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2021
Messages
20
Likes
15
Thanks. Their idea of a datasheet is a glossy sales cut-sheet, unfortunately. Unless I missed some serious technical description of the DSP.

SVS App Specs:​

  • Powerful Bluetooth-controlled subwoofer DSP app works with iOS, Android, and Amazon operating systems
  • Provides easy and convenient way to adjust crossover frequencies, parametric EQ, polarity, room gain and all other bass-management functions
  • Three convenient custom presets allow for perfect tuning in any room or system, from your favorite seat
  • Bidirectional-feedback shows adjustments in real time on both app and subwoofer rear panel interface
Are you looking for something specific? Maybe I can help. I tried to do my homework and I know a thing or two about their app's capabilities.
 
Top Bottom