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Marantz AV8802A replacement options?

xirtam2005

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We had a Marantz AV8802A that we liked a lot, but it's no longer turning on. We were very happy with it, but am a bit disappointed that this bit the dust after not making a full 6 years. Is this worth looking at getting repaired? It had worked fine until a few days ago, but just doesn't turn on - it's not getting any power past the cord inlet after doing all the usual checks and troubleshooting.

New Marantz seem very expensive, especially if the products don't last that long. I still have Yamahas going strong after 10-20 years, some of which were bought 1-2 years old secondhand!

How does something like Anthem AVM 70 or Emotiva RMC 1 sound quality compare to the Marantz AV8802A, for movies or music?

I'm only running 7.1, but may be interested in 7.1.2 in the future if it matters. But the sound quality on 7.1 for movies and music is important.
 

Doodski

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We had a Marantz AV8802A that we liked a lot, but it's no longer turning on. We were very happy with it, but am a bit disappointed that this bit the dust after not making a full 6 years. Is this worth looking at getting repaired? It had worked fine until a few days ago, but just doesn't turn on - it's not getting any power past the cord inlet after doing all the usual checks and troubleshooting.

New Marantz seem very expensive, especially if the products don't last that long. I still have Yamahas going strong after 10-20 years, some of which were bought 1-2 years old secondhand!

How does something like Anthem AVM 70 or Emotiva RMC 1 sound quality compare to the Marantz AV8802A, for movies or music?

I'm only running 7.1, but may be interested in 7.1.2 in the future if it matters. But the sound quality on 7.1 for movies and music is important.
How did it die? Where you listening to it or where you just powering ON and noticed this?
 
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xirtam2005

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I don't know how it died. I came back from work Tuesday and it was off (off standby) and just wouldn't turn on anymore. Was not listening to it. It was either on and not being used or on standby when it died.
 

Doodski

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I don't know how it died. I came back from work Tuesday and it was off (off standby) and just wouldn't turn on anymore. Was not listening to it. It was either on and not being used or on standby when it died.
I see. The processor is possibly detecting voltage at the output transistors and the unit might be in protection mode. Is there a protect light on this unit to alert of protection engaged?
 

Doodski

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I'm going to download the owners manual and look for some stuff... I'll be a few minutes and will come back.
 
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xirtam2005

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I'm going to download the owners manual and look for some stuff... I'll be a few minutes and will come back.

Thanks. I don't know - I didn't notice any lights on. Normally there is a yellow/amber light when it turns off on standby. There are no lights on that I can tell. It's sad, because this sound was good enough that I wanted to keep this another 5 years. I do not want to downgrade to the 7000 series, and the new Marantz is like $7k.
 

Doodski

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OK I see it is a preamp only and not a receiver.
 
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xirtam2005

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OK I see it is a preamp only and not a receiver.
Thank you. Yes, it is the Marantz AV8802A preamp/processor. Got a good deal on it in early 2018 when it was being replaced by the AV8805. Marantz prices are insane now (to me), especially if they don't last long.
 

Doodski

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I found a partial service manual but for the entire manual they want money. Have you asked Marantz what they might charge you for this repair?
 
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xirtam2005

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I wasn't even going to go through Marantz. There is a third party Marantz authorized warranty/repair center that is about an hour drive away. Of course this is outside warranty now. :(

Sadly, seems a lot of others are having the same issue a little after 5 years with the same product. That is disappointing with Marantz:
 

Doodski

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Hmmz. There's a chance there might be a issue on the power input PCB as was indicated by the video on the web link you provided. The issue is without a service manual we are flying blind and cannot identify nor discuss the PCB workings and part numbers.
 

ban25

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It's probably an easy fix, since it's not turning on at all. Maybe a blown fuse. I would definitely look at having it repaired, even if you replace it after.
 
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xirtam2005

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It's probably an easy fix, since it's not turning on at all. Maybe a blown fuse. I would definitely look at having it repaired, even if you replace it after.

I hope so. It seems consistent with the others that happened right around the 5 year mark.

While I'm off getting it repaired, I realize I have an Oppo BDP-105 that still works fine. That has a 7.1 analog out. Other than the lack of room correction, that shouldn't be a step "down" sonically from the Marantz AV8802A for temporary use? Any tricks on making that work?
 

