Meanwhile I bought an Asgard instead of continuing to use my Magnius partly because the Asgard mutes to pre amps when a headphone is plugged in and I couldn't be bothered to reach behind the Gjallarhorn to flip the switch to turn it on and off...
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Cute new schiit speaker amps
- Thread starter Vini darko
- Start date
Well, that's right. I would like to see how much space the wall warts take, though
Hatto
Active Member
Not a noob question at all, but no excuses even so. I used 2x 90 degree RCA elbows (e.g. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08L7TMB35) with a female-female RCA coupler (e.g https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06WGP192C) in between. Each pair of interconnects cost me $6, a far cry from what some people here have guessed (as $100 for all).
The trick was to find the right length for the couplers as they all have slightly different throws between output of one to input of the next. I had to shorten some couplers by cutting/grinding them to length and they worked flawlessly.
They look awesome.
And here I was thinking I'd need to resolder some custom runs.
I'll try your (much less laborious and cheaper) method!
Hatto
Active Member
The only component I bought new is the Rekkr. I bought the rest second hand from CL for a good discount over retail.
When I started out with the idea to put a compact system at my office I had 4 options in mind (with that sepcific order):
1. SMSL C200 ($175, on discount on Amazon)
2. Topping DX3 Pro+ ($140 used on Amazon)
3. Schiit Modi/Magni ($240 retail or $150-200 used)
4. JDS Labs Atom DAC/Amp ($210 retail or $150 used)
I had decomissioned a Behringer MINIFBQ from my main system at the time. It was so much fun, I wanted to make use of it at my office, but it would go against the primary requirement of compactness. I checked other options, only to see that even chi-fi compact tone controls are no less than $100 (e.g. https://www.amazon.com/Bellari-Audio-EQ570-Equalizer/dp/B07PPQ3XWM). There are some othe options from Douk or Fosi which offered 3-4 channel tone control on headphone amps but I found them to be ugly in addition to having SQ reservations against more established brands listed above. So I decided to go the route of seperate components with Schiit Modi+/Magni Heresy (which offer great value even at retail price based on the measurements) with the option to add Loki+ when it's convenient. I found the triple stack used in local market before I could buy the duo so I grabbed it instead.
Later on, I added SYS out of pure curiosity (to test the idea of passive preamp with powered monitors), which was a no-brainer for $30 used. Right now it's completely redundant in my system and I intend to remove it whenever I feel like in the mood.
The whole set of interconnects (4 pairs) cost me less than a good quality single pair of XLR interconnect so I don't have any cost complaints there.
I find my stack to be unique in terms of (1) offering analog tone controls in a (2) compact package with (3) top notch headphone and speaker amps in a matching fashion. The only thing that can be considered "missing" is the balanced configuration, but I don't miss it one bit tbh. If you ask me, without the Loki+ it only becomes an ordinary (albeit high-quality) system, which then would face very strong competition from single unit chi-fi products (which I also enjoy using very much).
The more I listen with Rekkr more I'm amazed by tone, clarity and depth of imaging. I haven't heard any other power amp with absolute zero standby noise at full pre-amp volume, let alone one under $150.
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Hatto
Active Member
I might consider the power cable, but none of the rest would satisfy even 2 out of my 3 criteria for the current stack.
Only the NAD comes close but it doesn't have analog tone controls. I would have seriously considered it if I set aside that idea.
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Hatto
Active Member
They look more plumbing than audio interconnects, but hey, at least it's neat. I started from the same point as you are andsearched for 90 degree RCA cable plugs only to realize that they would touch each other even without the cable in the middle. Then I had the idea of using 90 degree RCA elbows as cable connectors. When they arrived I realized I can solder solid pieces of metal after they're in place, then it hit me to use F-F couplers instead.
First I removed the pin from the F-F coupler:
Then cut the pin, grinded the shell to size and discarded the plastic mold in the middle, holding the pin:
Put them all together:
And voila (but shorter):
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Hatto
Active Member
3 wall warts in total (Loki, Magni & Rekkr with Modi fed through USB and SYS completely passive), which one can line up over a dedicated surge protected extension and hide it away from sight, leaving only thin DC cables coming into the system, instead of bulky & stiff AC cables.
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I notice that your stack seems plugged the wrong way between one of the sys inputs and the amp input. Also the sys output appears to be connected to the Magni output.
restorer-john
Grand Contributor
Hatto
Active Member
SYS works both ways, it's just the simplest switch there is. You can use it as a source selector (2 in, 1 out) or output switch (1 in 2 out). I was using it to switch between Totem Minis driven by Rekkr and a couple other active studio monitors for quick and dirty testing.
Well that is something I didn't know, thanks! It also explains why Schiit has not built a Sysius for balanced inputs/ouputs. What you described cannot be done with XLR connectors. I am tempted to buy one now.
