Denon AVR-X3700H AVR Review

[Chrispy]

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Does a local Magnolia have a way of acquiring one from another that may have it in-stock?

 

[BullBuchanan]

Accessories4Less is also sold out, so I may just end up getting a refund and trying to hold on until the x3800h comes out.

 

[isolar8001]

Accessories4Less is also sold out, so I may just end up getting a refund and trying to hold on until the x3800h comes out.

It will probably end up better for you in the long run, given that at some point you will run into the HDMI 2.1 bug. Sorry this happened to you, but it happens. The 3800 will probably be the same unit with "fixed" HDMI ports.

 

[BullBuchanan]

It will probably end up better for you in the long run, given that at some point you will run into the HDMI 2.1 bug. Sorry this happened to you, but it happens. The 3800 will probably be the same unit with "fixed" HDMI ports.

Yea, I had ordered the box that fixes it, but I'm sure it will affect resale value down the road too.

 

[BullBuchanan]

The plot thickens: When I try to access the denon settings while connected to eRAC I'm now seeing a connection error most of the time. So somewhere an HDMI handshake is failing. I really hate the idea of sending back receivers and TV's to try to rootcause which one it is.

It's funny because if I go back to the TV the ARC functionality works and I can get the TV sound into the AVR but it seems to flake out when I try to access the AVR settings

 

[BullBuchanan]

The plot thickens: When I try to access the denon settings while connected to eRAC I'm now seeing a connection error most of the time. So somewhere an HDMI handshake is failing. I really hate the idea of sending back receivers and TV's to try to rootcause which one it is.

It's funny because if I go back to the TV the ARC functionality works and I can get the TV sound into the AVR but it seems to flake out when I try to access the AVR settings. I'm starting to wonder if the receiver turning off could be a CEC issue.

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[McFly]

The plot thickens: When I try to access the denon settings while connected to eRAC I'm now seeing a connection error most of the time. So somewhere an HDMI handshake is failing. I really hate the idea of sending back receivers and TV's to try to rootcause which one it is.

It's funny because if I go back to the TV the ARC functionality works and I can get the TV sound into the AVR but it seems to flake out when I try to access the AVR settings

View attachment 132658

Does it on my TV too, I figured it was a bug. Switching to another source on the AVR fixes it. Go to CD and then you get the settings show up

 

[wseroyer]

I've had my 3700 on order for a month now, I asked them if they could get me 4700 faster they have yet have anything show up, thinking about just waiting for the new Yamaha's to come out.

 

[Stuj]

Bull, how is your U8G doing still, I’be been eagerly awaiting its release (or equivalent) here in Australia, any niggles so far with the picture ? Sorry to Hijack thread .

 

[BullBuchanan]

Bull, how is your U8G doing still, I’be been eagerly awaiting its release (or equivalent) here in Australia, any niggles so far with the picture ? Sorry to Hijack thread .

Mine is fantastic. i really couldn't be happier. Others have had issues though. One guy has already gone through 3 sets with the same issue. If you're interested, there's a dedicated thread on AVS.

 

[BullBuchanan]

Regarding my x3700h turning off randomly. I'm investigating it being a potential CEC issue, as I've found it can cause these sorts of problems from other's experiences. The A4L rep is giving me a real hard time about it and trying to say my speakers are causing the issue, which I think is extremely unlikely.

 

[schpuns]

With regards to choosing an external amp to power the Denon X3700H I've been told that it's very important to get one with a specific sensitivity that will match the Denon's pre-out voltage gain. Saw this review and I quote " As you see, peak performance with the amplifiers off is around 1.1 volts with SINAD of 101 dB which is excellent for an AVR. With the amps on, you are OK up to 1.4 volt output before it nose dives. So when selecting an external amplifier for channels beyond fronts, make sure it can output its maximum power at or below 1.4 volts (usually specified as "sensitivity"). " I never knew this until I asked someone if getting the Rotel RMB1585 was a good idea to use as an external amp. The INPUT SENSITIVITY is as follows: Line Level Inputs (RCA): 1.9V / Line Level Inputs (XLR): 3.8V. 1.9V is WAY above the recommended 1.4 volt. Am I correct that I should choose a power amp with an Input Sensitivity of 1.4V or lower? IF an input voltage to an amp is less than it's rated sensitivity, the amp will not come close to amplifying the signal to it's rated wattage. SO, if I use the Rotel, it most likely will make less output wattage per channel than just using the Denon alone and there is no point in spending money on an amp that actually makes less power than the AVR that it's connected to. Or will the Rotel RMB1585 paired with the X3700H be fine? I plan to externally power just the 3 front speakers and just let the Denon handle the other surround speakers. Setup is 7.2.4.

