GR Research LGK 2.0 Speaker Review (A Joke)

[Robbo99999]

I dont get you. I not talk about fine points, what ever they should be. Comparing this speakers at 90db is not about fine points, its about a lot of bass distourten. My post was only a reaction on @iMickey503 post. The last think i like to start is how usefull yt ab comparisons are at finer level. But i think even at yt you can hear a difference between a cowbell and a bassdrum.

I'd imagine it would depend how obvious the distortion was, if it's super obvious & in-your-face then I guess a mic would capture that regardless of the inaccuracies associated with "mic -> recording -> playback on unknown speakers/rooms/headphones", but then if it's so obvious why the need to hear it for yourself - surely the word of a reviewer like Amir would be good enough in that case. I suppose it could emphasise the point being made though.

Then what is the Reference standard headphone and listening setup? Surely with today technology and knowledge this has been thought of so that they can remotely convey an experience to another in today modern day and age with some kind of industry standard?

I'm sure those Specialists in the field of Audiologists have pondered this at least sometime in their field of medicine if they are diagnosing hearing issues so they can make a legal verified and liable claim of diagnosis for said medical diagnosis with some kind of universal industry approved reference standard? Or maybe the RIAA or AES or someone must have thought about this already? Some of those recording engineers must do remote work right?


The reason why I cry foul about this idea that "you can't hear this " is that people can tell the difference in sounds over a POTS telephone that has a bandwidth that is less than AM radio. 911 operators can deduce a surprising amount of information of a call. So So there's plenty to notice. Even with limited bandwidth and crummy reproduction devices. The onus really is on the trained listener IMO.
~180hz - 3.2Khz Apx.

A better test of hearing details would be to hear a voice you know or care about. Say my Niece yesterday for example. About 30 humans of various ages on the school playground. Lots of background noise. And even with all that, 250 or so feet away, I can pick out and hear Clearly as day when she says "Uncle" no matter what and can home in and pinpoint where that squeaky shrimps voice comes from.

I can even pick out charatrists if she is in any sort of distress in her voice when said "Uncle" is heard or a scream depending on pitch being "Oh shit" or "Its nothing, shes fine". I have not tested it. But I could make out at least her voice over a cell phone that has slighty higher bandwidth to ~7Khz.

Unless your microphone has the fidelity of an AM radio? I think anyone with any competency and a microphone on a modern cell phone should be able to showcase these said distortions that are indeed audible.

Erin just put up a video where he did a Blind listening test of 3 different speakers. Anyone can tell they sound different even over youtube.

Since the goal is not to hear Ben folds farting on his CD, we are here to HEAR distortions in Ben Folds Farting while he plays the piano and Distortions of said farts in the Speakers on playback. It should be easy to reproduce flaws in the playback that we can pick out with these with test. Even on sub par gear if they are indeed audible. (That or the electrostatics were making their own fart noises)
Otherwise? Measurement Microphones are a meme. And the the ones that cost big money is just buying tone. Not detail. So there goes the audio business. We can just use iPhones from now on. Dig?


We have some Serious bonafide hard as nails die hard booth junkies in here. I'm pretty sure with all that brain power and experience something can be hatched out.

A good reference would be what Alexa sounds like in case you have no freinds to compare drivers or distortion. File included bellow. You can tell and HEAR distortion at FULL tilt. Even with the music being full of it. You can hear the drivers not doing their job of signal in, signal out. Enjoy my Ugly Tax payer funded grill and this distortion riddled music.
3 examples are given. And on my system in my car? I can hear the microphone preamp/ DA noise FAINTLY that I can not hear on my headphones. Maybe its just me? But its a direct to digital recording with the O.G. Files. You can inspect them for playback quality.
And thats with just commodity gear anyone can get. I suspect many of us have better gear then the rest of the public.

Fuck I type to much.
EDIT. Zip file is to large. Posting Youtube videos.
DASH

Test of each driver where you can hear break up and sound of each driver at point blank range. (1- 3 inches away from grill or speaker. )

ASUS CP101a Hot built in stereo microphone with AGC compared to UMM-6

I don't think you've convinced me with those Youtube links, I did listen to them. For Erin's, yes the different speakers sound different, but it's mostly tonality, I don't think you can seperate soundstage from tonality unless they all have the same tonality (as tonality (frequency response) affects soundstage) - they certainly sound different though. Your own Youtube vids, I don't really get what you're trying to show there.....and given the quality I don't think there was anything to distinguish.....well the different drivers sounded different because some were tweeters & some were instead playing the bottom ranges or fuller ranges.....so nothing really to discern there, I don't really get the point there. I'm not really seeing the value of mic recorded speakers to then listen back over whatever device you're using.

EDIT: for Erin's vid, it just seemed like the same effect as someone playing the same bit of music whilst flipping between different EQ profiles and loudnesses.

 

[Jon AA]

For Erin's, yes the different speakers sound different, but it's mostly tonality, I don't think you can seperate soundstage from tonality unless they all have the same tonality (as tonality (frequency response) affects soundstage) - they certainly sound different though.

I'm pretty sure I heard substantial differences in the spacial qualities of each speaker. I thought it was a fun test. It'll be interesting to see the followup video.

