Review and Measurements of Nord One NC500 Amp

[maty]

What do you think of the idea of opening a specific thread in which you commented on the recordings you are listening to to evaluate the quality of the new amplifier and the speakers?

Why? I have doubts about the ability of good class D amps for acoustic instrumentation.

Maybe a good buffer is the key.

 

[orangejello]

Why? I have doubts about the ability of good class D amps for acoustic instrumentation.

I understand your concern. It is why I used very neutral tube gear for so many years. I listen to all kinds of music. I love chamber music and have very particular taste when it comes to the nuances of performance. When well performed, recorded, and played back, the subtleties of artistic intention are communicated. And the artist's control over the shadings of timbre play a big roll in this. This often gets lost at some point in the chain, and is more often lost with SS playback in my experience because of the type of harmonic distortion that is typical for most solid state stuff. On the other had, some gear has harmonic distortion that favors a more natural timbre reproduction, regardless of whether it is present on the recording. I think tube gear does this to varying degrees.

So you have a choice. You can find gear whose distortion products favor your sensibilities - I think that is what most audiophiles, consciously or unconsciously, do. Or you can go for neutral and let the recordings speak for themselves. In my recent experience with the NAD M22 class D amp, that is what is going on - neutrality. What I noticed the longer that I listened through the NAD was that I gradually begun to prefer the neutrality. If the recording is well done, acoustic instruments sound better than I have ever heard them. If the recordings are poor, you will hear it. But what I noticed was that I learned to listen through the poor recording to the underlying performance. This ability on my part to adapt puts me in mind of the concept of ocular accommodation and adaptation. It feels like a much more engaging experience to not have things air-brushed, even ever so slightly. I don't know what other class d stuff sounds like because until I got the NAD I hadn't listened to class d for about 10 years. But I will vouch for the M22's ability to let acoustic instruments sound like such, IF that is what is recorded. I have a Benchmark ABH2 on the way, so I will get a chance to compare the M22 to the most neutral SS amp available. I think that the M22 has prepared me for the Benchmark in terms of the expectation of neutrality.

Dr. John died yesterday. So we sat up most of the night streaming WWOZ, which paid tribute to him - I am still listening this morning. Some of the stuff they played was astonishing. If you have ever been on the streets of New Orleans and listened and danced to the brass bands that play on the corners off Frenchman's street you know the sound of the tubas laying down the foundation, the trombones blatting out the rhythm, the trumpets blaring and shining above it all, the bass drum thumping, the small cymbals played with screw drivers rather than sticks and the other various drums joyously syncopating... the often ragged unison of the horn playing. ALL of that came through on the NAD as we honored Dr. John. What a treat to be transformed to the streets of New Orleans. So I would say, give class D a try. In my experience, it can do it all.

 

[Samoyed]

Ah, I was at the first jazz fest while a Tulane student....

 

[orangejello]

Ah, I was at the first jazz fest while a Tulane student....

Nice. I have been to the fest a few times. It is the most joyful musical festival in the world, no doubt. And the caliber of musicians is unparalleled. For music lovers (and people lovers, and food lovers), it is the "holy fest". (Feel sorry for those who only like classical music, or straight ahead jazz Was there for the 50th anniversary in May. New Orleans is the womb. People thought Dr. John was coming out of left field when he emerged in the 60's. No, he was just emerging from the womb.

 

[maty]

@orangello

My second audio system, with PC, usually near-field, has a second-hand AV Marantz SR4500 tweaked and modified by me. It sounds now much better than original.

https://www.soundandvision.com/content/marantz-sr4500-av-receiver-ht-labs-measures

So good is the current sound in my second system (all the components have been retouched by me, including the W10 Pro 64) that I decided last week that it was not worth buying a new one! However, days ago I received the neat email from Tibor (Apollon Audio)...

