does 2.0 systems sound better than 2.1 AT SAME TOTAL COST (4 high quality drivers vs 5 lower quality drivers)

[amanieux]

What is the best compromise? There is no single answer to this question.

don't you think you can listen to 2 speakers at the same price point and say this one is better overall (better compromise as nothing is perfect) than this one ?

 

[voodooless]

don't you think you can listen to 2 speakers at the same price point and say this one is better overall (better compromise as nothing is perfect) than this one ?

I might, but that is hardly the point of the exercise. Your asking for generalizations, not specifics.

 

[amanieux]

I might, but that is hardly the point of the exercise. Your asking for generalizations, not specifics.

I am asking for rule of thumbs generalization that covers 80%, that is better than nothing to do the hard task of selecting where compromises should be made when choosing what speaker to buy

 

[polmuaddib]

In this hobby, or any hobby for that matter, you never buy something once and that's it. Upgrade is the name of the game.

So, my answer is to buy the best speakers you can afford at the time, preferably floorstanders and then buy the sub you want, when budget refills.

Otherwise, if you buy cheaper speakers and sub at once, you leave room for doubt, like, did I do the right thing, and finally you sell at a loss and buy the ones you wanted in the first place...

 

[amanieux]

In this hobby, or any hobby for that matter, you never buy something once and that's it. Upgrade is the name of the game.

So, my answer is to buy the best speakers you can afford at the time, preferably floorstanders and then buy the sub you want, when budget refills.

Otherwise, if you buy cheaper speakers and sub at once, you leave room for doubt, like, did I do the right thing, and finally you sell at a loss and buy the ones you wanted in the first place...

That is precisely because we keep upgrading gear as we go along our audiophile journey that we need some rules of thumb to understand what we must look for in our purchases decision

 

[STC]

Spend your money on 2.0. Once you have paid attention to room acoustics and speakers placements then focus on the LF. Do you need more? Then add the sub.

 

[bodhi]

In this hobby, or any hobby for that matter, you never buy something once and that's it. Upgrade is the name of the game.

So, my answer is to buy the best speakers you can afford at the time, preferably floorstanders and then buy the sub you want, when budget refills.

Otherwise, if you buy cheaper speakers and sub at once, you leave room for doubt, like, did I do the right thing, and finally you sell at a loss and buy the ones you wanted in the first place...

There are two different hobbies: one is listening to stuff and the another is listening the equipment. Nothing wrong with either, but if you are mostly into the former then those 500€ speakers with decent subs can be endgame. Even many of us in the equipment hobby can admit that we passed the point of diminishing returns so long ago it's no longer even visible in the rear mirror.

 

[polmuaddib]

There are two different hobbies: one is listening to stuff and the another is listening the equipment. Nothing wrong with either, but if you are mostly into the former then those 500€ speakers with decent subs can be endgame. Even many of us in the equipment hobby can admit that we passed the point of diminishing returns so long ago it's no longer even visible in the rear mirror.

You misunderstood me. Let me use numbers to be more clear:
You have budget of 500 USD now.
Speakers A which have objectively 7 rating and with a sub, rating is 10 - speakers A cost 500 USD and a sub is 500 also.
Speakers B with objective rating 5 and with a matching sub is 8 and it all costs 500 USD.

With speakers B you will get 8 rating at most, but you could achieve 10 with speakers A in a couple of months or a year. Whatever...

What do you do?

I say go slowly, buy better speakers now and later upgrade with sub.

BTW, if you are following ASR, we are in the same hobby - we care about the sound quality.

 

[ZolaIII]

@polmuaddib don't by speakers based on calculated rating learn to read and understand/interpret measurements properly. Speaker can have a very good rating and still have flaws you can't correct (like fluffy zwing from woofer of too high left crossover or cabinet resonance which will barely show on FR plot and other things that are still important and not in frequency specter) or simply won't meet your needs. Sometimes speakers with relatively low calculated score can have a very good one when crossed with a sub and EQ-ed. Anyway point is calculated score on it's own can be misleading. Future more the room rules what you will get in the end and some things simply can't be corrected in for example small room. You can't say someone to buy a new hause with a perfect dedicated listening room, gear is worth penny's in compression with that and at the end perfect scoring 10 of 10 and perfect speakers in generally are (still) only science fiction. Hobby part for me isn't gear or listening but learning and you have to stay open minded (and open for induction) in order to do that and more knowledge you gain that becomes harder to do.

 

[AnalogSteph]

As another example, at the $2000 budget point, it becomes hard to classify which 2.0 speaker of the same size is better. However diverting some of that budget to a subwoofer yields a tangible upgrade if your 2.0 are 5-inch.

That's another point to keep in mind. Driver quality matters, but you can't cheat physics altogether. At some point you can pour as much extra money into 5" bookshelves as you want, but they will invariably have their limits in how much bass level you can get out of them. Required excursion invariably quadruples for every octave lower at a given level and driver size.

On the opposite end of the price spectrum, there is no point in going 2.1 when the budget won't even suffice for some decent bookshelves. Though the specifics are going to depend on what you are listening to at what kind of level. Someone primarily listening to "girl with a guitar" type singer-songwriter material is going to have different priorities than someone who is into electro. Classical orchestral with potentially a lot of dynamics (and instruments that should sound realistic) but not an awful lot of deep bass is a slightly different kettle of fish again.

 

[Danaxus]

The question posed can't readily be answered - there are too many unknowns to give an honest response. It really depends on your room size, shape, and what you want from your system.

First of all a correction - whilst it's true we're most sensitive to midrange frequencies, the balance between bass and treble is extremely important. For example, if you have a great frequency response in the highs, but you have no bass, your brain will tell you that the sound is too bright. Similarly, if you have some bass, but it's not loud enough, but you have way too much absorption in the high end, the room will sound like it has too much bass (at least according to Toole and Olive). We feel most comfortable when the bass and treble are balanced.

That said, there are considerations to make. If your sound system is designed for movies, especially action flicks, you need a lot of low end (<20Hz). Maybe you want to feel your bowel resonating when there's a big explosion on screen. In that case, you probably care more about low-end extension, than good directivity.
On the other hand, if you mainly listen to music (with the possible exception of electronic music perhaps), then you don't really get all that much sound below 40Hz - something which a modest sub can handle just fine. In that case, your priority will be speakers with good directivity and a not-shit frequency response that can be EQ'd easily.

So is 2.0 better, or 2.1? Depends on the room, your needs, etc. It's kinda like asking whether chocolate or steak is better - it really depends on where you are and whether you want dessert or dinner. A better approach is to state your situation, your budget, and your needs, then solve for x.

 

[ozzy9832001]

I kind of feel that 2 subs plus a decent sized woofer on the mains is probably the best combination and the best way to tackle modal issues that will ultimately crop up. I feel a decent 3 way speaker would give the best world. Create some separation from the woofer and tweeter.

 

[GXAlan]

It’s a hard question, but I would probably lean toward 2.1 because at the same cost, the cabinetry for the full range 2.0 has to be balanced by the lower cost cabinetry of the 2.1 setup. It seems like the electronics for a subwoofer have to be factored in too.

If you compare Studio 590 vs Studio 530+550p, you are still saving money with the 2.1 setup and the sound may be more similar than different.