Explain how to create an FIR file like I’m 5

[Spyerx]

Hey all - so I’m totally new to PEQ/correction, etc. Done a bunch of reading and searching but still not exactly clear on this and how to generate the files.

Here is what I’d like to do:
I have an Eversolo A8 and I’d like to use its DSP to do room correction when I’m playing digital.

I have iPhones, an M2 MacMini in this room, and am pretty tech savvy.

Anyway, I’d love a pointer to any threads or apps, or hardware needed to do this.

Appreciate the help. Here are some screenshots of the Eversolo screens.

 

[GaryY]

Using Room EQ Wizard to create FIR filters for the A8’s DSP

This is an attempt to show how I created FIR filters using Room EQ Wizard and how it affects the output of my speakers to hopefully remove some of the...

forum.zidoo.tv

 

[Spyerx]

Perfect, exactly what I was looking for thanks.

 

[GaryY]

Perfect, exactly what I was looking for thanks.

You are welcome. I'm already using the method of the 1st link. For 2nd one, I'm thinking how I have to try because I don't have separate subwoofer out from pre and subwoofer has only phase control.

 

[Martin]

Very interesting. Is it possible to use these correction files in piCorePlayer/LMS?

Martin

 

[GaryY]

Very interesting. Is it possible to use these correction files in piCorePlayer/LMS?

Martin

I don't have enough experience/knowledge to answer your question . Maybe some can help you. In my case DMP-A8 has DSP and FIR filter feature is available.

 

[Spyerx]

Alright, Mic ordered. Here we go. Maybe this inspires me to add a sub I have sitting in garage to my main system...

 

[staticV3]

Alright, Mic ordered. Here we go. Maybe this inspires me to add a sub I have sitting in garage to my main system...

OCA's tutorials are rather advanced and labor-intensive.

For a first try, take a look at https://www.loudspeakers.audio/en/.

 

[timiambeing]

I used to use REW but since finding HouseCurve life has got a great deal easier, so easy to use and so quick I’m even doing measures after the adjustments have been made just to check! Apple only, and you really do need a mic for best results as the iPhone only goes down to around 60Hz, but it’s a great app and plenty of help on the Roon forum…

 

[darrellc]

I used to use REW but since finding HouseCurve life has got a great deal easier, so easy to use and so quick I’m even doing measures after the adjustments have been made just to check! Apple only, and you really do need a mic for best results as the iPhone only goes down to around 60Hz, but it’s a great app and plenty of help on the Roon forum…

@timiambeing - HouseCurve is great! I used it to set up 10 band PEQ on my MiniDSP which has helped a lot. Have you used HouseCurve to create a FIR filter? Thought I'd try using HouseCurve to create a FIR filter, but it generates an impulse WAV file while my MiniDSP Flex requires a text file with FIR coefficients. By any chance have you solved how to do that conversion? Did a quick search and seems not simple.

 

[timiambeing]

@timiambeing - HouseCurve is great! I used it to set up 10 band PEQ on my MiniDSP which has helped a lot. Have you used HouseCurve to create a FIR filter? Thought I'd try using HouseCurve to create a FIR filter, but it generates an impulse WAV file while my MiniDSP Flex requires a text file with FIR coefficients. By any chance have you solved how to do that conversion? Did a quick search and seems not simple.

As far as I can tell, I only get the option for impulse file if I select PEQ, when I select FIR in the equalise setting there’s no option, so I just export that. It does end up as a load of .wav files, one for each sample rate, which I then select and compress into a zip file. Roon accepts the .zip file and it just works… maybe your EQ software wants something different? I should ask Glenn at HouseCurve, or search the help on the website?

 

[darrellc]

As far as I can tell, I only get the option for impulse file if I select PEQ, when I select FIR in the equalise setting there’s no option, so I just export that. It does end up as a load of .wav files, one for each sample rate, which I then select and compress into a zip file. Roon accepts the .zip file and it just works… maybe your EQ software wants something different? I should ask Glenn at HouseCurve, or search the help on the website?

Just googled it and yep, looks like Roon imports .wav files for their DSP engine, but miniDSP requires .bin files. I'll ping Glenn after I take another look at HouseCurve support website. Thx!

 

[timiambeing]

Just googled it and yep, looks like Roon imports .wav files for their DSP engine, but miniDSP requires .bin files. I'll ping Glenn after I take another look at HouseCurve support website. Thx!

Yes I just looked at the app notes and he demonstrates using PEQ for MiniDSP

 

[Keith_W]

Quick overview of FIR filter software:

- REW/rePhase: Pros: free. Surprisingly powerful. Cons: very manual, no automation, requires in-depth knowledge of DSP. Steep learning curve. No Wizards!
- Acourate: Pros: not free, but cheap. Very powerful. Cons: very manual, minimal automation, requires in-depth knowledge of DSP. Some processes are Wizard based. Steep learning curve. Windows only.
- Audiolense: Pros: costs more than Acourate, but still inexpensive. Very powerful. More automation than Acourate and makes more use of Wizards. Cons: although easier to use than Acourate and faster, it still has a learning curve. Windows only.
- Focus Fidelity: Pros: runs on Windows and Mac. More automation, and easier to use than above options. Also Wizard based. Cons: this is new software and lacks some of the options of Acourate/Audiolense (for example, it is unable to make crossovers).
- Dirac Live: Pros: a lot of automation. Runs on Windows and Mac. Cons: I am aware of complaints that the mechanics of the automation is opaque and it sometimes does wrong corrections.