Resistiré, by Dúo Dinámico

Cuando pierda todas las partidas
Cuando duerma con la soledad
Cuando se me cierren las salidas
Y la noche no me deje en paz

Cuando tenga miedo del silencio
Cuando cueste mantenerse en pie
Cuando se rebelen los recuerdos
Y me pongan contra la pared

Resistiré para seguir viviendo
Me volveré de hierro
Para endurecer la piel
Y aunque los vientos de la vida soplen fuerte
Como el junco que se dobla
Pero siempre sigue en pie

Resistiré para seguir viviendo
Soportaré
Los golpes y jamás me rendiré
Y aunque los sueños se me rompan en pedazos
Resistiré, resistiré...

BTW, about Dr. John, one hour ago:

Dr. John - Desitively Bonnaroo (1974), Vinyl, ATCO Records, US
https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/music/6958-playing-listening-post5815683.html

 

[kevinh]

Sad to hear about Dr John. Lots of musicians I have enjoyed for a long time are passing away these days.

 

[Bamyasi]

40 years older, today? It's your birthday! Cheers.

Actually, it happened two months ago but thanks anyways! And yes, this system upgrade was kind of a birthday present from me myself. I thought, damn I ought to give hi-fi another try before I go completely deaf or to an asylum

 

[Bamyasi]

Which buffer?

Sorry to disappoint you @maty but mine are Sonic Imagery. I am afraid I've always preferred to play it safe, even when I was younger.

 

[Bamyasi]

Most people underestimate the amount of power they need. Even bookshelf speakers benefit from ton of power. We once connected a pair of Paradigm bookshelf speakers to a 1000 watt amplifier and you should have heard the clean bass and dynamics they could then produce. Yes, I feared for them blowing up , but they didn't and sounded wonderful.

I agree and that's why good dynamics alone would not surprise me, especially considering the speakers are rated at 6 Ohms / 86 dB sensitivity. But they actually play so musically delightfully! Tons of detail with pretty good sound stage and instruments separation but most important, they don't sound boxy at all. I can hear some mild cabinet resonances but they are few and does not interfere with the music most of the time. Even vocals sound natural. Amazingly balanced design I would say. Maybe amplifier's high damping factor is helping too but I am still impressed.

 

[maty]

Sorry to disappoint you @maty but mine are Sonic Imagery. I am afraid I've always preferred to play it safe, even when I was younger....

It was my choice too years ago, after investigating the possible options. But... "Resistiré, erguido frente a todo..."

To color the sound a little, better to do it with a very good DIY preamp. Power amplifier and DAC/ADC (with preamp like RME ADI-2 DAC) as clean as posible. It is the most logical option, I think.

Thus, the two possibilities are available: H2 colored for small groups of acoustic instrumentation (jazz, folk, world...) and clean sound, with ALL harmonics > 90dB, for more complex music such as orchestral, electronic ...

 

[kevinh]

Perhaps the wrong place but this thread seems more active than the NC400 thread.
Has anyone bridged NC400 modules to make a mono block, using 2x NC400 with 2x 1200A700 PS?

 

[amirm]

Thread cleaned up. All the lawyerly talk has its own thread: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...rguments-about-hypex-and-nord-licensing.7783/

This is a review thread so no more of that talk here.

 

[Samoyed]

Well, that’s a neat way for you to save face.

 

[amirm]

Well, that’s a neat way for you to save face.

You are not that lucky. Responded to you in the other thread.

Reply ban issued for you for this thread due to violating moderator instructions. I thought I was very clear to not continue here. Post whatever you want in the other thread.

 

[RayDunzl]

 

[estuardo4]

Most people underestimate the amount of power they need. Even bookshelf speakers benefit from ton of power. We once connected a pair of Paradigm bookshelf speakers to a 1000 watt amplifier and you should have heard the clean bass and dynamics they could then produce. Yes, I feared for them blowing up , but they didn't and sounded wonderful.

Amir, this is something that I don't understand and maybe you can explain it to me. I have an old B&K A/B amp rated at I believe 150 watts per channel at 8 Ohm. My listening room is a semi small room 4x3x2 meter. I have to listen at lower volume (60-80 db), My amp can drive my speakers to deafening levels without distortion, but I never really listen to music at those levels. I'm now using the Klipsch Powergate. It is I think a 50 watt amp, but despite of this, my listening levels are the same and I find the Powergate as enjoyable as the B&K at those levels, but consuming much less electricity. What am I missing with the Powergate if I never listen at more than 80db? Why do I need a more powerful amp? I don't want to underestimate the amount of power I need. But how will I know what I'm missing? Isn't the same if I use a 50 W amp or a 500 W amp if I listen at the same 60-80 db? I know about the transients on classical music, but I rarely listen to this genre. What am I missing? I know you know by now I'm a neophyte but I want to learn. Thank you.

