so i was a believer of dacs and amps don't change the sound quality of the device because they are all flat and transparent sounding, but take a look at this graph i just found. it appears that the idsd tilted the freqency response to achieve a warmer sound, this resulted in a more bass, warmer mids and tamer eargain and treble area. so my question is why that happened? is the power or impedance thing? im not knowledged in amps or dacs, can somebody tell whats hepening here?
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can you explain why 2 different dacs produced 2 different frequency responses of one iem?
- Thread starter iemss
- Start date
The difference is most likely the output impedance: 0.1 Ohm for the Topping, 0.5 Ohm for the iFi.
The things are 5 Ohm themselves, so 0.5 is a significant addition.
The things are 5 Ohm themselves, so 0.5 is a significant addition.
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solderdude
Grand Contributor
Yep, the unusually low 5Ω impedance which will not be linear may well be responsible.
Lows are done with a dynamic driver so might have quite a bump.
To get a 3dB variance the impedance should rise substantially.
The 2 BA's will likely provide a low impedance for the treble (all being in parallel) explaining the treble roll-off.
Lows are done with a dynamic driver so might have quite a bump.
To get a 3dB variance the impedance should rise substantially.
The 2 BA's will likely provide a low impedance for the treble (all being in parallel) explaining the treble roll-off.
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- Thread Starter
- #5
so i guess the lower output impedance is better for iems since they don't need much power at all?
solderdude
Grand Contributor
The lower the impedance of the headphone the more possible snags come into play.
Such as:
output impedance of the amp.
headphone cable resistance.
connector resistance.
These very low impedance headphones, certainly when varying in imp as well, is not great for ear/headphones because not all amplifier outputs are very near 0Ω.
The very low impedance will make them very sensitive (dB/V).
With 124dB/1V it is very sensitive. That said it will also draw a lot of current which most amp outputs will not like that much.
Fortunately when playing them at a 'firm' level which you can endure for the duration of a few songs you will only need 60mV and 12mA (0.8mW) so no issue under normal to decently loud levels.
A downside certainly will be that you will need a very low noise amp if you don't want an audible background noise during silence.
Such as:
output impedance of the amp.
headphone cable resistance.
connector resistance.
These very low impedance headphones, certainly when varying in imp as well, is not great for ear/headphones because not all amplifier outputs are very near 0Ω.
The very low impedance will make them very sensitive (dB/V).
With 124dB/1V it is very sensitive. That said it will also draw a lot of current which most amp outputs will not like that much.
Fortunately when playing them at a 'firm' level which you can endure for the duration of a few songs you will only need 60mV and 12mA (0.8mW) so no issue under normal to decently loud levels.
A downside certainly will be that you will need a very low noise amp if you don't want an audible background noise during silence.
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- Thread Starter
- #7
beautifully explained, but what about iems with low sensitivity and low impedances like something like thieaudio prestige ltd with 95dB @1kHz and 11 ohm impedance? i don't have it but im curious.
solderdude
Grand Contributor
95dB/mW or 95dB/V... this makes quite a difference.
It also matters how much variance there is in impedance.
It also matters how much variance there is in impedance.
- Thread Starter
- #9
idk its listed 95dB @1kHz
Lower output impedance of the amp is usually better , then fr response is not modified by the amp and this is usually preferred , but then taste may come into it ?
But if you use headphones i suppose you eq to taste anyway ?
solderdudes remark is spot on, these phones have an unusually low impedance with a typical over ear 600ohm headphone there would be no difference at all
But if you use headphones i suppose you eq to taste anyway ?
solderdudes remark is spot on, these phones have an unusually low impedance with a typical over ear 600ohm headphone there would be no difference at all
solderdude
Grand Contributor
95dBmW in 11 ohm = 115dB/V (which seems plausible for an IEM)
Amplifiers provide a voltage and not power so only the dB/V (sensitivity) numbers are really saying something when comparing headphones.
staticV3
Master Contributor
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Not sure where that 95dB is coming from. Five different retailers I looked at all have the Volume listed with 123.7dB/V:
- Thread Starter
- #13
THIEAUDIO Prestige LTD
9 Drivers, 3 Driver Types, 5-Way Crossover Like the original Prestige, the Prestige LTD features the same extensive and comprehensive engineering strategy. 4 Sonion electrostatic drivers + 2 Knowles mid-treble balanced armatures + 2 Sonion low-mid balanced armatures + 10mm dynamic subwoofer are...
i think you mistake the softears volume to prestige.
staticV3
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According to the graphs you posted, we're talking about the Volume:
Are we not?
Edit: Ahh now I see, I'm sorry.
The conversation switched to the Prestige midway through, which I totally missed. My bad.
This thread is about amplifiers but the title concerns DACs. One can only know if DACs make a difference in FR by connecting different DACs to the same headphone amp. I'm also interested in this, though I will assume that there's no difference as the impedance in line level parts can be much larger and more stable.
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