Chrispy

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Did you try something simple like just a soft reset (unplug it from power for a bit)?
 

peng

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I hope so. It seems consistent with the others that happened right around the 5 year mark.

While I'm off getting it repaired, I realize I have an Oppo BDP-105 that still works fine. That has a 7.1 analog out. Other than the lack of room correction, that shouldn't be a step "down" sonically from the Marantz AV8802A for temporary use? Any tricks on making that work?

I replaced myAV8801with a Denon AVR-X4400H in 2017 and felt like an upgrade in sound quality because of the newer and better dsp, vol control IC, and better SINAD, definitely quieter. The Denon is compatible with the Mult EQ app that will make it sound better than the 8802A for sure.

The AV8802A measured a little better than the AV8801 but still can't compare with the Denon AVR-X3600H, and the original X3700H, X4700H that have the AKM dac.

I would suggest you get it fixed, then sell it or trade it in for a Denon AVR-X4800H.

Or if you must have balanced outputs and don't to pay $7K, then consider the AVM70.

Fist thing to try, is to see if there is a blown fuse that you can replace. Hifi engine has the service manual, that should tell you if there are fuses that are easily accessible. I can take a look tomorrow too, time permitting.
 
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xirtam2005

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I replaced myAV8801with a Denon AVR-X4400H in 2017 and felt like an upgrade in sound quality because of the newer and better dsp, vol control IC, and better SINAD, definitely quieter. The Denon is compatible with the Mult EQ app that will make it sound better than the 8802A for sure.

The AV8802A measured a little better than the AV8801 but still can't compare with the Denon AVR-X3600H, and the original X3700H, X4700H that have the AKM dac.

I would suggest you get it fixed, then sell it or trade it in for a Denon AVR-X4800H.

Or if you must have balanced outputs and don't to pay $7K, then consider the AVM70.

Fist thing to try, is to see if there is a blown fuse that you can replace. Hifi engine has the service manual, that should tell you if there are fuses that are easily accessible. I can take a look tomorrow too, time permitting.

Thank you very much. Hopefully it's a relatively simple fix and that's that. We'll see.

I have a Parasound Halo A51 and A21 for the amps, so very happy with the amp department. Don't want to spend $$ for an AVR, as that'll be wasted space/features and don't want to add additional heat to the pre/pro area.

I don't know how the Anthem AVM 70 "sounds" compared to the Marantz AV8802A. Then there's also the Emotiva RMC-1. If it's still available, I might be able to get Marantz AV8805 closer to the price range of the others, but not sure it's the best bet anymore.

I thought the AV8802/AV8805, etc. also have the good AKM DAC? I'm not sure what Anthem has these days.

Is it easier to get better deals on Anthem, or Marantz these days?
 
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xirtam2005

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At least from Amir's testing, that Anthem and Emotiva look like contenders, as far as measurements:
1684030958487.png
 

peng

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Thank you very much. Hopefully it's a relatively simple fix and that's that. We'll see.

I quickly scanned the service manuals just now. There are many fuses, based on the info you provided, it is quite possible (cannot be sure, without troubleshooting) that the main transformer primary fuse is blown. It is 2 A fuse, the SCS2A, that you can buy from Denon (surprising it says made by Denon). I guessed unlike Denon, Marantz doesn't make parts, or at least not too much if they do.


1684062273582.png


I don't know how accessible it is, without open the case to look. Before attempting, two things need to be clear:
1) unplug the power cord, wait long enough to ensure all the capacitors have been discharged, to avoid getting shocked.
2) if you can locate the fuse (probably close to the power inlet based on the diagram), and it can be removed easily, checked it with a multimeter for continuity.

After that, you have to decide if you really want to replace it, after some careful consideration. Assuming it is in fact blown, because fuses usually are blown to protect the downstream parts/components. So, if you replace it without troubleshooting to find out if there are damaged parts, when you turned power back on, if there are in fact damaged parts, the fuse will blow again for the same reasons before, and this time it may result in new/more damages in certain downstream part, or parts.

However, if it is this fuse, then there is a good chance that there might have been nothing else damaged, and the fuse just blew after many times of the unit being power on/off many times, typically during power suge/outages and the fuse got aged/weakened/damaged by the transformer inrush currents.

