NHT Super Zero 2.1 Review (bookshelf speaker)

[m8o]

Other failings aside this review makes me think the venerable M&K SS-150C/SS (angled center and left/right) that I own would be concluded as sucking as it has no bass. Where in reality it's never (absolutely never ever) intended to be used without a subwoofer or two. I'm an owner of a NHT mono sub amp and sub too, that's their 'thing'. Pretty sure these speakers were designed to be part of a "2.1" system, i.e. used with a sub; it's in its name, and is a dead giveaway.

 

[amirm]

It's got a 4.5" woofer and a -3 dB at 85 Hz.

That's in the specs.

Specs? They are rated the same useless way of +- 3 dB. Speaker specs are of no value from most manufacturers as we can tell here with their incorrect efficiency numbers.

As for 4.5 inch, the Neumann KH80 DSP has a 4 inch driver yet has no problem producing bass:

So no, there is no reason to expect no bass and mandatory need of sub.

 

[watchnerd]

Specs? They are rated the same useless way of +- 3 dB. Speaker specs are of no value from most manufacturers as we can tell here with their incorrect efficiency numbers.

Well...when I look at a speaker that is officially listed as having a - 3dB at 85 Hz, I think:

"Oh, it probably has no bass"

Especially when combined with a passive design, tiny cabinet of limited volume, a small woofer, and a sealed enclosure.

 

[infinitesymphony]

So we have a pair of small portable speakers that require a subwoofer, and the subwoofer is crossed over at 140 Hz (above the point of localization, ~100 Hz), which means the setup will be summing about 1/3 octave of stereo information to mono.

It seems like the same money would go further on a full-range Bluetooth speaker for portability or a pair of active full-range speakers for home listening.

 

[amirm]

Well...when I look at a speaker that is officially listed as having a - 3dB at 85 Hz, I think:

"Oh, it has no bass"

"Officially listed?" Oh, I guess from now on I should just go by what manufacturers "officially list" and not bother a) to measure and b) listen. Is that what you are saying?

Especially when combined with a tiny cabinet of limited volume, a small woofer, and a sealed enclosure.

Which is what I said at the outset: this has the makings of a poor sounding speaker due to those factor. My objective and subjective review confirmed that.

How it performs with a sub is not the subject of my review no more than it is with any other small speaker.

I asked for suggestions of budget speakers to buy and test and this speaker was recommended. So I purchased it and tested it like any other budget speaker. Now people know: it is not a proper budget speaker. And that it must have a sub that will sharply increase its cost. And aggravation in setup.

These are starter speakers. It used to be that this all we could do 30 years ago. World has moved on and we can do so much better. In this day and age I see no need to leave allowance for such. We know how to make excellent sounding cheap and small speakers now. I have tested a bunch.

I can't fathom those of you defending this speaker. To what end? Who are you going to tell to buy these over say, a low cost active speaker?

 

[watchnerd]

"Officially listed?" Oh, I guess from now on I should just go by what manufacturers "officially list" and not bother a) to measure and b) listen. Is that what you are saying?

Huh?

I said nothing of the kind.

I was merely commenting on the accusation that NHT wasn't transparent about it being designed to complement a subwoofer.

I made no comment about the validity of manufacturer specs or your testing efforts.

 

[dorirod]

I'm still hoping Amir will get around to testing the Logitech Z-2300 THX-Certified 2.1 Been using mine for like 15+ years, powered and with a sub thrown in, $150 in 2004, $190 used on eBay, and I bet they sound better than these.

 

[sarumbear]

Dude.

It's got a 4.5" woofer and a -3 dB at 85 Hz.

That's in the specs.

That's pretty transparent that you need a sub if you want real bass for anyone who has even entry level knowledge about audio.

A) I’m not your dude!

B) That’s not transparency. It’s specification.

The product page says “SuperOne provides the same terrific sonics of the Super Zero with enough bass response such that a subwoofer becomes optional.”

As @amirm demonstrated that is not the case.

 

[EJ3]

Well...when I look at a speaker that is officially listed as having a - 3dB at 85 Hz, I think:

"Oh, it probably has no bass"

Especially when combined with a passive design, tiny cabinet of limited volume, a small woofer, and a sealed enclosure.