 

[amirm]

If you sense no distortion, or weakening of the bass impact, then you don't need more power.

 

[maty]

The answer is in the dynamic range (DR). If you listen modern commercial music, badly recorded and with DR < 8 dB then you do not need much power to the peaks.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_range

But if you listen, like me, very good recordings with many tracks DR >= 15 dB then you need amplifiers with more max watts.

The amount of power needed in reserve will depend on the sensitivity of the speakers used, the listening distance and our situation in the room.

https://www.doctorproaudio.com/content.php?2273-calculators-proaudio-sound-dmx&langid=1#calc_spl


Then there is the trick used by some brands (SS and lot of tube amps) with a high sensitivity for maximum power (less of 0.2 V -the standard value), so that turning the volume knob a little we get the same SPL, deceiving the listener, making him believe that the amplifier is more powerful than it is.

Maybe the old amp has 0.3 V and the new only 0.1 V. With less excitation -assuming potentiometers of the same type- the new one will need less turning.

 

[maty]

Yesterday,

Brothers Johnson - Right On Time (1977), Vinyl, Music On Vinyl 2017, Europe

Brothers Johnson - Right On Time (Vinyl, LP, Album, Reissue) | Discogs



DR Peak RMS Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR14 -0.04 dB -17.61 dB 5:05 01-Runnin' For Your Lovin'
DR14 -1.01 dB -17.24 dB 4:12 02-Free Yourself, Be Yourself
DR15 -0.10 dB -18.15 dB 3:25 03-"Q"
DR14 -0.16 dB -16.41 dB 3:39 04-Right On Time
DR14 -0.07 dB -17.54 dB 4:58 05-Strawberry Letter 23
DR15 -0.20 dB -17.37 dB 3:10 06-Brother Man
DR15 -0.09 dB -18.31 dB 3:01 07-Never Leave You Lonely
DR14 -1.11 dB -18.71 dB 4:23 08-Love Is
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks: 8
Official DR value: DR14


CD, 2004

Right On Time by The Brothers Johnson on Amazon Music - Amazon.com

 

[maty]

dr.loudness-war.info Rosalía - El Mal Querer (2018)

DR Peak RMS Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR6 -0.21 dB -7.27 dB 2:30 01-MALAMENTE (Cap.1: Augurio)
DR5 -0.14 dB -7.27 dB 4:30 02-QUE NO SALGA LA LUNA (Cap.2: Boda)
DR5 -0.18 dB -7.03 dB 3:14 03-PIENSO EN TU MIRÁ (Cap.3: Celos)
DR5 -0.27 dB -9.16 dB 2:25 04-DE AQUÍ NO SALES (Cap.4: Disputa)
DR7 -0.27 dB -9.93 dB 3:28 05-RENIEGO (Cap.5: Lamento)
DR14 -0.26 dB -18.74 dB 0:41 06-PRESO (Cap.6: Clausura)
DR4 -0.17 dB -7.60 dB 3:03 07-BAGDAD (Cap.7: Liturgia)
DR5 -0.19 dB -7.13 dB 2:42 08-DI MI NOMBRE (Cap.8: Éxtasis)
DR8 -0.26 dB -11.34 dB 3:17 09-NANA (Cap.9: Concepción)
DR6 -0.20 dB -8.44 dB 2:55 10-MALDICIÓN (Cap.10: Cordura)
DR7 -0.26 dB -8.61 dB 1:34 11-A NINGÚN HOMBRE (Cap.11: Poder)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks: 11
Official DR value: DR7

Off topic

The worst thing is that the album was produced by her (and a friend) as an end-of-career project. Then a record company bought it. Therefore, the artist is responsible for the great compression used. What good did it do to go to a good music academy? I wonder.