I'd bet a lot of money that the exact same audiophiles that hate class D also think that $50,000 speaker cables make a huge difference.
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Audiophiles, generally don't like class D amps!
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DHT 845
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I don't like class D and I think that $50.000 cables make very little difference.
You might find it interesting that one of my professors at university was one of the premier experts on the Dutch language and has made several major contributions to its development (the spelling guide he worked on has been the standard for anyone who writes professionally). The one thing he always said is that there is no right or wrong in language, just what is commonly accepted and what diverges from that. Language is constantly changing and shifting. You might consider it odd, but that doesn't mean it is incorrect. The locutionary act is not the most interesting aspect of a speech act.
Just my two cents. Sound and music is such a subjective thing, people have different preferences about what and how they like it that it is more about personal preference. Measurements are the only objective standards and are depended on the parameters we use. My subjective take is that i liked the sound of my tube amplifier with that woolly bass and extra dimensional highs (harmonics). Pleasant until i got my hands on a good class A tube amp with low impedance output transformer and only 0.35% distortion. The bass was tight (like a good AB amp) and didn't sound so much as a "tube amp", more like a hybrid. Then a got a vintage Toshiba SB620 with great depth of sound and deep bass. Silky soft highs and overall great sound. Unfortunately it died and i had nobody to repair it. Without amp i bought a Aiyima A07. Very clean sound but my brain did not like it so much initial. To harsh, present in my face and no "rounded" sound like you have with life music in a café. More like the music was under a microscope and was funneled directly into my ears. I decided to buy a Tube pre amp, in the hope to add some smoothness and exchange the op amps as well for the 2134PA and 2604AP and it worked, the sound was less in my face, more silky and better for long listening. So, what is my resume: my brain loves a little harmonic extra (distortion) and does not like to hear every micro detail and mistake from recordings, it is more pleased with silky smooth highs for long listening and prefers to sacrifice on detail to obtain more pleasure. The type or techniek used (class D, A, AB ect.) does not matter, if it delivers what our brain prefers.
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Good thing I didn't make that bet!
Ricardus
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Citation needed.
How is that possible? What is it you're hearing that an Audio Precision testing device isn't measuring?
Citation needed.
It was a very odd statement for a design engineer.
My actions are part of the changing and shifting, and I oppose it because it makes no physical sense. That might seem odd to you, but I participate in the process.
An English teacher would still mark it incorrect, as they should. There are still such consensus rules in every language despite the desire to declare there are no rules.
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There are some. moola-moola, Bel Canto, etc. and of course each gets the “almost as good as Class A” treatment at Audiogone.
They are not super expensive. A more expensive amp would get a better review.
theREALdotnet
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Then there is the Mark Levinson No.53 (at $50,000 per channel), but of course that’s not a real class D amp. As Michael Fremer points out, it’s too heavy for that and runs warm.
The Mark Levinson was apparently designed by the same engineers that designed the Crown Drivecore chips/amps, and using the same principles... on steroids of course!
Galliardist
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I've used the "I own a Ken Ishiwata designed Marantz amplifier" line from time to time when faced with such people. They forget about the PM-10 and the Ruby
guys, we are an international forum, a lot of non native English speakers here (I am one). some are even using google translate to participate. it's not exactly productive to have a grammar debate, as long as we can understand each other. let's drop that.
Not sure I would take Fremer's opinion as engineering gospel. @amirm would know, but my recollection is that it uses a interleaved class D topology. Running warm may be due to low-level circuits, losses in the power supply or class D amps themselves, etc. Some class D amplifiers use large transformers in their power supplies and so are fairly heavy (ATI comes to mind). Class D is not 100% efficient so there is always power loss, and efficiency can be very low at low power levels.
Well but Crutchfield is advertising that Rotel for $1400 so it's not cheaper than the Topping LA90 at $800. That's USA of course so maybe your local dealer can do better for whatever reason.
The Rotel is likely a very decent amp but I can assure you that the mentioned OP on the other forum would never consider it. Personally I'd hands-down buy a Purifi-based amp for $1400.
DanielT
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Do you use it for home use? HiFi at home? What speakers do you power it up with? Does the fan come on often and if so do you experience the fan as loud?
Although it may be "Behringerwatts", so despite that it should still be quite a lot of power/watts considering its spec. Such an amp for home use should hardly have to work that hard and thus the cooling fan may not need to come on as often?
I assume that the fan is temperature controlled.
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theREALdotnet
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I’m sure I wouldn’t.
It seems to me that if you've built a system out of a bunch of idiosyncratic components, each of which attempts to compensate for the deficiencies of the others, replacing an inaccurate component with a strictly accurate, uncolored component is as likely to harm the perceived sound as it is to help it. So it may be the case that when people audition these amps, they hear things they dislike that originate elsewhere in the chain? Or maybe it is mostly confirmation bias.
Anyway, this seems like the problem with a purely subjective approach -- not building upon a foundation of measured accuracy is likely to lead to neurotic whack-a-mole behavior as you grope your way through the audio chain seeking improvements. It's great for the high-end audio industry because their customers keep coming back, but it seems like kind of a silly hobby. I have no problem paying for luxurious, cool-looking casework -- that's art! -- but I don't want to spend my life on a quixotic quest for audio bliss with no understanding of the fundamentals.
Anyway, this seems like the problem with a purely subjective approach -- not building upon a foundation of measured accuracy is likely to lead to neurotic whack-a-mole behavior as you grope your way through the audio chain seeking improvements. It's great for the high-end audio industry because their customers keep coming back, but it seems like kind of a silly hobby. I have no problem paying for luxurious, cool-looking casework -- that's art! -- but I don't want to spend my life on a quixotic quest for audio bliss with no understanding of the fundamentals.
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