There are others, like FIR Designer and even MATLAB can be used to make FIR's. I haven't looked at those other options.

This is a personal opinion, but I think that nothing beats a human making decisions about corrections vs. a machine. The downside is the learning curve and how slow it is. It is also likely that your first efforts will be inferior to an automated program making decisions for you, and this will likely continue to be the case until your knowledge improves.

 

[Shadrach]

This is a personal opinion, but I think that nothing beats a human making decisions about corrections vs. a machine. The downside is the learning curve and how slow it is. It is also likely that your first efforts will be inferior to an automated program making decisions for you, and this will likely continue to be the case until your knowledge improves.

Couldn't agree more. One doesn't learn much about the process and adjustments one can make otherwise.

 

[Spyerx]

Love all the info here thank you!

 

[Keith_W]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention - the no. 1 reason for bad sounding DSP is user error. It is VERY EASY to make mistakes with DSP and get sound that is worse than no correction at all. Software automation helps deal with this, and it usually results in correction which is better than standard, however it will only get you so far. If you want to squeeze out every last drop of performance from your system, the only way is manual control where you make the decisions.

However there is an easier option than that, which will give you superior results to automated software - that is, to hire a person to design FIR filters for you. I recommend @mitchco, his website is here. You will need a measurement setup (microphone, interface, PC with internet connection) along with the software he recommends (I think he is using Audiolense). I have never used his services, but I have corresponded with him. He is approachable and friendly.

@UliBru (author of Acourate) also offers a consulting service. The requirements are the same, except that you need an Acourate license. Uli is great, he is incredibly patient.

The likely dealbreaker for you is that both Audiolense and Acourate require Windows. I am not sure if Mitch offers a service for Mac users. I know he has been playing around with Focus Fidelity (which runs on Macs), but I don't know if he offers a FF correction service. Best to email him and ask.

The alternative to hiring a service like that would be to DIY. It is a fun and rewarding experience. And if you have filters which have been professionally designed for you, you won't have to suffer years of terrible sound from terrible corrections like I did. You can make it your project to improve upon the professionally designed filter

 

[Keith_W]

I am not sure how Mitch does it, but Uli does it with Teamviewer. There are other consultants, e.g. Pierre from Home Audio Fidelity. I have no idea what he uses, and I have never seen anyone talk about him.

 

[GaryY]

Quick overview of FIR filter software:

- REW/rePhase: Pros: free. Surprisingly powerful. Cons: very manual, no automation, requires in-depth knowledge of DSP. Steep learning curve. No Wizards!
- Acourate: Pros: not free, but cheap. Very powerful. Cons: very manual, minimal automation, requires in-depth knowledge of DSP. Some processes are Wizard based. Steep learning curve. Windows only.
- Audiolense: Pros: costs more than Acourate, but still inexpensive. Very powerful. More automation than Acourate and makes more use of Wizards. Cons: although easier to use than Acourate and faster, it still has a learning curve. Windows only.
- Focus Fidelity: Pros: runs on Windows and Mac. More automation, and easier to use than above options. Also Wizard based. Cons: this is new software and lacks some of the options of Acourate/Audiolense (for example, it is unable to make crossovers).
- Dirac Live: Pros: a lot of automation. Runs on Windows and Mac. Cons: I am aware of complaints that the mechanics of the automation is opaque and it sometimes does wrong corrections.

There are others, like FIR Designer and even MATLAB can be used to make FIR's. I haven't looked at those other options.

This is a personal opinion, but I think that nothing beats a human making decisions about corrections vs. a machine. The downside is the learning curve and how slow it is. It is also likely that your first efforts will be inferior to an automated program making decisions for you, and this will likely continue to be the case until your knowledge improves.

Thanks for lots of information. This makes me think it over whether pay and enjoy music or have fun with difficult task.

 

[Keith_W]

Thanks for lots of information. This makes me think it over whether pay and enjoy music or have fun with difficult task.

For beginners, I recommend you do both. You will be taught how to use your program, and you will get a set of filters to use. After that you apply what you have learnt and try some variations. Maybe different XO points, maybe different target curve. You should repeat the entire correction exercise at least once to make sure you understood what has been taught. If you fail or get bored ... at least you have a set of filters that you can use.

BTW, I should remind you that DSP is specific to your setup, down to the last minor detail. If you move your listening position, you have to redo the DSP. Or like me, all I did was rotate my system 90 degrees in my listening room, and I redid the DSP from ground up. Needless to say, if you move home, you have to redo your DSP.