Why are there no female Audiophiles?

[pseudoid]

...he's more open-minded than you...

Yeah, @antcollinet why can't you be like he wants you to be?
BTW: Thanx for taking the heat off of me because I may not be able to restrain myself from replying to such childish insults...

 

[Fregly]

I think women will represent half the audiophile population around about the same time as they do in roofing crews.

 

[Pearljam5000]

You are really misunderstanding the quest for equality.

It is fundamentally NOT about making everyone the same.

It is about giving everyone equal opportunities in all aspects of life regardless of their differences.

Again - this is fundamental. It is social justice (for want of a better phrase) 101.

I'm all for equality
Women are even better than men mostly
But saying genetics and evolution play a small part in all of this just for the sake of sounding progressive and modern is ridiculous

 

[antcollinet]

I'm all for equality
Women are even better than men mostly
But saying genetics and evolution play a small part in all of this just for the sake of sounding progressive and modern is ridiculous

If I were doing it for the sake of sounding progressive and modern, you are right. That would be ridiculous. Almost as ridiculous as believing you know the reasons and motivations behind another's statements.

 

[Pearljam5000]

If I were doing it for the sake of sounding progressive and modern, you are right. That would be ridiculous. Almost as ridiculous as believing you know the reasons and motivations behind another's statements.

I'm talking in general about the politically correct climate we live in, not a specific person

 

[MattHooper]

Serious question.

Thread as in a thread on an internet Forum with a typical internet forum structure like this one? Or a "thread" on a social media platform - like Facebook, or a thread on something like Reddit?

Any of 'em, I guess. Seems to me familiar dynamics will apply, such as I suggested - talk about the differences between sexes will bring out some level of sexist talk from both sides...some as jokes, some as clumsy attempts to "explain" the other sex, etc. But getting at someone's real view can often take actual conversation, rather than drawing inferences from a remark or two.

Also, another motivations underlying what I wrote: I have come to be ever more cautious about other people's assessment of other people.

This includes the broader culture war conversations, where I have found some descriptive, derogatory category terms to have become so weaponized and casually thrown around, I've become dubious as to their use.

But also, as a general observation of human behaviour, we tend to be pretty poor at accurately representing the views of other people, ESPECIALLY if we don't agree with them, and ESPECIALLY if we have inferred something negative. So for instance, if I listened to many of the characterizations of ASR that I can find in "subjectivist" forums, then I'd have accepted this place is a bunch of people who "never listen" and "only look at measurements" and "don't care about the music" etc. But since I actually know this place, I know those characterizations are off the mark. Likewise, I've seen what I find to be the occasional mischaracterization of other forums, or reviewers, audio companies, etc, on this forum. Which is us being human.

With that in mind, insofar as, say, tmtom would suggest that the Steve Hoffman forum has significant levels of sexist posts, my approach is some level of skepticism.
Not assuming tmtom is wrong, but rather...I'd like to see it for myself to see if I agree with the characterization of those posts/threads. Having been a member for quite a while there, I don't see it, at least not so much I'd think it would be a major reason female audiophiles aren't showing up there. As I said, I may have missed such comments, though.

Music is tracked in real-time by gender. Who is listening to it/buying it, by gender, age, ethnicity, and a multitude of other things etc.? It's what Nielson/Soundscan and others do. Buying and listening habits on music.

Most performers/bands in the top twenty of the Hot 100 do not have cross-over appeal. In other words, the top ten for men will rarely contain a single top ten for women. The one recent exception to this has been Burno Mars.

Ok. It wouldn't be a surprise that certain artists have a large female base, others a largely male base. That seems quite observable. In fact, I live around the corner from a large music hall where indie and popular band perform almost every week or so. So I'm often walking past a line up of concert-goers. And it's always fascinating how uniform the crowds are, whether it's the style of clothes, or just the uniformity of often being either an almost entirely male, or entirely female (or gay, or goth, or whatever), audience for a given band.

Though I wasn't aware that the divide is so stark as you say the data suggests, in terms of the broader lack of overlap for popular artists.

