Denon AVR-X6700H AVR Review (Updated)

[Patrick Yo!]

Just read this entire thread and it's super-handy for anyone with this Denon receiver. Thanks to all!
Question: Didn't see it mentioned, although does anyone know for sure what the maximum preamp voltage output is for the following configuration? I want to add an amp for my front speakers and continue to utilize Denon's internal amplifiers for surrounds.

 

[rvsixer]

Just read this entire thread and it's super-handy for anyone with this Denon receiver. Thanks to all!
Question: Didn't see it mentioned, although does anyone know for sure what the maximum preamp voltage output is for the following configuration? I want to add an amp for my front speakers and continue to utilize Denon's internal amplifiers for surrounds.

See "THD+N versus output level" graph in first post. You can basically add any normal gain amp and be fine "avr-to-amp" SINAD wise.

 

[Patrick Yo!]

See "THD+N versus output level" graph in first post. You can basically add any normal gain amp and be fine "avr-to-amp" SINAD wise.

Thanks rvsixer! So optimal preamp voltage output is 1.5v although peak is 4.4v, am I reading that correctly? I'm working with a sales guy and the preamp voltage was the first thing he asked about. Looking at ATI amps and a couple others based on suggestions in this thread.

 

[rvsixer]

You got it. Phrased another way, you'll never hear any difference at up to 4.4V. As for amp $$$, I'd suggest Buckeye as again you'll never hear any difference .

 

[SharinganUser]

You got it. Phrased another way, you'll never hear any difference at up to 4.4V. As for amp $$$, I'd suggest Buckeye as again you'll never hear any difference .

+1. Buckeye is legit the only smart choice lol. Best decision I have ever made when it comes to home theater.

 

[Patrick Yo!]

+1. Buckeye is legit the only smart choice lol. Best decision I have ever made when it comes to home theater.

Which amp did you purchase and for what purpose?

 

[SharinganUser]

Which amp did you purchase and for what purpose?

NC502MP 6 ch. They are powering my front wall. Q50a front height and R6/R3 METAs.

 

[Deleted member 71304]

I found on offer both the Denon AVC-X6700H and the Denon AVC-X4800H. In my case they are going to be used for movies and music in dolby atmos (Apple)
I will use external power amps for the mains and the rear surrounds.
Also: if needed I can use an external dac (JDS Atom or Schiit modi)
Which one would you recommend me?
Thanks a lot in advance for reading

 

[Barney O'Hara]

I got the 6700 because the price was lowered and it has the older type inputs for anything I might want to dig out on my old vcr. Other than that, I would have been happy with the 4700. From what I have read, they both do a good job. Check their backs for inputs and outputs and see if that meets what your needs, then go for what is the best value is my view.

 

[rvsixer]

I found on offer both the Denon AVC-X6700H and the Denon AVC-X4800H. In my case they are going to be used for movies and music in dolby atmos (Apple)
I will use external power amps for the mains and the rear surrounds.
Also: if needed I can use an external dac (JDS Atom or Schiit modi)
Which one would you recommend me?
Thanks a lot in advance for reading

Judging by your use description, you will be using the Denon's internal amps for side surrounds and atmos tops. In that case I would give nod to the 4800, since you can disconnect internal amps from each preout selectively. IIRC on the 6700, you can only disconnect amps on LR mains (remaining amps stay connected), or disconnect ALL amps (unit becomes a prepro only).

Regarding the external DAC, you don't want to use one on the Denon (since its output would get converted to digital again anway, and then get converted back to analog by the Denon). No sense in adding all that to the chain for no fidelity gain at all.

 

[Deleted member 71304]

Judging by your use description, you will be using the Denon's internal amps for side surrounds and atmos tops. In that case I would give nod to the 4800, since you can disconnect internal amps from each preout selectively. IIRC on the 6700, you can only disconnect amps on LR mains (remaining amps stay connected), or disconnect ALL amps (unit becomes a prepro only).

This is a really useful piece of information!
Thank you very much

 

[Deleted member 71304]

Judging by your use description, you will be using the Denon's internal amps for side surrounds and atmos tops. In that case I would give nod to the 4800, since you can disconnect internal amps from each preout selectively. IIRC on the 6700, you can only disconnect amps on LR mains (remaining amps stay connected), or disconnect ALL amps (unit becomes a prepro only).

I got the 6700 because the price was lowered and it has the older type inputs for anything I might want to dig out on my old vcr. Other than that, I would have been happy with the 4700. From what I have read, they both do a good job. Check their backs for inputs and outputs and see if that meets what your needs, then go for what is the best value is my view.

Thanks for your quick responses

 

[peng]

I found on offer both the Denon AVC-X6700H and the Denon AVC-X4800H. In my case they are going to be used for movies and music in dolby atmos (Apple)
I will use external power amps for the mains and the rear surrounds.
Also: if needed I can use an external dac (JDS Atom or Schiit modi)
Which one would you recommend me?
Thanks a lot in advance for reading

You can use an external dac’s analog output and listen in direct or pure direct mode. That means you won’t be using dsp functions such as Audyssey, or Dirac.

