Genelec 8351B Review (Studio Monitor)

[Spocko]

I did something similar with GLM + Dirac and it worked. What Trinnov processor are you using?

The Altitude 16 that @amirm is currently reviewing

 

[richard12511]

The Altitude 16 that @amirm is currently reviewing

Nice, I was looking at that unit, but just don't know if I wanna pay that much for a processor. Have you tried Dirac? If so I'd be curious on how you think Trinnov compares.

 

[Mountain Goat]

S360A vertical higher directivity of the elliptical waveguide can be an advantage for large listening distances and/or not treated rooms, 8361A is more a midfield studio monitor and S360A more a problemsolver for typical living rooms and home theatres.

S360 designed for theatre or ambient sound reproduction, not for near-mid field stereo setup.

Genelec uses S360s extensively in their live music venues. It's basically a small main monitor.

https://www.genelec.com/music-venues

The power-over-ethernet 44xx speakers are really cool. One wire to rule them all.

https://www.genelec.com/smart-ip

 

[mononoaware]

View attachment 130485

Thanks for the photograph.

8351b + W371A does look pretty smart.

 

[mononoaware]

Thinking about it more, I'm thinking the vertical orientation works best if you're using the complimentary mode(like the did in the webinar), as that's what gives you the most spread out woofers to best simulate "multisub". Actually 8361 might be even better for that mode, as it's top woofer is even higher up in space. 8361 also matches the W371 baffle better in vertical mode.

8351b(horizontal) should be best for those using the directive modes, to achieve the most constant directivity(similar to Kii 3/BXT). Maybe it could work vertically too if those modes aren't limited to 300Hz crossover(but it seems like they are).

Thank you for your insight.

 

[MBI]

Good news for those of us who are compassionate vegans:

"Apologies for taking so long to answer.
I have to check the fact. So far no animal products used in our production.
Our 8000-series uses recycled aluminium + synthetic material as a damper
Please see: https://www.genelec.com/recycling-information-materials
Also please our Sustainability & Quality web page: https://www.genelec.com/sustainability-quality

Hope this help in your decision.
Thank you stay safe and have a nice day.
(...)
Genelec Customer Support Team" (May 19, 2021 )

How nice to now have a choice to make between 8351B or 8361A, happy me!

P.S. But wait, some claim 8361A does not perform as well as 8351B, is that evidence based and audible?

 

[Pearljam5000]

Good news for those of us who are compassionate vegans:

"Apologies for taking so long to answer.
I have to check the fact. So far no animal products used in our production.
Our 8000-series uses recycled aluminium + synthetic material as a damper
Please see: https://www.genelec.com/recycling-information-materials
Also please our Sustainability & Quality web page: https://www.genelec.com/sustainability-quality

Hope this help in your decision.
Thank you stay safe and have a nice day.
(...)
Genelec Customer Support Team" (May 19, 2021 )

How nice to now have a choice to make between 8351B or 8361A, happy me!

P.S. But wait, some claim 8361A does not perform as well as 8351B, is that evidence based and audible?

Lol why would they even use animal products in a studio monitor?

 

[abdo123]

Lol why would they even use animal products in a studio monitor?

you would be surprised by how much things contain animal products.

stuff like paint, glue, rubber .etc

 

[Sancus]

P.S. But wait, some claim 8361A does not perform as well as 8351B, is that evidence based and audible?

Yes, but it's marginal. The 8351B is slightly smoother off axis and flatter on. The 8361A controls directivity slightly lower. The difference would no doubt be tough to hear.

The bigger differences are size/weight, cost, and woofer power. The 8361A will play about 5dB louder in low frequencies(<320hz). This is less important if you use subs, but it's really up to you.

 

[MBI]

Lol why would they even use animal products in a studio monitor?

Silk inn't uncommon in tweeters, whool has been used in woofer cones and as damping material. Deluxe speakers may sometimes be covered with leather. So some is just for aesthetics, others are used for mechanical properties in the sound producing units. You may not be familiar with the issue, but it's all over the place, even in some tire makes (pig) or bank notes (UK). Amounts may vary, but alternatives work just as well, so it's nice to have some choice. Genelec is a treat!

 

[MBI]

Yes, but it's marginal. The 8351B is slightly smoother off axis and flatter on. The 8361A controls directivity slightly lower. The difference would no doubt be tough to hear.

The bigger differences are size/weight, cost, and woofer power. The 8361A will play about 5dB louder in low frequencies(<320hz). This is less important if you use subs, but it's really up to you.

Thanks. Cost difference isn't hudge. My living room is already stuffed. I have to forget about the hudge subs for at least a year and will stick the Ones onto bookshelves for now. So, probably the 8361A. don't know how to find the best deal in Europe though...

 

[Pearljam5000]

Thanks. Cost difference isn't hudge. My living room is already stuffed. I have to forget about the hudge subs for at least a year and stick will place the Ones onto bookshelves for now. So, probably the 8361A. don't know how to find the best deal in Europe though...

Try Thomann (not sure if they have the best price)

 

[Trell]

Try Thomann (not sure if they have the best price)

Their prices are generally competitive and they have excellent after sales support in the cases when I got something with a fault.

 

[richard12511]

P.S. But wait, some claim 8361A does not perform as well as 8351B, is that evidence based and audible?

It doesn't measure quite as smooth on/of axis, but the difference is really small. No idea how audible it is. Probably not very.

Crossed to subs, I never see the red lights of despair, so the 8351b is better in my situation. If I was consistently seeing the red lights, the 8361 would no doubt be the better speaker.