I would also presume that of any speaker that had a .1 after the rest of it's nomenclature. I interpret that as saying "must use sub".
I would say that Amirm's measurements showed many design problems that were within the manufacturers stated design (above 85 Hz). No bass was a design choice. I'm guessing that the rest of the problems are not a design choice, but are certainly problems none the less.

 

[sarumbear]

No measurements to offer, but my ears tell me bass distortion is greatly reduced when crossed to a sub at 160 Hz as might be expected with a 4.5" mid-range posing as a woofer.

How do you “cross” to a sub? Where and what the crossover is?

 

[watchnerd]

I would also presume that of any speaker that had a .1 after the rest of it's nomenclature. I interpret that as saying "must use sub".
I would say that Amirm's measurements showed many design problems that were within the manufacturers stated design (above 85 Hz. No bass was a design choice. I'm guessing that the rest of the problems are not a design choice, but are certainly problems none the less.

Just to be clear:

In 2020, I'm not defending the design, nor would I recommend it to anyone.

I owned the original edition way back when. And I never got them to integrate well with a sub (a M&K something at the time).

I'd probably buy a pair at a garage sale for the right price just to mess around with, or for nostalgia. But that's about it.

But I also think NHT is pretty upfront that the Super Zero doesn't really have any meaningful bass. As you say, it's designed that way on purpose.

 

[Octopie]

The product page says “SuperOne provides the same terrific sonics of the Super Zero with enough bass response such that a subwoofer becomes optional.”

As @amirm demonstrated that is not the case.

You’re quoting from the SuperOne description and applying it to the SuperZero. This quote clearly says a sub is optional with the S1 and infers it’s required for the S0

 

[sarumbear]

Straight from the NHT website:

"SuperZero 2.1 complements the SS 10 subwoofer perfectly in creating an affordable yet high-end stereo or surround sound system."

However it also says: “SuperOne provides the same terrific sonics of the Super Zero with enough bass response such that a subwoofer becomes optional.”

They clearly declare these as stand alone speakers - period!

 

[EJ3]

How do you “cross” to a sub? Where and what the crossover is?

I crossover at 80 Hz between my sub amp and main amps in-between my preamp and my main amps.

 

[sarumbear]

I crossover at 80 Hz between my sub amp and main amps in-between my preamp and my main amps.

What is the active crossover unit and slope of the filter you use?

thank you.

 

[EJ3]

I do not agree with the manufacturer that they are SUPER but I do agree that they are ZERO. As in I will purchase precisely ZERO of these.

 

[watchnerd]

The product page says “SuperOne provides the same terrific sonics of the Super Zero with enough bass response such that a subwoofer becomes optional.”

Isn't this NHT implying that using a subwoofer with the Super Zero isn't so optional?

Or to put it differently, it's (approximately) saying:

Super One + no sub = Super Zero + sub

 

[EDMoser]

However it also says: “SuperOne provides the same terrific sonics of the Super Zero with enough bass response such that a subwoofer becomes optional.”

They clearly declare these as stand alone speakers - period!

This is a review of the Super Zero, not the Super One. The Super One uses a 6.5" woofer and may indeed have adequate bass. Two different speakers.

 

[restorer-john]

Importantly, even with mono speaker, you can evaluate spatial effects of a speaker just like you can with someone singing in a church or small room. There is only one source but the spatial effects are quite there.

But the ability of a pair of speakers to produce a rock solid image across the frequency range is not assessed. This factor alone is the entire premise of stereo and it is being completely ignored. Where you are testing offset driver systems or non-mirror imaged speakers, particularly three ways, the image can jump sideways or disappear altogether at certain frequencies. Single speaker listening will not show this at all.

By all means, listen in mono, but use two speakers where you can. A mono source into a pair of speakers will remove the stereo spatial effects you say distract, but will allow an assessment of the stability of the mono phantom image. This tells you a lot about the speaker, the crossover and driver tolerances/consistency from speaker to speaker, and the imaging abilities. It is the biggest omission in your otherwise extremely useful reviews.

 

[sarumbear]

This is a review of the Super Zero, not the Super One. The Super One uses a 6.5" woofer and may indeed have adequate bass. Two different speakers.

My apologies. I made a mistake.