So, if you are not an experienced repair person, it may be better to ask a technician to do some troubleshooting first and if no obvious damages are found, replace the fuse and see what happens, before going for a full blown troubleshooting/repair. In the latter case, you should insist on at least a not to exceed $ number so you can make an informed decision.

I have a Parasound Halo A51 and A21 for the amps, so very happy with the amp department. Don't want to spend $$ for an AVR, as that'll be wasted space/features and don't want to add additional heat to the pre/pro area.

I don't know how the Anthem AVM 70 "sounds" compared to the Marantz AV8802A. Then there's also the Emotiva RMC-1. If it's still available, I might be able to get Marantz AV8805 closer to the price range of the others, but not sure it's the best bet anymore.

I thought the AV8802/AV8805, etc. also have the good AKM DAC? I'm not sure what Anthem has these days.

Is it easier to get better deals on Anthem, or Marantz these days?

I have the power amps too at the time, for all 11 channels, but I switched to AVR due to limit spending at the time when the only viable alternative as the AV8805 that was listed for about $5,000, and knowing that it will not perform as good as the Denon AVRs, based on Amir's bench test results and so in doing so I saved more than $4,000 (I am in Canada). Yes, I never used the AVR's internal amps, so you are right that it is a waste. That being said, the fact that I spent $4,000 less and get better results, overall, I call it a win. Then I switched to the AVM70 because the Marantz AV10 (that I prefer) was not out yet at the time, and when it finally launched at US$7,000 list price, I thought wow, I made the right decision for switching to the AVM70, as that saved my $4,000 again!!

Waste or not, to me it is the overall results that counts, that is spend less, much less, and get more, or at least equal or close to equal value. You mentioned the heat to the pre/pro area, again, it is all engineering, if designed well, that is not an issue and at the end of the day you best bet is to see the bench test results that should reflect the effects. Having seen the measurements on ASR, it would make absolutely no sense for me to invest so much more on an Marantz AVP and get lower performance than any of those 4000 series Denon AVRs.

The AV8802A and AV8805/05A all have very decent AKM DAC, the AK4490, but after the factory fire, Marantz went with the ESS Sabre, but they picked the one that has very average specs, the ES9010K2M, so if you buy a 8805A now, you will get the ES9010K2M chip, that is same as those used in Anthem AVRs. The AVM70 uses a much better ES9038Q2M, that has specs very comparable with AK4490, the one used in the original AV8805/8805A. It is not just about the DAC chip itself, but the overall preamp/DAC implementation. Marant's overall performance as shown in the ASR bench tests just did not perform that well, while better than the Marantz AVRs, it is just not as good as any of the Denon AVRs measured on ASR in the last 3 years.

That's all about objective measurements, on the subjective side, I believe the different sound quality people claimed on forums, or reviews might have been mostly due to people not doing apples to apples comparison. It is very difficult to compare multichannel AVPs/AVRs side by side under the exact same conditions, let alone doing it in single or double blind. Based on specs and past measurements, I would say with certainty that in direct/pure direct mode, in a real apples to apples conditions, you will not be able to tell a difference between the 8805, AVM70 and their AVRs, but I am used to rely on facts and data/science... Subjectively, I am very impressed with the AVM70's sound quality, but less so with Anthem's way of doing things, it took a lot of getting used to. I also found Anthem ARC Genesis not as good as Audyssey XT32 Sub EQ Ht. For experience users, guided by REW/Umik-1 mic, I could get ARCG to perform as well as Audyssey in the bass range, but to just run it and use it, I suspect most users would end up with better bass performance with Audyssey (I posted graphs on the relevant threads).

If I were to face the same decision I had to face a few months ago, it would be tough for me to choose between the AVR-X4800H and the AVM70, or bite the bullet and go with the AV10.
 
OP
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xirtam2005

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I quickly scanned the service manuals just now. There are many fuses, based on the info you provided, it is quite possible (cannot be sure, without troubleshooting) that the main transformer primary fuse is blown. It is 2 A fuse, the SCS2A, that you can buy from Denon (surprising it says made by Denon). I guessed unlike Denon, Marantz doesn't make parts, or at least not too much if they do.


View attachment 285442

I don't know how accessible it is, without open the case to look. Before attempting, two things need to be clear:
1) unplug the power cord, wait long enough to ensure all the capacitors have been discharged, to avoid getting shocked.
2) if you can locate the fuse (probably close to the power inlet based on the diagram), and it can be removed easily, checked it with a multimeter for continuity.