Hatto
Active Member
One might even say that it would be a "Sysiphean" task.
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mhardy6647
Grand Contributor
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Thank you for going there before I did.
D
Deleted member 48726
Guest
The Yamaha has tone controls and headphone jack.
Oh, and power for other speakers if you wanted to upgrade some time.
It isn't Schiit-small though.
D
Deleted member 48726
Guest
It only has a gain of 12 dB. I sure hope there is no noise with that ratio of amplification.
Elgrosso
Member
Got my pair of G-horn last week, and have been fighting against their hum for that long.
Long story short I recently lowered the power of all amps of my active system after having measured the real voltage used.
So mids and highs only need 5 & 10 watts for insane levels, while mostly cruising between 0.01 and 1 watt.
Tried few affordable amps, of all class, and they all had something wrong (hiss, buzz, hum, bugs or usability issue).
The last were the iotas PA3, that are not supposed to be the best on paper, but they are the cleanest in my case with none of these issues.
(now honestly I have no idea what to look at on amp specs for low noise: I don't see any correlation)
Anyway I was still curious about a kind of "first watt" amp, and wanted something smaller to fit in the rack.
Studied some diy options and was about to pull the trigger when Schiit launched these.
I figured it would still be cheap while faster, and they had everything on paper to be the solution.
The first smile disappeared quickly when I plugged them, classic transformer hum with just power on.
I don't know enough but assume it's not DC related as the iotas are silent in the same spot.
It's not dramatic, no more than what I've experienced before, but still too much for my setup and taste.
They also hiss on midranges (98db), very low so not an issue, but the iota was dead silent there.
After a conversation with Schiit I decided to not return them (kind of moot from France with taxes and double shipping) and see what I could improve.
So, opened the little guys and tried few things.
On the bench, putting the transformer on a simple cloth outside the case reduced the noise a lot, to barely audible.
I don't know enough but it seems it could be some loose wires that are vibrating?
This was the way to go, reduce vibration by dampening anything I could.
After few tests I ended up placing a ring shaped piece of felt under the transformer, moving the pressure at the bottom circumference instead of the center pad.
This raised the transformer a bit so I also added a piece of rubber to make sure to isolate the nut from the cover.
Plus some thin rubber between sides and cover to raise it to avoid pinching the wires, while reducing vibration transmission.
And some very soft feet below.
Good result, I can still hear it off few cm, but not at 1 meter.
Kind of happy ending, not what I originally expected but they still have enough value to myeyes ears to keep them.
And I’ll try to recycle the two pa3 on the mid-bass.
So far the sound is good, nothing lacking in terms of headroom, stage, details, etc, one per side so no stress on such bandpass.
I have not been over 1 watt yet (95db+ territory) and very rarely do anyway.
I got my smile back.
I'll see from there, thought about changing the transformer for an audio grade one fully dipped in resin maybe, or smps.
Might even put them in a new case one day.
Or do you guys have any other trick?
Long story short I recently lowered the power of all amps of my active system after having measured the real voltage used.
So mids and highs only need 5 & 10 watts for insane levels, while mostly cruising between 0.01 and 1 watt.
Tried few affordable amps, of all class, and they all had something wrong (hiss, buzz, hum, bugs or usability issue).
The last were the iotas PA3, that are not supposed to be the best on paper, but they are the cleanest in my case with none of these issues.
(now honestly I have no idea what to look at on amp specs for low noise: I don't see any correlation)
Anyway I was still curious about a kind of "first watt" amp, and wanted something smaller to fit in the rack.
Studied some diy options and was about to pull the trigger when Schiit launched these.
I figured it would still be cheap while faster, and they had everything on paper to be the solution.
The first smile disappeared quickly when I plugged them, classic transformer hum with just power on.
I don't know enough but assume it's not DC related as the iotas are silent in the same spot.
It's not dramatic, no more than what I've experienced before, but still too much for my setup and taste.
They also hiss on midranges (98db), very low so not an issue, but the iota was dead silent there.
After a conversation with Schiit I decided to not return them (kind of moot from France with taxes and double shipping) and see what I could improve.
So, opened the little guys and tried few things.
On the bench, putting the transformer on a simple cloth outside the case reduced the noise a lot, to barely audible.
I don't know enough but it seems it could be some loose wires that are vibrating?
This was the way to go, reduce vibration by dampening anything I could.
After few tests I ended up placing a ring shaped piece of felt under the transformer, moving the pressure at the bottom circumference instead of the center pad.
This raised the transformer a bit so I also added a piece of rubber to make sure to isolate the nut from the cover.
Plus some thin rubber between sides and cover to raise it to avoid pinching the wires, while reducing vibration transmission.
And some very soft feet below.