 

[Robbo99999]

I'm pretty sure I heard substantial differences in the spacial qualities of each speaker. I thought it was a fun test. It'll be interesting to see the followup video.

Yes, which is also directly related to the frequency response/tonality, so I don't know how you can seperate that from tonality/frequency response. (Also loudness differences I noticed which again could be just frequency response/tonality shifts and/or maybe overall measured difference in dB, but maybe overall measured depending on which weighting you use). To me it seems like there are too many variables in the whole chain through the recording chain & through playback chain for useful comparisons. (Differences in personal HRTF between people would also affect the recordings & playback considering this is binaural in his ear, but that comes under the recording & playback chain I mentioned above, and also amoungst all the other variables that I haven't listed that are still contained within that same recording & playback chain).

 

[Jon AA]

Well, he said they were corrected to the same room curve. So if you hear a difference in tonality (excepting bass which wasn't made equal between the speakers) it has to be due to dispersion differences. For example, speaker B has a boatload of high frequency energy (coming from the sidewalls?) and very wide soundstage, indicating pretty wide dispersion at high frequencies, (BMR or similar?) ...and it does not have nearly as crisp a center image as speaker A. Speaker A had plenty of high frequency info but less exaggerated and a more focused center image so I'm thinking something with more medium/narrow but well controlled directivity--R3 or similar.

But I certainly could be imagining all that. I don't think I hear spacial cues correctly through headphones (center image sounds more like a center height speaker location to me). But a fun diversion after a few beers.

 

[Robbo99999]

Well, he said they were corrected to the same room curve. So if you hear a difference in tonality (excepting bass which wasn't made equal between the speakers) it has to be due to dispersion differences. For example, speaker B has a boatload of high frequency energy (coming from the sidewalls?) and very wide soundstage, indicating pretty wide dispersion at high frequencies, (BMR or similar?) ...and it does not have nearly as crisp a center image as speaker A. Speaker A had plenty of high frequency info but less exaggerated and a more focused center image so I'm thinking something with more medium/narrow but well controlled directivity--R3 or similar.

But I certainly could be imagining all that. I don't think I hear spacial cues correctly through headphones (center image sounds more like a center height speaker location to me). But a fun diversion after a few beers.

Yes, I'd expect recorded frequency response measured in-ear to be slightly different for speakers with different dispersion characteristics, but how different I don't know.....and there was an absolute boat load of tonality difference & loudness difference between those different binaural recordings, which makes me think there's some elements that are hard to control like perhaps insertion depth of the in-ear microphones which might have been different between each recording......or how accurate can the EQ'ing of each speaker's in-room response be in relation to what's experienced at the listening position, how controlled can that interrelationship be. I just think there's too many variables to really make proper comparisons when you're building up inaccuracies all the way through the recording and playback chain. To me it's about the anechoic measurements and the general subjective listening impressions of the reviewer, and I think any kind of "recording of how a speaker sounds" is fundamentally flawed as a means to convey the qualities of a speaker, be it in absolute or comparative terms against other speakers.....I see it as more of a potential for creating confusion rather than enlightenment.

 

[newaudioguy77]

Uhhh... that's what unfinished MDF looks like, guys. It's a great material for speaker enclosures and ubiquitous in the well-loved commercial designs here. You would typically seal and paint it or veneer over it.

Just kinda annoyed that you are, from a place of ignorance, insulting @Rick Sykora 's hard work and contributions to the site.

No. I'm talking about the speaker itself. It just doesn't look premium at all, no matter what the finish is.
Wasn't trying to insult Rock Sykora.

 

[jnorris]

Danny is so full of himself I'm sure he's fashioning a self-righteous review of this review and will accuse you of everything from cotton in your ears to malicious revenge. His most recent YouTube videos have totally removed his last shred of credibility.

 

[DanielT]

Danny is so full of himself I'm sure he's fashioning a self-righteous review of this review and will accuse you of everything from cotton in your ears to malicious revenge. His most recent YouTube videos have totally removed his last shred of credibility.

Recent videos? This is not a new one. I know there is some irritation regarding posting Danny's videos on ASR. You should not market his channel here, but if you not know how he reasons, how should you be able to discuss what he says and claims?

Well, regarding double blind test and cables and that he hears a clear difference between different speaker cables.Obviously no serious double blind test is performed. . Starting at 9:30 and a bit ahead in that video.

Check out the first few minutes of the video where Danny explains how those who believe in science are flat earthers (has a scientific approach regarding HiFi is flat erhers)... or if it was irony, mixed with waffle. Hard to determine. See, listen and decide for yourself.

 

[Bruce Morgen]

Check out the first few minutes of the video where Danny explains how those who believe in science are flat earthers (has a scientific approach regarding HiFi is flat earthers)... or if it was irony, mixed with waffle. Hard to determine. See, listen and decide for yourself.

Either he actually believes what he preaches, in which case he's a fool -- or he's saying this sort of stuff to make money, in which case he's a unscrupulous businessman.

 

[DanielT]

Either he actually believes what he preaches, in which case he's a fool -- or he's saying this sort of stuff to make money, in which case he's a unscrupulous businessman.