@ciotime : Hi, I'm exactly in the same situation: I'm about to buy this Rotel 1582 MKII and a Denon AVR-X3700H but I'm concerned about this input sensitivity voltage issue. What did you finally do and why?
My front speakers need a lot of juice and therefor I want to use the Denon AV as a preamp and drive speakers (Focal Aria 936 = 300W at 8ohm) with a powerful amp.

 

[peng]

@ciotime : Hi, I'm exactly in the same situation: I'm about to buy this Rotel 1582 MKII and a Denon AVR-X3700H but I'm concerned about this input sensitivity voltage issue. What did you finally do and why?
My front speakers need a lot of juice and therefor I want to use the Denon AV as a preamp and drive speakers (Focal Aria 936 = 300W at 8ohm) with a powerful amp.

1.9 V can drive the 1582MKII to its rated 200 W into 8 Ohms or 400 W into 4 Ohms so there is nothing to worry about even if you do push the amp to its limit (I hope you don't, bad for your hearing..) The Denon can output 2 V very cleanly and could go much higher, more than 3 V for sure without clipping.

By the way, if you sit far away and listen loud, like close to reference level, the Rotel will clip during peaks, so I suggest you figure out how much power (max., peak) you would need before deciding on the power amp. The 1582MKII only offers about 3 dB more than the little AVR, in my opinion, not worth it, if the goal is to have more power than you need to avoid even the occasional clipping during the highest peaks.

 

[schpuns]

Thanks for your reply.

The Denon can output 2 V very cleanly and could go much higher, more than 3 V for sure without clipping.

Is this output voltage automatically adapt to the connected power amp? Or does it vary depending on the volume on the AV receiver? I don't understand quite well this point....

Also, according to @amirm test, the SINAD performance drops beyond 1.4V (best perf is at 1.1V).

It's not about sitting close or far: the thing is, the front speakers really need a lot of juice to make them sound fully and make the 3 woofers correctly "breathe". I had previously an Onkyo RZ900 with 145W at 8ohms and when I had for test this Rotel it sounded totally different, event at the same volume. To me it's not about dB, it's about how plenty and fully bodied are juiced the speakers.

Not mentioning that when watching movies in 5.1 the Denon power will be splitted and for sure will poorly drive the front speakers.

 

[peng]

Thanks for your reply.

Also, according to @amirm test, the SINAD performance drops beyond 1.4V (best perf is at 1.1V).

A few points to note:

- SINAD versus Output voltage typically don't remain constant, so you have to look at the curve and assess its performance for your applications. For example, if your maximum requirement is 2 V, then take a look of the SINAD between 0 and 2 V and if the best is (in this case) 101 dB at 1.1 V, but the worse point is about 92.5 dB at almost 0 V output then you are in good shape.

In % THD+N, 101 dB is about 0.0008913, and 92.5 dB is about 0.0023714. Even at the worst point between 0 - 2 V, THD+N, at 0.002% is better than a lot of the so called "separate" high end preamp processors.

- Even without using the preamp mode, SINAD only dropped to about 75 dB at 2 V, that's about 0.018% THD+N, still not that bad.

It's not about sitting close or far: the thing is, the front speakers really need a lot of juice to make them sound fully and make the 3 woofers correctly "breathe". I had previously an Onkyo RZ900 with 145W at 8ohms and when I had for test this Rotel it sounded totally different, event at the same volume. To me it's not about dB, it's about how plenty and fully bodied are juiced the speakers.

How far you does matter a lot because spl drops 6 dB every time you double the distance, that is a fact. Your will get some room gain that does vary with distance but is mainly in the bass frequencies. Room gain or not though, the inverse square law of SPL drop with distance still applies, room gain simply offset the loss due to distance to some extents.
Inverse Square Law (engineeringtoolbox.com)

To make up for every 3 dB drop in SPL, you need double the power. So if you are getting 105 dB peak (THX) from say 2 meters, to get the same SPL if you sit from 4 meters, you will need double the "Watts". If you need 150 W for the highest peak spl sitting 8 ft, then you will need 300 W for the same spl if you sit further back at 16 ft.

