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Adding post-DSP SPDIF outputs to AVRs

thecheapseats

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The modification itself is fairly straightforward but it does require one to have some experience in reading datasheets and performing SMD work. Here is the full guide.


You may be able to take your AVR to a local phone repair shop and provide instructions as to what you would like them to do.
YES! - yes yes yes... amazing what articles pop up in the "New post feeds' here... I am so down with doing this hack... worth twice the price of admission here at ASR... didn't get a nickname the-cheap-seats for nothing...
 
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harlizzle

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*Anyway* --- the pertinent (if read in context, rather than isolation) question was, what is the expected use case here? DSP applied in AVR, then (stereo) digital signal passed to DSP device 2? In order to....?

What sorts of DSP are envisioned being applied in the AVR?
my receiver will do surround virtualization with the headphone jack or with a 2.1. this will allow me to use a dac/amp for my headphones and use the sub preout for my bass shakers. i can watch movies late at night or early am on the weekends and not worry about distrubing the neighbors. all the processing will be done by the receiver. so hdmi source > avr > spdif - dac; sub-preout to bass shakers, dac -> headphone amp -> headphones -> me listening to 7.1 with bass shakers and my headphones.
 

harlizzle

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Never owned one, so please excuse my naive questions ...the idea here seems to be , apply some DSP in the AVR, then make the resulting (two-channel) output available digitally,. A miniDSP on top of , say, Audyssey, would be for...applying further DSP? Fine tuning? For 2.x , something subwoofer related ?
no, the receiver applies the dsp and virtualizes a stereo signal into surround. tap that digital stereo signal, convert that to spdif digital out, feed sdpif that to a seperate dac/amp, not an external dsp. if you want to use an external dsp, then i wouldn't use the receiver. i'd use an hdmi audio extractor. i want to use the avr's dsp, because the only standalone one that does it for headphones that i know of is like 5 grand usd. not even close to obtainable for me lol
 

Zooqu1ko

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no, the receiver applies the dsp and virtualizes a stereo signal into surround. tap that digital stereo signal, convert that to spdif digital out, feed sdpif that to a seperate dac/amp, not an external dsp. if you want to use an external dsp, then i wouldn't use the receiver. i'd use an hdmi audio extractor. i want to use the avr's dsp, because the only standalone one that does it for headphones that i know of is like 5 grand usd. not even close to obtainable for me lol
Save up a few years, and you may be able to afford a second hand Smyth Realiser. An HDMI audio extractor for 8 digital channels also doesn't seem to exist, so you'd be back to soldering 4 of the WM8804 boards in an analog extractor, but then you could route that to an interface, into a PC, through the sofalizer plugin, and back out in stereo to your favorite DAC as a homemade Realiser minus the head tracking. Getting your own SOFA file is unfortunately left as an exercise to the reader, and would also be more straightforward, if not necessarily easier with a Realiser.
 
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Zooqu1ko

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I had to chuckle at 'all your S/PDIF outs' , and the persistent assumption here that are audibly 'mediocre' abound in 'low end AVRs'.
since you were able to imagine I - or anyone - wrote audible, you should be able to imagine that there are people out there who can imagine that the DACs in their AVR are audibly worse.
 

harlizzle

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Save up a few years, and you may be able to afford a second hand Smyth Realiser. An HDMI audio extractor for 8 digital channels also doesn't seem to exist, so you'd be back to soldering 4 of the WM8804 boards in an analog extractor, but then you could route that to an interface, into a PC, through the sofalizer plugin, and back out in stereo to your favorite DAC as a homemade Realiser minus the head tracking. Getting your own SOFA file is unfortunately left as an exercise to the reader, and would also be more straightforward, if not necessarily easier with a Realiser.
lol even then, by the time it's affordable, i bet it'll be outdated with technology. im sure eventually others will make a standalone dsp for headphones. this is good enough for me, as it's specific use case, including using bass shakers with my sonos arc.
 
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Weeb Labs

Weeb Labs

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Greetings!

I thought it might be fun to share details of a current project, which involves modifying AVRs with post-DSP SPDIF outputs. This effectively turns any AVR into a fully digital audio processor with room correction, subwoofer crossover/time alignment and EQ functionality.

The potential applications are numerous and I am in the process of producing a rather elaborate video that should enable anybody with moderate DIY electronics experience to perform this modification.

View attachment 106784

The modification itself is fairly straightforward and entails hijacking the front channel I2S output which runs between the unit's DSP and DAC. A readily available WM8804 board can then be used to obtain a stereo coaxial SPDIF output for those channels.

View attachment 106785

I expect to complete production of the video guide within a few weeks. These photos were taken during a quick test, to ensure that my script did not omit any relevant detail. The procedure is applicable to almost any AVR, with pin locations and channel pairings being the only significant variables.

View attachment 106786

This is a cheap, used Denon AVR-2807. It was manufactured in 2006 and was one of the first Denon units to include Audyssey MultiEQ.

The thought had also occurred to me that the AD IC would be fairly easy to control via I2C for arbitrary DSP. Perhaps I'll look into that soon!
Do you think this also can be done on a external 5.1 decoder DAC that doesn’t have a digital output board?
 

Zooqu1ko

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Do you think this also can be done on a external 5.1 decoder DAC that doesn’t have a digital output board?
I've got no idea what a "5.1 decoder DAC" is supposed to be, but whatever it is, as long as it has DACs that get fed I²S sound, it should be possible to tap into that and extract all 6 channels as S/PDIF.

Edit: if you have a logic analyzer, you can check if the signal is ideed I²S, but a quick look at the datasheets should be just as good.
 
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many years ago the decoders are made in separate appliances the signal is indeed I2S but I think Parasound uses his decoding.
can you modify it?
 

Zooqu1ko

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many years ago the decoders are made in separate appliances the signal is indeed I2S but I think Parasound uses his decoding.
can you modify it?
I can't. Open it, check what's inside, download the datasheets and study them. If it's all integrated into a single chip, there may be no way to even access the necessary signals. Without datasheets, it's all wild speculation. A regular sized AVR might be a better target simply due to the space available inside.
 

jamescarter1982

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by what method is the dsp applied a computer programe ? I've got a few old avrs around that this could be good for . would a new programe need to be loaded onto the dsp chip ?
 

Zooqu1ko

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by what method is the dsp applied a computer programe ? I've got a few old avrs around that this could be good for . would a new programe need to be loaded onto the dsp chip ?
The whole point of this exercise is to have an AVR with all the decoding, room correction and what have you, but instead of the usual analog output have digital outputs and do whatever you desire with that signal, without going digital to analog and back again to digital.
 

Zooqu1ko

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so then the eq etc is done onscreen with the remote ?
Anything the modified AVR used to do is done the same way after the mod. The AVR won't know the difference.

There's one potential difference between the analog outputs and the added digital out: Depending on how Volume control is implemented, you may or may not get that on the digital output.
 

jamescarter1982

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can you imagine anyway to reprogramme the dsp to allow say computer control or added functionality. I don't have the remote for my avr and haven't been able to get the onscreen menu to work .I own a pioneer vsa ax10i and I like the amp I wondered if there was any way to make use of the dsp chip rhats already in there rather than add another box to do crossovers etc
 
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I can't. Open it, check what's inside, download the datasheets and study them. If it's all integrated into a single chip, there may be no way to even access the necessary signals. Without datasheets, it's all wild speculation. A regular sized AVR might be a better target simply due to the space available inside.
 

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