4.4mm balanced dac to xlr into mixer?

[Gershy13]

Is it possible/safe to use a dongle with a 4.4 balanced output and connect it to a pro audio mixer with an xlr adapter?
My use case is to run an output from a daw on a laptop in a live environment connecting to a pro mixer.

Would it be possible to make/buy a 4.4 to xlr adapter and use a dongle like the sonata bhd pro or hiby fc4?

Is this safe? I see that the outputs of these dacs can do 4v rms, and it seems like 1.2v is roughly the standard line level of +4dbu?

Any tips would be appreciated.

Thanks
Gershy13

 

[DVDdoug]

I don't know if you can find an adapter but you could make one and it should work.

The mixer shouldn't overload if you go over 1.2V. Usually they have headroom on the inputs & outputs. Or, you can buy XLR attenuators but you might not find one with less than 10dB attenuation. A fixed attenuator is just a voltage divider (resistors) so if you were going to build an adapter you could build an attenuator into it.

My use case is to run an output from a daw on a laptop in a live environment connecting to a pro mixer.

The regular laptop headphone output, or the output from a regular unbalanced USB soundcard/dongle should be OK too. It's always OK to connect an unbalanced-output to a balanced input, and you still get some of the ground-loop noise immunity with the balanced input.

 

[Gershy13]

I don't know if you can find an adapter but you could make one and it should work.

The mixer shouldn't overload if you go over 1.2V. Usually they have headroom on the inputs & outputs. Or, you can buy XLR attenuators but you might not find one with less than 10dB attenuation. A fixed attenuator is just a voltage divider (resistors) so if you were going to build an adapter you could build an attenuator into it.


The regular laptop headphone output, or the output from a regular unbalanced USB soundcard/dongle should be OK too. It's always OK to connect an unbalanced-output to a balanced input, and you still get some of the ground-loop noise immunity with the balanced input.

The idea here would be to use be able to go direct in without having to use a DI, and the inputs are XLR only (not combo jacks) (stagebox)
So ideally i should be fine if i just keep the volume down? Or i could build a custom cable that integrates an attenuator in the cable itself, so it would be easier to manage gain (just incase the preamp didnt have enough negative gain)

 

[unpluggged]

Would it be possible to make/buy a 4.4 to xlr adapter and use a dongle like the sonata bhd pro or hiby fc4?

Yes, look on Amazon or AliExpress, for example.

 

[JIW]

Is it possible/safe to use a dongle with a 4.4 balanced output and connect it to a pro audio mixer with an xlr adapter?
My use case is to run an output from a daw on a laptop in a live environment connecting to a pro mixer.

Would it be possible to make/buy a 4.4 to xlr adapter and use a dongle like the sonata bhd pro or hiby fc4?

Is this safe? I see that the outputs of these dacs can do 4v rms, and it seems like 1.2v is roughly the standard line level of +4dbu?

Any tips would be appreciated.

Thanks
Gershy13

The standard line level is referenced to -20 dBFS. Full output is 24 dBu. 4 V RMS is approximately 12 dBV which is 14.2 dBu. If anything, your levels may be too low and you would need to amplify the signal before it goes into the mixer.

Unless you have very strict space or budget constraints, consider a full size DAC such as the Topping D10 balanced which is even powered through USB. TRS to XLR cables are widely available and inexpensive.

 

[Gershy13]

The standard line level is referenced to -20 dBFS. Full output is 24 dBu. 4 V RMS is approximately 12 dBV which is 14.2 dBu. If anything, your levels may be too low and you would need to amplify the signal before it goes into the mixer.

Unless you have very strict space or budget constraints, consider a full size DAC such as the Topping D10 balanced which is even powered through USB. TRS to XLR cables are widely available and inexpensive.

Thanks for clarifying, I kept reading that +4dbu was the standard line level output. So my use case for the dongle should be fine then (as the preamp on the stagebox/mixer would have headroom to amplify). I am looking for an all in one portable device that i can use for my laptop to connect my headphones to for listening to music, as well as having the ability to adapt it into balanced XLR for live use. This is why i would prefer a dongle style device.
I currently have the Hiby FC1, but compared to my desktop dac/amp (umc204hd and sabaj a10h), it seems to lack in bass and be a bit harsher in the treble i feel, (possibly not enough power?)

So i was looking at an upgrade that would sound similar to my desk setup that i can use for my IEMs/Headphones with my laptop, but also have the added ability to output balanced for when i need to use my laptop in a live situation.
I wanted something more portable than an audio interface, and i do not need the inputs.

I was considering the Hiby FC4, but seeing as i dont really like the sound of my fc1 (i've heard similar reports of the fc4 sounding bright and lacking bass), i was thinking about some other brands. The Sonata BHD Pro is the only one ive seen so far in a similar price range (£50-70).

 

[JIW]

Thanks for clarifying, I kept reading that +4dbu was the standard line level output. So my use case for the dongle should be fine then (as the preamp on the stagebox/mixer would have headroom to amplify). I am looking for an all in one portable device that i can use for my laptop to connect my headphones to for listening to music, as well as having the ability to adapt it into balanced XLR for live use. This is why i would prefer a dongle style device.
I currently have the Hiby FC1, but compared to my desktop dac/amp (umc204hd and sabaj a10h), it seems to lack in bass and be a bit harsher in the treble i feel, (possibly not enough power?)