I would recommend the 4800 if you don’t need more than 11 chanels because of 2 main advantages, a) Dirac Live capable, b) 4 discrete subouts.

 

[Miker 1102]

This is an updated review of the Denon AVR-X6700H. I tested an early production 6700H a few weeks ago and found lower than expected performance. Denon Engineering traced this to a faulty capacitor( or capacitors) used in the initial run of this AVR. I requested an updated unit which the company was kind enough to send me.

View attachment 79205

I have re-tested the DAC portion almost completely but for the amplifier I am just showing some of the highlights as the problem was not there.

EDIT: this is the serial number of the tested unit: DBCY032000007

Updated AVR DAC Measurements
The original AVR-X6700H returned a SINAD of just 87 dB which was well short of what the lower end models had achieved. I am pleased to report that this second unit nicely remedies that defect:

View attachment 79206

This catapults the 6700H into the coveted green category of DACs from formerly red status:
View attachment 79207

Initially I had some problem with dynamic range in one channel. I traced that to noise due to grounding. Upon unifying the Audio Precision chassis with that of the AVR that problem was remedied and performance is as good as before now:

View attachment 79209

IMD test shows the improved distortion:

View attachment 79210

Linearity improved as well:

View attachment 79211

As did filtering:

View attachment 79212

Distortion in lower frequencies in multitone are the same as before but at mid to higher frequencies, it is much better:

View attachment 79213

As expected, this showed up in THD+N versus frequency:

View attachment 79214

And here is our favorite new graph with THD+N versus output level:

View attachment 79215

Per requests, I turned up the volume so that we could go beyond 4 volts to see the response there for external amplifiers that are much less sensitive (green).

AVR Amplifier Updated Measurements
The amplifier did not change but improved grounding did make some things better. In Dashboard we are dominated by distortion so this remains the same:

View attachment 79216

View attachment 79218

But signal to noise ratio improved good bit:

View attachment 79219

Note that this is NOT due to the capacitor fix but rather better grounding of the AVR and measurement system.

And here is a power sweep showing that the one channel that was misbehaving before, no longer is:

View attachment 79221

Conclusions
Engineers struggle to improve system performance by 3 dB. Here, the proper capacitor resulted in whopping 12 dB increase in SINAD. That is a lot of performance to have left on the table. The AVR-X6700H goes from "hmmm? to "now this is nice!" with this component change.

Given the new performance, I am happy to recommend the Denon AVR-X6700H. The company has a great platform here relative to its competitors and now you go up and down the models and not given up on the core value of it.

-----------
As always, questions, comments, recommendations, etc. are welcome.

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I’m sorry @amirm, but it definitely is not only the capacitor that changed.. stopband went from -60 to almost -100 dB. I already asked about this in the original review like 3 times.. nobody seemed to care.. now it seems to me again that it is still very relevant. So once again: what’s up with that?

I never bought the capacitor theory. Maybe the downgrade on Dac?

 

[rvsixer]

You can use an external dac’s analog output and listen in direct or pure direct mode. That means you won’t be using dsp functions such as Audyssey, or Dirac.

@Sylvia - This is possible, but imo think long and hard about giving up all the benefits of DSP (noticeable improvement when properly implemented), before trying to gain a couple of (likely inaudible) differences in SINAD by using an external DAC into and through the AVR in direct mode.

 

[Deleted member 71304]

@Sylvia - This is possible, but imo think long and hard about giving up all the benefits of DSP (noticeable improvement when properly implemented), before trying to gain a couple of (likely inaudible) differences in SINAD by using an external DAC into and through the AVR in direct mode.

yep that totally makes sense, dsp is far more useful

 

[Deleted member 71304]

@Sylvia - This is possible, but imo think long and hard about giving up all the benefits of DSP (noticeable improvement when properly implemented), before trying to gain a couple of (likely inaudible) differences in SINAD by using an external DAC into and through the AVR in direct mode.

My main doubt is if the use of upmixing for music streamed from Spotify really adds sth worth the investment or the result is rather sloppy

 

[rvsixer]

My main doubt is if the use of upmixing for music streamed from Spotify really adds sth worth the investment or the result is rather sloppy

I'm not sure I follow. If you to the external DAC to AVR direct mode configuration, you can't do upmixing. If you do external DAC to AVR DSP, you can do upmixing but add totally unnecessary digital<->analog conversions and extra cost. If you forget about the external DAC, you can do anything you want (DSP, no DSP, bass management, no bass management, straight stereo, upmixing, etc.).

And if Spotify is the source, it doesn't matter much sound quality wise anyway .

 

[paulcc]

I wonder if the X3800 suffered from a similar component issue that resulted in its poor performance?

 

[Deleted member 77012]

I can’t help but tending to accept any conclusion towards stating that the typical quality of AV receivers/amps is far from what one might know from dealing with »normal« 2-channel HiFi audio equipment.

So far I had three of those AVRs, 1 Onkyo, 2 Denons – and none of them did satisfy me inasmuch as to recommend them to anybody else. Which is a shame – to the makers as well as to me