 

[Ron Texas]

Thank you @amirm

It appears these speakers would benefit from subwoofers to increase the maximum volume. Just my preference, but for 8k I would prefer some floor standing Revel's, subs and a decent amp. Part of this is due to there being no Genelec dealer in the Houston area, the other is the common aversion to expensive integrated speaker systems. I do recognize Genelec is far more likely to have parts, but after 7 years, there is no obligation.

 

[EchoChamber]

Thanks. Cost difference isn't hudge. My living room is already stuffed. I have to forget about the hudge subs for at least a year and stick will place the Ones onto bookshelves for now. So, probably the 8361A. don't know how to find the best deal in Europe though...

I’ve bought my two Gens pairs (8351B and 8330A) from Global Audio Store in France. They usually have a 5% discount. Their support team has been great IME.

 

[EchoChamber]

It doesn't measure quite as smooth on/of axis, but the difference is really small. No idea how audible it is. Probably not very.

Crossed to subs, I never see the red lights of despair, so the 8351b is better in my situation. If I was consistently seeing the red lights, the 8361 would no doubt be the better speaker.

Same here, to trigger the red light I’m at ear bleeding levels...

 

[Spocko]

Nice, I was looking at that unit, but just don't know if I wanna pay that much for a processor. Have you tried Dirac? If so I'd be curious on how you think Trinnov compares.

I'll list its 3 unique reasons (compared to Dirac) as it applies to my use case (as a reviewer):

1. Object Visualizer - Absolutely critical for my reviews of immersive audio in movies/music. We are visual animals and this truly helps understand how much is happening above/around the MLP
2. Remapping Software and Triangulation Microphone - I will be reviewing both Auro3D and Atmos, and their respective upmixing algorithms of 5.1 content - to that end my speaker arrangement must be a compromised "unified layout" that is not ideal to either but "close enough". The Trinnov remapping software was designed for this situation, specifically, my 4 overhead Atmos channels are also Auro height channels and positioning them for the former excludes optimal playback of the latter. However, these differences are fully resolved of any compromises by the Optimizer Microphone for true triangulation that drives the accuracy of its remapping algorithm, adjusting more accurately for MLP and speaker placement than a single microphone ever can - more data points means better precision. In Trinnov's own marketing speak: "The 3D microphone uses four mic elements in a precise tetrahedral arrangement. Each capsule is individually calibrated at the factory (±0.1 dB from 20 Hz to 24 kHz) ... As each speaker is measured, the resulting sound waves pass through this array of microphones, hitting each one at a slightly different time. Based on this timing, it triangulates the location of the speaker from which the sound arrived. By testing each speaker in turn, Trinnov build a three-dimensional map of where the speakers are relative to the mic (which is placed at the main listening position)."
3. PC Software Driven - Dirac is layered on top of a dedicated decoding chip which may have some minor firmware updates but you're pretty much stuck with that version - for example it could never magically add an entirely new format like IMAX Enhanced if it wasn't already there. Trinnov on the other hand can update its software with zero limitations and can easily add IMAX Enhanced or DTS:X or Atmos Ultimo because they are developers themselves that are given license to apply the source code to the hardware. Storm cannot do this and must use Dirac and the Atmos processor "as is" - they are free to choose whatever processor they want from Texas Instruments but cannot make direct software changes to the chip. This intimate knowledge of how multi-channel processing works at the developer level empowers me to ask questions and request specific changes/improvements that can be considered in future updates. For example, if Dirac is not properly calibrating Atmos - I can't reach out to Storm Audio, I would have to reach out to Dirac, but because Dirac is not an end-licensee of Atmos there's not much Dirac can do to figure out what's wrong whereas Trinnov engineers can trouble shoot their implementation of Atmos at the source - and this is why Trinnov is so freaking expensive. You are paying for an entire layer of software engineering that is not supported at Storm, Lyngdorf or even Dirac.

Most importantly, and I can't emphasize this enough - all of the above doesn't mean that my system will sound better than a properly dialed-in $2,500 Denon or Marantz AVR (with Audyssey) or Storm/Monolith with Dirac. I'm paying a BIG premium for flexibility, ease of implementation and access to information: I can pick up the phone/email/text and literally call up Trinnov support (employees working directly with the engineering team) who will be able to walk me through my issue if it's user error - this level of service is not reserved for reviewers but every purchaser of Trinnov. Dirac cannot (and likely will not) provide that level of product support to the masses. OK, this is reason #4, but I believe this level of support is offered by Storm Audio and others playing in the $20,000 MSRP range so is technically not unique to Trinnov.

 

[MBI]

I’ve bought my two Gens pairs (8351B and 8330A) from Global Audio Store in France. They usually have a 5% discount. Their support team has been great IME.

For some strange reason, they can't provide the Ones anymore. Perhaps something about Genelec reducing the number of French dealers, I didn't undertsand the reason and they have absolutely no idea if the Ones will come back on their list. Instead, they proposed the 8050, which seems to be a very good speaker too, much cheaper and with deeper base but without SAM or even coax. Amir did an interesting review with the 8050 (lacked power in his opinion, and has a dip that may need eq, but a very well behaved speaker too).

 

[EchoChamber]

For some strange reason, they can't provide the Ones anymore. Perhaps something about Genelec reducing the number of French dealers, I didn't undertsand the reason and they have absolutely no idea if the Ones will come back on their list. Instead, they proposed the 8050, which seems to be a very good speaker too, much cheaper and with deeper base but without SAM or even coax. Amir did an interesting review with the 8050 (lacked power in his opinion, and has a dip that may need eq, but a very well behaved speaker too).

I’d still try to get a SAM if you can. I went from 8030C to 8330A in my office setup and having room correction is big in an untreated room like mine.