So i was looking at an upgrade that would sound similar to my desk setup that i can use for my IEMs/Headphones with my laptop, but also have the added ability to output balanced for when i need to use my laptop in a live situation.
I wanted something more portable than an audio interface, and i do not need the inputs.

I was considering the Hiby FC4, but seeing as i dont really like the sound of my fc1 (i've heard similar reports of the fc4 sounding bright and lacking bass), i was thinking about some other brands. The Sonata BHD Pro is the only one ive seen so far in a similar price range (£50-70).

Here are some measurements of the FC4: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/hiby-fc4.35414/. I doubt it will be any better than the FC1.

The Sonata BHD Pro measures well and if you can acquire a fitting cable, it should work for you.

 

[JIW]

I just checked UK amazon and there seem to be some 4.4 mm to 2xXLR3 male cables available. Some are even quite inexpensive such as this one for 22 pounds.

 

[Gershy13]

Here are some measurements of the FC4: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/hiby-fc4.35414/. I doubt it will be any better than the FC1.

The Sonata BHD Pro measures well and if you can acquire a fitting cable, it should work for you.

Yeah seems like I won't even consider the fc4, as there are much better options.

Too many even!
Sonata BHD Pro
Truthear Shio
Moondrop Dawn Pro
Fiio KA13 (and a few other models)
Tanchjim Space
Hidizs S9

Not sure which one to get!
I see there are some with DSP/EQ built in too, are there any other options than the quedelix?

 

[JIW]

Yeah seems like I won't even consider the fc4, as there are much better options.

Too many even!
Sonata BHD Pro
Truthear Shio
Moondrop Dawn Pro
Fiio KA13 (and a few other models)
Tanchjim Space
Hidizs S9

Not sure which one to get!
I see there are some with DSP/EQ built in too, are there any other options than the quedelix?

Look for measurements. Amir has maybe reviewed some of them. If you don't know what they mean, Amir has made a video.

 

[nagster]

Would it be possible to make/buy a 4.4 to xlr adapter and use a dongle like the sonata bhd pro or hiby fc4?

It's possible.

Is this safe? I see that the outputs of these dacs can do 4v rms, and it seems like 1.2v is roughly the standard line level of +4dbu?

Output voltage is safe. The minimum requirement for professional mixers and I/O racks is to be able to receive 12Vrms (24dBu).

Also, it seems that the sleeve of the 4.4mm jack is often floating. (At least I've never come across a device where the sleeve is connected to ground.) Ground treatment should be considered.
If you are particular about 4.4mm, this post may be helpful.

Instead of connecting RCA preamp output to XLR pwrd speakers, could I use balanced 4.4 mm headphone jack to XLR?

Class A equipment that is designed for commercial use is allowed to produce more radio frequency emissions than Class B equipment designated for residential use. Your microwave won't cause your TV to flicker. But commercial microwaves in the office cafeteria might cause the same effect for...

www.audiosciencereview.com

In my opinion, I recommend a USB DAC with Type-B connection.
In situations such as on stage or live performances, Type-C connection is a physical concern. I would be too scared to touch the USB C cable.
You probably don't carry a DAC with you on stage, so I don't think you'll be concerned about dongles. There's no need to make or use strange conversion cables.
We recommend safety first in situations where failure is not an option.

 

[Gershy13]

It's possible.

Output voltage is safe. The minimum requirement for professional mixers and I/O racks is to be able to receive 12Vrms (24dBu).

Also, it seems that the sleeve of the 4.4mm jack is often floating. (At least I've never come across a device where the sleeve is connected to ground.) Ground treatment should be considered.
If you are particular about 4.4mm, this post may be helpful.

Instead of connecting RCA preamp output to XLR pwrd speakers, could I use balanced 4.4 mm headphone jack to XLR?

Class A equipment that is designed for commercial use is allowed to produce more radio frequency emissions than Class B equipment designated for residential use. Your microwave won't cause your TV to flicker. But commercial microwaves in the office cafeteria might cause the same effect for...

www.audiosciencereview.com

In my opinion, I recommend a USB DAC with Type-B connection.
In situations such as on stage or live performances, Type-C connection is a physical concern. I would be too scared to touch the USB C cable.
You probably don't carry a DAC with you on stage, so I don't think you'll be concerned about dongles. There's no need to make or use strange conversion cables.
We recommend safety first in situations where failure is not an option.

Thanks! From reading that thread, what I understand is that there really is no difference between me going 4.4 to XLR Vs 3.5 to RCA/TRS, as it won't be a truly balanced signal in my use case.

This whole idea was more of a random thought/project, I will not be using it for performing often, it was more just to see if it could be a good alternative to having to go through a DI on the rare occasion that I connect my phone/laptop to a mixer.

Looks like it's not worth the hassle as it'll basically be the same as if I were to go direct in (if the stagebox/mixer has RCA/TRS).

I will probably end up getting a better balanced dac for use with my headphones/iems anyway, as my Hiby FC1 doesn't sound great anyway.