YouTube Loudspeaker Demo Videos - Yes No Maybe?

[dfuller]

Holy moly those B&Ws are bright there. can't tell a damn thing else, it's all reverberant room sound.

 

[Doodski]

Yeah, everything would want to be as near to identical as possible, to gain maximum value.

Can presets for levels and other adjustments be stored in memory on a suitable audio mix console?

 

[Deleted member 46664]

Can presets for levels and other adjustments be stored in memory on a suitable audio mix console?

The problem is that your speakers cannot possibly sound like his speakers... no matter what you do.

 

[Shiva]

Personally, I like listening to speaker demos, such as this one from the Sound Sommeliers. Over my Sennheisers HD 580's, it doesn't sound half bad. I dig the opening bass line, though the singer at times is a tad screechy. I also like that his vids have no chatter.

 

[Doodski]

The problem is that your speakers cannot possibly sound like his speakers... no matter what you do.

I know this. I'm curious about what a inexpensive console costs for software or hardware.

 

[Deleted member 46664]

I know this. I'm curious about what a inexpensive console costs for software or hardware.

From the pre-amp side to level balance at the amplifier inputs ... they can be quite inexpensive. A simple 4 track audio interface should be able to do the job.

 

[Ageve]

Nobody is claiming perfect resolution in these videos (this is the reaction, rather than reading) and nobody suggests that the qualms raised don't have value (different rooms to yours, mic response and so on), but to say that videos, especially well executed comparisons between different speakers (yes, even when played back through your own speakers or headphones) don't give an impression of how a speaker will sound, is logically false.

I would argue that evaluating one loudspeaker by listening to another one is almost impossible.

Hearing the basic tonality of a speaker in this way would probably be possible under ideal circumstances (perfect mono recording of a single speaker in a "perfect" room), if it's also played back using a very good/accurate speaker in a "perfect" room (or possibly the very best headphones).

But why go through all that trouble, instead of just looking at measurements, and then listening to the actual speakers?

 

[Doodski]

From the pre-amp side to level balance at the amplifier inputs ... they can be quite inexpensive. A simple 4 track audio interface should be able to do the job.

So like $200 for something that can work at the required standard of accuracy req'd plus including cables? Then + expensive mics, a booth or suitable room. Could get messy.

 

[Digby]

But it won't and it is a lot of work and expense to host them.

I suppose, but it could be done one at a time as you measure them, providing things were kept the same on subsequent occasions.

On the former, if your headphone is already a bass heavy, you may like a speaker with less bass using them which is not correct. And at any rate, everyone will have a different headphone so disagreements would continue.

This is somewhat adjacent to what I mean. I meant more how do objective differences in measurement affect subjective perception on a wider scale (groups, not individual). OK, everyone has different preferences, but there will be some degree of overlap.

For instance, you caught a lot of flack for liking the TuneTot speaker. It didn't measure well, in the typical sense, but after minor EQ you found it enjoyable. The collection of flaws it presented was uglier to the eye than the ear, this is the interesting part to me, how exactly do the objective measurements chime with subjective listening.

That a speaker can present poorly on measurements, yet sound far better than expected suggests there may be some way to go in fully interpreting the measurements.

It isn't the only time you have been surprised how by much you enjoyed a speaker that didn't measure so well. It seems that, at the moment, measurements (or the understanding of them) are not giving a full picture as to whether a speaker will give a seemingly natural/pleasant presentation, even for a trained listener. Perhaps recordings, alongside measurements, would provide some extra information to bridge the gap...who knows?

 

[Deleted member 46664]

So like $200 for something that can work at the required standard of accuracy req'd plus including cables? Then + expensive mics, a booth or suitable room. Could get messy.

Yep ... all that to finally discover the limiting factor is the speakers sitting on your audience's desks.
I watched one of those videos from my tablet and guess what ... it sounded just like tablet speakers to me.

This whole remote interview thing is just not going to work.

 

[Digby]

Yep ... all that to finally discover the limiting factor is the speakers sitting on your audience's desks.
I watched one of those videos from my tablet and guess what ... it sounded just like tablet speakers to me.

The ultimate limiting factor is a lack of imagination. Obviously tablet speakers won't cut it, but a reasonable pair of two way speakers will convey the general character of any other speaker, when other comparisons exist (including the source material).

It works perfectly fine as a rough and ready way to decide whether a speaker may be of interest for proper audition.

 

[Deleted member 46664]

It works perfectly fine as a rough and ready way to decide whether a speaker may be of interest for proper audition.

No it doesn't .... what you're really doing is auditioning your own speakers.

As I said, the closest you'll get is "This is what his speakers sound like through my speakers"

 

[Digby]

As I said, the closest you'll get is "This is what his speakers sound like through my speakers"

Yes, and that is just "rough and ready" put into different words.

The resolution is high enough to suit such purposes.

 

[amirm]

I suppose, but it could be done one at a time as you measure them, providing things were kept the same on subsequent occasions.