After that, you have to decide if you really want to replace it, after some careful consideration. Assuming it is in fact blown, because fuses usually are blown to protect the downstream parts/components. So, if you replace it without troubleshooting to find out if there are damaged parts, when you turned power back on, if there are in fact damaged parts, the fuse will blow again for the same reasons before, and this time it may result in new/more damages in certain downstream part, or parts.

However, if it is this fuse, then there is a good chance that there might have been nothing else damaged, and the fuse just blew after many times of the unit being power on/off many times, typically during power suge/outages and the fuse got aged/weakened/damaged by the transformer inrush currents.

So, if you are not an experienced repair person, it may be better to ask a technician to do some troubleshooting first and if no obvious damages are found, replace the fuse and see what happens, before going for a full blown troubleshooting/repair. In the latter case, you should insist on at least a not to exceed $ number so you can make an informed decision.



I have the power amps too at the time, for all 11 channels, but I switched to AVR due to limit spending at the time when the only viable alternative as the AV8805 that was listed for about $5,000, and knowing that it will not perform as good as the Denon AVRs, based on Amir's bench test results and so in doing so I saved more than $4,000 (I am in Canada). Yes, I never used the AVR's internal amps, so you are right that it is a waste. That being said, the fact that I spent $4,000 less and get better results, overall, I call it a win. Then I switched to the AVM70 because the Marantz AV10 (that I prefer) was not out yet at the time, and when it finally launched at US$7,000 list price, I thought wow, I made the right decision for switching to the AVM70, as that saved my $4,000 again!!

Waste or not, to me it is the overall results that counts, that is spend less, much less, and get more, or at least equal or close to equal value. You mentioned the heat to the pre/pro area, again, it is all engineering, if designed well, that is not an issue and at the end of the day you best bet is to see the bench test results that should reflect the effects. Having seen the measurements on ASR, it would make absolutely no sense for me to invest so much more on an Marantz AVP and get lower performance than any of those 4000 series Denon AVRs.

The AV8802A and AV8805/05A all have very decent AKM DAC, the AK4490, but after the factory fire, Marantz went with the ESS Sabre, but they picked the one that has very average specs, the ES9010K2M, so if you buy a 8805A now, you will get the ES9010K2M chip, that is same as those used in Anthem AVRs. The AVM70 uses a much better ES9038Q2M, that has specs very comparable with AK4490, the one used in the original AV8805/8805A. It is not just about the DAC chip itself, but the overall preamp/DAC implementation. Marant's overall performance as shown in the ASR bench tests just did not perform that well, while better than the Marantz AVRs, it is just not as good as any of the Denon AVRs measured on ASR in the last 3 years.

That's all about objective measurements, on the subjective side, I believe the different sound quality people claimed on forums, or reviews might have been mostly due to people not doing apples to apples comparison. It is very difficult to compare multichannel AVPs/AVRs side by side under the exact same conditions, let alone doing it in single or double blind. Based on specs and past measurements, I would say with certainty that in direct/pure direct mode, in a real apples to apples conditions, you will not be able to tell a difference between the 8805, AVM70 and their AVRs, but I am used to rely on facts and data/science... Subjectively, I am very impressed with the AVM70's sound quality, but less so with Anthem's way of doing things, it took a lot of getting used to. I also found Anthem ARC Genesis not as good as Audyssey XT32 Sub EQ Ht. For experience users, guided by REW/Umik-1 mic, I could get ARCG to perform as well as Audyssey in the bass range, but to just run it and use it, I suspect most users would end up with better bass performance with Audyssey (I posted graphs on the relevant threads).

If I were to face the same decision I had to face a few months ago, it would be tough for me to choose between the AVR-X4800H and the AVM70, or bite the bullet and go with the AV10.

Thanks. Was away for work so just getting back to this. Will take it to a local repair shop to assess. If it costs more than ~$500 all in, probably not worth it due to the age and likelihood of something else going.

Also, thank you SO MUCH for revealing that Marantz cheaped out on current AV8805A DAC and deferred their good stuff to the overpriced AV10, and that they are not as good as previous AV8805A/AV8802A. AV10 is way too $$. Anthem AVM70 is well within the budget. I also prefer Arc Genesis.
 
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