I was wrong to start my reply to Doodski with "I disagree with that". If you read the rest of the text following that sentence you see that I actually agreed with what he said, that some aspects of the "base sound" of the speakers could be easier to hear with a single speaker.
See post #352. The studies were done and books written by the very top minds in Audio. Or you can believe what ever happens to make you happy. Do you happen to have any scientific evidence or studies to back up your theories?I was wrong to start my reply to Doodski with "I disagree with that". If you read the rest of the text following that sentence you see that I actually agreed with what he said, that some aspects of the "base sound" of the speakers could be easier to hear with a single speaker.
The thing I wanted to point out is a simple fact, you can never hear any stereo effects using just one single speaker in mono, and all speakers will have their own "stereo characteristics" that will follow them no matter which room you set them up in. Some will sound wider, some narrower, some deeper, and some will have a little bit of everything, a big soundstage in every direction.
Can you hear if a certain speaker has a wider soundstage or image better than another speaker just by listening to them in mono, how do they do when it comes to stereo separation? Maybe you can go over some of the reviews of the speakers here on ASR, and just by looking at the measurements and reading Amir's listening test tell me if they have a wide or narrow stereo field?
I want to know, and according to yourself, you know these things way better than I do.
I'm quite sure Toole was not talking about the stereo effects I'm talking about, certainly not how a speaker will do when it comes to width and stereo separation compared to another speaker. Maybe you can tell me how that is done?
I’m not the one challenging the science. You are. That means you need to support your counter argument and not kick the can back towards me and not answer the challenge of do you have any science or studies that prove your hypothesis?
You see, I don't challenge any science when I say that no one can hear stereo effects from a single speaker playing in mono. If you have another view on that you are the one challenging the science.
. Did you even look at the video or the Source links in the link I posted above? Your next answer will determine whether you are here to contribute or Troll. I suggest you take some time to at least peruse the info I linked above in post 363.
me, I only listen to test tones, recordings of trains, and Diana Krall.
So true!
He is not. As he mentioned you are not bothering to look at the research that shows no speaker that does well in mono, loses in stereo. That aside, if you pan the volume from right to left, the stereo image shifts from right to left. Right? That should tell you that much of what you think as stereo image is in the content. Some of the other is in dispersion of speaker which is absolutely audible in mono (explained in video).
Not really. There's people that see audio reproduction for what it is, an engineering task. Then there's a group of cargo cultists that are fascinated by these "products of science" without actually being interested in science, more like in science fiction – "any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" (Clarke). Now add the great emotional impact music has on us humans to the mix (pun intended) and the confusion is complete. Such people are easy prey to people like Danny selling them a new crossover for their speaker and explaining the benefits by showing a 1/3 octave measurement because "it's the industry standard". It's not. Time to wake up!
Maybe you don't know... Amir contacted him prior to reviewing the LGK and he was dismissive of everything done here. So there was an opportunity given to work positively with Amir on the results... chose his path.
Yes, I'm sure that has an impact on how you perceive the sound of different speakers in a single speaker test, but it is still not a stereo effect you hear. For the stereo effects to be heard you still need a minimum of two sound sources playing in stereo. That should be clear to everyone here.
Define "stereo effects". ASW and envelopment are "stereo effects". You can hear them with just a single speaker. You really need to read up on the topic if you want to have a meaningful discussion here.
Because of what you keep on saying?
It limits the applicability to the sorts of speakers used to create the "rule." I.e., speakers with forward-firing largely symmetric polar patterns.
Not necessarily (if the person looking at the data is knowledgeable enough) but I can think of examples where it certainly would. I think the deeper question is whether stereo can be "optimized" by asymmetric polar patterns. What does "optimize" even mean? Time-intensity trading for a bigger sweet spot? More spaciousness? All of this comes with even more tradeoffs.