How does that reduce the work of capture, volume/location equalization, compression and hosting them?

 

[amirm]

That a speaker can present poorly on measurements, yet sound far better than expected suggests there may be some way to go in fully interpreting the measurements.

It isn't the only time you have been surprised how by much you enjoyed a speaker that didn't measure so well. It seems that, at the moment, measurements (or the understanding of them) are not giving a full picture as to whether a speaker will give a seemingly natural/pleasant presentation, even for a trained listener. Perhaps recordings, alongside measurements, would provide some extra information to bridge the gap...who knows?

Believe me, if there is a solution for this, I would implement it. But capturing the sound and having people listen with every device they have is not it.

 

[ta240]

I admit to sometimes listening to speaker demos for entertainment purposes, but I often feel bad for makers of the poorly recorded ones. A lot of people could get turned off of their speakers based on a low-quality recording.
Even when it is comparisons recorded by the same person, the slightest change in microphone angle, distance or height in relation to the speaker drivers could alter the sound reproduction.
Then again, does it make any less sense than buying a speaker based off of a gushing commentary from a person that includes a sponsored link, or does contract video work for the same company or just wants to keep the items to review coming?

 

[Rednaxela]

We hugely bemoan the loss of brick-and-mortar HiFi shops where we could audition speakers, etc. Yet, those who survived that era knew that listening to speakers in a HiFi store was much, much different than hearing them in your space.

Agree. Did that once, appreciated the service, but eventually it didn’t help me much.

However, wouldn’t that be an argument in favour of having even more loudspeaker videos on YT, in as many different environments as possible?

I mean when I don’t like the sound in 990 out of 1000 videos of the same speakers in as many different setups and rooms, what will be the odds that they’re gonna work for me in mine?

 

[audiomaestro]

But it won't and it is a lot of work and expense to host them. On the former, if your headphone is already a bass heavy, you may like a speaker with less bass using them which is not correct. And at any rate, everyone will have a different headphone so disagreements would continue.

Not if you're comparing the recorded tonality against the same source tracks. If the headphone is bass heavy, the source track will be bass heavy, and you would simply compare and make sure the recorded sample of the speaker being tested is also bass heavy. The listener isn't observing which one "they like on their headphones", they are observing which speaker sounds nearest to the source track. Your duty would be to make sure you eliminate as many variables as possible. If you have issues and gripes with how some do it, then do it better.

So far the best comparison done right I have found is this one:

You can open the source tracks in another tab and compare them one by one against the speakers. Using a decent set of headphones, you will easily be able to discern which monitors fail miserably at replicating the tonality of the source track and which succeed. To my ears, the Genelec 8351B won, which is not surprising considering they objectively measured the best among the compared monitors. Any limitations in the process were not enough to obstruct the better objective speaker from nearly matching the source tracks over my headphones.

I find these sort of demo's, when done right, to be far superior to reviewers subjective opinions.
Take the review of the Focal Alpha 65 EVO as an example. Your subjective impression was that it is strongly recommended, but this video demo below let me hear just how horrible the upper mids are. Very poor tonality, overall.

I would be inclined to think if you compared those Focal monitors against a known flat quality headphone, using the same source track, you would have easily been able to discern that something is wrong with them, and not recommended them. Once I heard that, I couldn't unhear it, and when I listened to them in person it stood out.

 

[audiomaestro]

I mean when I don’t like the sound in 990 out of 1000 videos of the same speakers in as many different setups and rooms, what will be the odds that they’re gonna work for me in mine?

It depends. 990 of the videos may have been recorded poorly over a cheap cell phone mic with insane amounts of room coloration, while the 10 were done right. I get your point, though. If you're comparing 100 videos that were done sufficiently, and you disliked 99 of them, then I would say its clear as day it's not what you want and the 1 was just an anomaly. There's a lot of garbage demo's on YT, but there's also some gems.

 

[Rednaxela]

Believe me, if there is a solution for this, I would implement it. But capturing the sound and having people listen with every device they have is not it.

Thank you for this perspective. Really appreciated and very understandable.

Thinking out loud, and speaking only for myself, the majority of your concerns may be sufficiently addressed by providing a reference, being consistent, and creating quantity.

Reference
If you would add to every video ok this is pretty much what I hear IRL when I play back this video through a neutral chain with headphones so and so, YMMV through your chain with your headphones, then that would be something I believe a genuine and willing audience could work with.

Consistency
I guess this one doesn’t need further clarification.

Quantity
I truly believe that the more videos you’d provide, the easier it becomes for an audience to understand what it is that you mean and what it is not that you mean. When you write I listened to one unit of these speakers and found the tonality to be right, to me this is always quite abstract. However I believe that after 10 videos with different examples I would get it much better. Yes there is a risk of the opposite, but isn’t that always the case?

That said it is clear that in your specific situation the stakes are rather high. So not at all sure if this is helpful in any way.