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Yamaha Endorses Headphone Burn-in

DonH56

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#1
This hit my inbox this morning. I know a bit about electronic component and speaker burn-in but nothing about headphones. Why would it take 40 hours to burn in a set of earbuds or headphones? I would think it would be much less than speakers, or certainly not more than, and despite the hype with rare exceptions speaker burn-in only takes seconds or maybe minutes...

https://hub.yamaha.com/how-to-burn-...9f-e695b9ccb673&dm_i=50RY,D3JL,2TANEE,1D8B9,1
 

solderdude

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#2
They hope within 40 hours of use you will have gotten used to the sound.
Those that put it on a burn-in loop will be ensured (in their minds) that the headphone performs as expected.
Those that think burn-in is real will really like remarks like that from manufacturers.
Those that know it is nonsense will just laugh and ignore.

Win for Yamaha. :)
 
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DonH56

DonH56

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Thread Starter #3
They hope within 40 hours of use you will have gotten used to the sound.
Those that put it on a burn-in loop will be ensured (in their minds) that the headphone performs as expected.
Those that think burn-in is real will really like remarks like that from manufacturers.
Those that know it is nonsense will just laugh and ignore.

Win for Yamaha. :)
Yah, I figured all that, just wasn't sure there was any technical reason (I can't see one beyond a few seconds) and disappointed Yamaha is doing it. But I have not followed mainstream manufacturer's marketing for years (and obviously should continue to not follow).
 

Noodles

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#4
If it's a dynamic driver, the diaphragm material will loosen up a bit within an hour.
Sound wise ... don't think there will be a much a difference (if any).

Edit: not the diaphragm, rather the outer bit (forgot what it was called)
 
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DonH56

DonH56

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Thread Starter #5
If it's a dynamic driver, the diaphragm material will loosen up a bit within an hour.
Sound wise ... don't think there will be a much a difference (if any).

Edit: not the diaphragm, rather the outer bit (forgot what it was called)
Usually it's the surround (sometimes called the suspension, supports the diaphragm) and spider (supports the voice coil) that change with use. The wires connecting the voice coil to the connectors on the speaker (driver) may also break in but it depends upon how they were made.

I'd expect final QA testing to be about all the break-in (burn-in) a pair of headphones would need...

Pretty sure a lot of testing has shown speaker burn-in is real but inaudible for normal drivers and happens much faster than the tens to hundreds of hours marketeers often claim.
 

MusicNBeer

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#7
That's the one ;)

A mainstream manufacturer like Yamaha jumping on the band wagon just signals to manufacturers that it's ok to sell snake oil ... how disappointing.
Yamaha already sells smake oil with their AS-1200/2200/3200 amplifiers. The sales pitch for those is full of snake oil.
 

threni

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#8
This hit my inbox this morning. I know a bit about electronic component and speaker burn-in but nothing about headphones. Why would it take 40 hours to burn in a set of earbuds or headphones? I would think it would be much less than speakers, or certainly not more than, and despite the hype with rare exceptions speaker burn-in only takes seconds or maybe minutes...

https://hub.yamaha.com/how-to-burn-...9f-e695b9ccb673&dm_i=50RY,D3JL,2TANEE,1D8B9,1
"ABOUT THE AUTHOR
Ted Goslin is a content marketing specialist for the Yamaha Consumer Audio group who has dedicated his career to learning and writing about music and sound technology. "

He needs to do a little more learning and a little less "content marketing". Unless, that is, he is content with lazily repeating internet myths.

I wonder if Yamaha agree that their products are inferior to the competitors who don't make this claim? Perhaps they're in financial difficulty and are having to look the other way? I've emailed them to see if they're happy having their good name dragged into the mud with this specious horsesh*t.
 
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DonH56

DonH56

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Thread Starter #10
The sad thing for me is how myths, falsehoods, and half-truths (often irrelevant to the application) are first treated as gospel by consumers (typically ignorant of the science so easy prey) and then, instead of manufacturers' marketing using the opportunity to dispel them, they instead bow to the myths and endorse them as fact.

Not that this is new, or limited to audio, but disappointing...

It feeds on itself, of course, as consumers recognize and endorse manufacturers who feed their beliefs and thus encourage those and other manufactures to head further down the low road or lose sales.

Sigh...
 

threni

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#11
Ok, well, I emailed Yamaha of the back of that article, essentially asking if they'd done any tests, and got an initial response (I added bold):

"Please note we are not stating that a burn-in ritual is required, using any set of headphones or speakers in the normal way (by simply listening to music) will eventually run the product in also. We do wish to highlight to our customers that once any speaker product is run in, it will improve in performance."