Not mentioning that when watching movies in 5.1 the Denon power will be splitted and for sure will poorly drive the front speakers.

Of course the Rotel will be much more powerful in the 5 channel driven condition, but it is also a fact that for most movie contents, it would be rare for all channels to peak simultaneously. If you have subwoofers and XO set to 80 Hz or higher that would help too.

Regardless, I did say you need to figure out how much power you actually need and that even the Rotel amp may clip during peaks let alone a 26 lbs AVR soaked and wet.

You can use an online calculator such as this one:

Peak SPL Calculator (homestead.com)
Note: That calculator is base on sensitivity using the format X dB/1W/1m so instead of the 92 dB/2.83V/1m Focal specified, use 89 dB or even 87 dB for the calculation just to be conservative as the Focal's curve showed a low trough with a dip to 2.8 Ohm.

Without finding out what your power need (even just a ball park number) is, we are just guessing. If we are going to guess, then I would recommend a 300W/500W 8/4 Ohms. Those are nice speakers, so give them what they deserve..

 

[peng]

Thanks for your reply.

Is this output voltage automatically adapt to the connected power amp? Or does it vary depending on the volume on the AV receiver? I don't understand quite well this point....

It vary with the input signal level and the volume setting. At a given/fixed volume setting, example: -10, the output voltage will then only vary with the input signal level. That is, during a quiet scene in the movie, the pre out voltage could be 0 or near 0 and during a loud explosion, it could be 0.5 V or higher. I just picked some random numbers as an example.

 

[Fahzz]

Does a local Magnolia have a way of acquiring one from another that may have it in-stock?

When I went to a local Best Buy a couple of weeks ago, they had a 3700 on display, but they wouldn't sell it to me as a demo. They did say they could get a new one from Magnolia but I didn't push it. It was a Massachusetts store. Happy hunting.

 

[BullBuchanan]

To follow up on my previous issues with the Denon restarting, I unplugged and re-plugged it in last Saturday after it happened and it hasn't happened since. When it was initially plugged back in the first time following the lighting storm, I had the Mrs do it, and maybe the connection was slightly weak.

I am still having some goofy audio issues though that are hard to nail down between the TV (source) and the receiver. I was watching a movie on Hulu last night and the sound suddenly cut out and the video kept playing. Exiting the app didn't fix it and I lost all menu sounds on the TV and re-entering the app didn't resolve it. A power cycle and everything was right again.

Another thing is that now my speakers will every once in a while make a pop - like the sound of popping a single bubble on a small bubble wrap sheet but higher pitched. It usually happens (or at least is noticeable when audio is quiet or even not actively playing - like on the TV menu). It seems to only happen once or twice during a listening session, but it's noticeable enough to be concerning. It never happened with my previous receiver, but that was also with a different sound source so maybe it's the TV, maybe it's the receiver, or maybe the speakers were slightly damaged in the lightning strike.

 

[Chrispy]

To follow up on my previous issues with the Denon restarting, I unplugged and re-plugged it in last Saturday after it happened and it hasn't happened since. When it was initially plugged back in the first time following the lighting storm, I had the Mrs do it, and maybe the connection was slightly weak.

I am still having some goofy audio issues though that are hard to nail down between the TV (source) and the receiver. I was watching a movie on Hulu last night and the sound suddenly cut out and the video kept playing. Exiting the app didn't fix it and I lost all menu sounds on the TV and re-entering the app didn't resolve it. A power cycle and everything was right again.

Another thing is that now my speakers will every once in a while make a pop - like the sound of popping a single bubble on a small bubble wrap sheet but higher pitched. It usually happens (or at least is noticeable when audio is quiet or even not actively playing - like on the TV menu). It seems to only happen once or twice during a listening session, but it's noticeable enough to be concerning. It never happened with my previous receiver, but that was also with a different sound source so maybe it's the TV, maybe it's the receiver, or maybe the speakers were slightly damaged in the lightning strike.

I'd run a microprocessor/factory reset....

 

[amper42]

None of this is normal. I wouldn't miss the window to return it because you are hoping the Refurb A4L Denon receiver will magically heal it's self. Refurb means you are buying something that someone else didn't want and with the issues you are having it certainly sounds defective.

My Denon receiver doesn't display any of these issues. It plays when I turn it on with absolutely no pops in the speakers or lack of audio during movie playback. If it did any of these things, I would dump it in a heart beat.