Who knows. Let's say he really believes in it. Is there so much to care about, really? He can believe what he wants. In this case, the worship of fat speaker cables religion.

On the other hand, if he does not believe what he says, but it is just a deliberate sales trick to sell very expensive cables. Then it comes in a different light.

 

[voodooless]

Who knows. Let's say he really believes in it. Is there so much to care about, really? He can believe what he wants. In this case, the worship of fat speaker cables religion.

On the other hand, if he does not believe what he says, but it is just a deliberate sales trick to sell very expensive cables. Then it comes in a different light.

It’s called GR Research. They should not “believe” anything.

 

[newaudioguy77]

Recent videos? This is not a new one. I know there is some irritation regarding posting Danny's videos on ASR. You should not market his channel here, but if you not know how he reasons, how should you be able to discuss what he says and claims?

Well, regarding double blind test and cables and that he hears a clear difference between different speaker cables.Obviously no serious double blind test is performed. . Starting at 9:30 and a bit ahead in that video.

Check out the first few minutes of the video where Danny explains how those who believe in science are flat earthers (has a scientific approach regarding HiFi is flat erhers)... or if it was irony, mixed with waffle. Hard to determine. See, listen and decide for yourself.

It's called Audio Science Review!!
Not "Audio Theory Review!!" lol Danny again not making sense. Trying to fool others and sound reputable...so he can sell his products.

 

[HarmonicTHD]

Well, why don't you bake a pie and invite folks over to listen to your speakers? And then hope that one of your guests does the same. I wish to experience the Hi-Fi hobby that way.

I would gladly have some people over to experience my "3% distortion tube amplifier with full range transmission line speakers". I'm that guy. And you can tell me it sucks too! My ego won't be bruised LOL.

Just get a DAW or a VST plugin capable audio player, a distortion VST and a noise VST. You can dial in any combination of distortion and noise levels and composition at a fraction of money and effort.

No need to buy a tube amp or these speakers.

But if you love your tube amp, by all means…

 

[voodooless]

It's called Audio Science Review!!
Not "Audio Theory Review!!"

A scientific theory is basically a fact. I guess we should take it as a compliment then?

 

[DanielT]

It’s called GR Research. They should not “believe” anything.

He he, I missed the "little" detail.
GR..my own created definition regardning Research... maybe his company should be called?

It's called Audio Science Review!!
Not "Audio Theory Review!!" lol Danny again not making sense. Trying to fool others and sound reputable...so he can sell his products.

My guess. Danny probably knew that, but said Audio Theory Review just to tease.

 

[HarmonicTHD]

At 100 percent distourtion (we just imagine its only h2) the bassman plays always the base note and a octave higher the same loud...if iam not wrong??

We end up with mud. So if people think this smaller driver give a faster more precise bass, they are just wrong. They give just more mud. At least at a listening level over a mouse fart. Maybe thats a reason why many studios had 15 inch drivers in there midfields. They loved bass players. . Just imagine Lemmy had to listen to him in the studio over this speakers. I not liked to be that technician. At 84db he would say I cant hear me playing and at 96db he would say thats not me i never play two notes the same time!

Wow isn’t this great. You get twice the music you paid for. Now I get it. That must be the value proposition of these speakers.

 

[tomtoo]

He he, I missed the "little" detail.
GR..my own created definition regardning Research... maybe his company should be called?

My guess. Danny probably knew that, but said Audio Theory Review just to tease.

In everyday talk a theory is somethink like "yes,we know its your theory...."
In science a theory is the best we have.

So how he used theory we downt know. But if its used in science therms it was a praise.

 

[tomtoo]

Wow isn’t this great. You get twice the music you paid for. Now I get it. That must be the value proposition of these speakers.

Sure two Lemmys are more expensive then one. With a Kali in-8 you just would get one Lemmy thats why this speaker is a littel more expensive. But still a bargain couse its not double as expensive. I get this speaker and a amp with volume up to 11. Then i have two Lemmys at volume 11. Nothing can compete with this combination.

 

[DanielT]

Sure two Lemmys are more expensive then one. With a Kali in-8 you just would get one Lemmy thats why this speaker is a littel more expensive. But still a bargain couse its not double as expensive. I get this speaker and a amp with volume up to 11. Then i have two Lemmys at volume 11. Nothing can compete with this combination.

For that, fat Marshall is needed. ...Or if that amplifier, the speaker in the video is called, ... Hammer? Maybe it's a model for Lemmy? See attached picture.

Official Motörhead

#TBT Lemmy’s ‘Hammer’ bass amp and forerunner to the mighty Murder One! https://motorhead.lnk.to/everyplaylistFA

www.facebook.com

 

[tomtoo]

For that, fat Marshall is needed. ...Or if that amplifier, the speaker in the video is called, ... Hammer? Maybe it's a model for Lemmy? See attached picture.

Official Motörhead

#TBT Lemmy’s ‘Hammer’ bass amp and forerunner to the mighty Murder One! https://motorhead.lnk.to/everyplaylistFA

www.facebook.com

Now imagine two of this at volume 11. Pure Heaven.