I replied, asking if they'd done any proper testing (ie blind tests of burnt-in vs non-burnt-in speakers/headphones), or have any access to the properly performed tests of third parties, and eventually received this response:

"Our product specialist has indeed heard the effects of running in. We have not conducted blind tests to date, but there are many articles from other brands that all describe a similar effect.

A simple google search will bring up the following articles:

https://www.monitoraudio.com/en/support/faq/#9735
https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/gbr/en/blog/how-run-speakers
https://www.klipsch.com/blog/how-and-why-to-break-in-your-new-speakers
https://www.focal.com/en/focal-teach/what-is-the-running-in-period
https://www.dali-speakers.com/sound-academy/tips-tricks/running-in-period/
https://www.dynaudio.com/dynaudio-academy/2017/august/how-to-set-up-your-speakers
https://us.kef.com/blog/some-facts-about-speaker-break-in-301371114?___store=english_brand
"

It's a little odd that, despite me referring to the myths and psychology behind it in both emails, and them almost certainly seeing (if they're using Google search) many references discounting the myths whilst locating those articles for me, it didn't seem important to them to investigate further. I guess their specialist has heard it, though, so why bother.
 

trl

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#12
Yamaha already sells smake oil with their AS-1200/2200/3200 amplifiers. The sales pitch for those is full of snake oil.
Why would you say that? These are really great amps, too bad they are too pricey for me. They do measure very well (a bit better than the A-Sx01 series), they have a vu-meter/power-meter and inside there's the circlotron technology, floating audio grounds and separate dedicated internal PSUs (bridge + regulators + caps) for each stage (preamp, power amp, digital etc.) and for each channel too, things that you usually don't see inside speakers amps, not even in high-end ones. Feel free to search for its internal schematic and compare it with other amps, you'll understand what I'm saying.

As for the "burn-in", as long as the customers will accept it and even speak out loud that is improving things, then we' can't blame companies for writing this on their websites ads.
 

Koeitje

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#13
Why would you say that? These are really great amps, too bad they are too pricey for me. They do measure very well (a bit better than the A-Sx01 series), they have a vu-meter/power-meter and inside there's the circlotron technology, floating audio grounds and separate dedicated internal PSUs (bridge + regulators + caps) for each stage (preamp, power amp, digital etc.) and for each channel too, things that you usually don't see inside speakers amps, not even in high-end ones. Feel free to search for its internal schematic and compare it with other amps, you'll understand what I'm saying.

As for the "burn-in", as long as the customers will accept it and even speak out loud that is improving things, then we' can't blame companies for writing this on their websites ads.
Those measurements don't look that great for that kind of money....
 

Sgt. Ear Ache

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#15
Ok, well, I emailed Yamaha of the back of that article, essentially asking if they'd done any tests, and got an initial response (I added bold):

"Please note we are not stating that a burn-in ritual is required, using any set of headphones or speakers in the normal way (by simply listening to music) will eventually run the product in also. We do wish to highlight to our customers that once any speaker product is run in, it will improve in performance."

I replied, asking if they'd done any proper testing (ie blind tests of burnt-in vs non-burnt-in speakers/headphones), or have any access to the properly performed tests of third parties, and eventually received this response:

"Our product specialist has indeed heard the effects of running in. We have not conducted blind tests to date, but there are many articles from other brands that all describe a similar effect.

A simple google search will bring up the following articles:

https://www.monitoraudio.com/en/support/faq/#9735
https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/gbr/en/blog/how-run-speakers
https://www.klipsch.com/blog/how-and-why-to-break-in-your-new-speakers
https://www.focal.com/en/focal-teach/what-is-the-running-in-period
https://www.dali-speakers.com/sound-academy/tips-tricks/running-in-period/
https://www.dynaudio.com/dynaudio-academy/2017/august/how-to-set-up-your-speakers
https://us.kef.com/blog/some-facts-about-speaker-break-in-301371114?___store=english_brand
"

It's a little odd that, despite me referring to the myths and psychology behind it in both emails, and them almost certainly seeing (if they're using Google search) many references discounting the myths whilst locating those articles for me, it didn't seem important to them to investigate further. I guess their specialist has heard it, though, so why bother.
lol. Their evidence is a bunch of other people saying burn in works without providing any actual proof. Basically, it's an echo chamber of manufacturers all repeating the same myth because they know that a segment of their potential customers expect them to do so.
 
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