Good result, I can still hear it off few cm, but not at 1 meter.
Kind of happy ending, not what I originally expected but they still have enough value to my
And I’ll try to recycle the two pa3 on the mid-bass.
So far the sound is good, nothing lacking in terms of headroom, stage, details, etc, one per side so no stress on such bandpass.
I have not been over 1 watt yet (95db+ territory) and very rarely do anyway.
I got my smile back.
I'll see from there, thought about changing the transformer for an audio grade one fully dipped in resin maybe, or smps.
Might even put them in a new case one day.
Or do you guys have any other trick?
Very interesting discovery, thanks for sharing.
I posted last week after receiving my G-horn and commented on a low tone type hum too, but I solved my hum in a different way than you. I tested the Ghorn in both my home and in my office (physically different location) and it was only in my office that I could hear the hum. Unlike your issue, the hum I was hearing was not audible unless the room was dead quiet and my ear was within a few inches of the speakers.
The fix I deployed was to add a Iso Bar Power Strip with AC filter and it removed the hum I was hearing. You might want to try this too. Based on your experience and fix, its sounds like the transformer in the G-horn has an AC resonance potential that can be worsened by the mounting in the chassis. As you found adding a bit of dampening material under the transformer deadened this resonance down or killed it all together, but the original resonance may have been caused by dirty AC to begin with as it was in my scenario.
It sounds like both fixes would play well together, use an AC filter to clean up the power and add the dampening material under the coil to make sure if a resonance does form for other reasons it will be dampened before it gets to the amplifier circuit.
If you do pick one of these up for your system make sure and look at the details on the box as most power strips with surge protection do not come with an AC choke built in to filter AC noise. The ones that do, cost a good 20 to 30 bucks more than the ones that don't. This is the one I used....
Elgrosso
Member
Thank you Presb4,
I didn’t think of an AC filter, especially since the few measured here where not convincing.
But it is cheap enough so I will test.
The other option is to try DC blockers just to make sure and put it off the table, but user feedback on these devices is very inconsistent.
When it works it seems that the amount of voltage removed vary a lot per builder, and maybe system.
I had issues with my house wiring few weeks ago, with a bad ground on a big section.
Fixed it but maybe there’s more to discover, it’s a very old house half restored.
It’s not perfect as I still have around 2v between neutral and ground, but much better the 80v before.
Don’t know much about all this but I am learning while fixing.
Yesterday while tuning a bit more the dsp near the amps, I heard it again and it sticked.
It’s probably borderline ocd now, I still have few things to finish on this system but this bothers me more.
I didn’t think of an AC filter, especially since the few measured here where not convincing.
But it is cheap enough so I will test.
The other option is to try DC blockers just to make sure and put it off the table, but user feedback on these devices is very inconsistent.
When it works it seems that the amount of voltage removed vary a lot per builder, and maybe system.
I had issues with my house wiring few weeks ago, with a bad ground on a big section.
Fixed it but maybe there’s more to discover, it’s a very old house half restored.
It’s not perfect as I still have around 2v between neutral and ground, but much better the 80v before
.Don’t know much about all this but I am learning while fixing.
Yesterday while tuning a bit more the dsp near the amps, I heard it again and it sticked.
It’s probably borderline ocd now, I still have few things to finish on this system but this bothers me more.
Hatto
Active Member
The EMI arena is more complicated that I'll dare enter but I know that powerful transformers generate EM field in close proximity no matter well designed and shielded. That's why I don't like the idea of having the AC-DC conversion device close to rest of the electronics. This isn't much of a problem with smaller electronics like DACs, headphone amps but certainly a challenge with (class A or A/B) speaker amps, since the AC-DC conversion is almost always integrated into the chasis. That is one of the reasons I was so excited about the Rekkr which is a class A/B powered by a wall-wart, and it is dead silent even at point-zero.
The reason that hum is reduced to barely audible when you disassembled the device on the bench may be just because of the fact that you moved the transformer away from the rest of the electronics or electrically isolated it from the chasis, rather than the fact that you dampened the physical vibrations by placing it on a piece of cloth. The rubber pieces you placed around the chasis might have worked through electrical isolation, rather than vibration dampening. These are not absolute claims, just possibilities to keep in mind.
I don't exactly know how, but design symmetry helps reduce the effects of EMI sourcing from the transformer, possibly due to effects of EMI at equal distance cancelling itself on both channels. I'm sure there are more knowledgeable people here who can explain this in better detail. Unfortunately the physical layout of G-horn is not ideal at all. The toroidal transformer is very powerful (80VA), asymmetrically placed and too close to the rest of the electronics. I would be very suprised to see G-horn to be a zero-hum amp under these conditions.
Another trick might be isolating the toroidal transformer with a Faraday cage within the case.
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