 

[Emlin]

I'm talking in general about the politically correct climate we live in, not a specific person

It has become clear that you have a political axe to grind rather than being open to discussion on this subject. Please put a sock in it.

 

[MattHooper]

It's not about what you think of the humor, Matt, or about you giving people of the benefit of the doubt - and conversely it's not about your suspicion that I'm lumping offhanded humor and "pushed and non-pushed" views into a lump category. I'm talking about how some women might be likely to perceive such online behavior, regardless of how you or I as men my perceive or experience it.

Sure, I get that.

Though, this still would depend on the accuracy of your characterization of such conversations. You might be right, you might be wrong, or exaggerating. I take your claim as a "heads up" to look out for it, but I wouldn't know if I'd agree you have accurately characterized the comments, including the prevalence, without seeing it myself.

I'm also somewhat reticent to try to decide what women, be it some or a lot, would find too offensive or off-putting, such that it would drive them away. How sensitive are we to assume women are on these matters? I'm just not sure sensitivity to this would be a significant factor in females not being audiophiles. (Since that is the underlying theme of this thread, and there is no evidence I know of females who want to be audiophiles but are put off by male dominated forums, and are congregating somewhere else).

It's also worth noting that while of course men and women can (and do ) both say and write sexist things and act in sexist ways, there is a fundamental asymmetry in any situation like that, in which one group has historically (and presently) enjoyed more social power than the other. Both genders can be sexist, but it's not exactly the same thing.

Well...the sexism is the same thing. (I don't view sexism, nor other "isms" as an expression of power dynamics in of themselves, which I know goes against some current progressive claims on the subjects). But...the power dynamic will be a different thing, I agree! But I'm also of the mind "two wrongs don't make a right" in either case.

 

[Pearljam5000]

It has become clear that you have a political axe to grind rather than being open to discussion on this subject. Please put a sock in it.

"Put a sock in it"
Well That's a clear sign of being open to discussion and opinions that contradict yours lol

 

[Emlin]

"Put a sock in it"
Well That's a clear sign of being open to discussion and opinions that contradict yours lol

I've been open and interested in the discussion. You have only been interested in grinding your axe. Therein lies the difference.

 

[Pearljam5000]

I've been open and interested in the discussion. You have only been interested in grinding your axe. Therein lies the difference.

What you are saying("grinding your axe ")is an opinion not a fact
We all got different opinions
That's the whole point

 

[Emlin]

What you are saying("grinding your axe ")is an opinion not a fact
We all got different opinions
That's the whole point

Ignore button deployed.

 

[pseudoid]

Aggressive, bullying men may simply be suffering from a case of testosterone poisoning.

You are forcing me to get aggressive and in a bullying mood.

Especially, if it is between a clan called Male against a clan called Female.
What have you done for me lately?
Is it possible to be MORE protective and empathic of one's own clan's needs over those of others'?
To the age-old accusation that "Men don't listen to women!": I say Hallelujah!
Could it be that they reflexively refuse to listen to our audio systems because of that accusation????

If it is between Nature and/or Nurture.
I've had zero control over the former but I - at least - control the 'volume knob' on the later!

 

[VintageFlanker]

I'm against masking the truth just for being politically correct .

Great. Yet, at this very moment, your statements are both political and incorrect.

 

[pseudoid]

That's the whole point

You forgot to put a point at the end of your sentence.
Your sentence should deserve the ignore button, at a minimum!

 

[Pearljam5000]

Ignore button deployed.

Bye

 

[tmtomh]

"Put a sock in it"
Well That's a clear sign of being open to discussion and opinions that contradict yours lol

The problem is that you’re a one-person debate because you’ve taken several mutually incompatible positions in this discussion and are unwilling or unable to acknowledge that, let alone say what your actual view is.

 

[pseudoid]

you’re a one-person debate because...

Hardly!
I mostly embrace what @Pearljam5000 has got to say.
Does that make it "two" one-person debates?
Should we add that ["closed minded]" @antcollinet to the group, to round it out as a "three" one-person debate?
pfffft, I don't think either member plays tag-team sports, that you are trying to turn this into!

 

[Emlin]

Hardly!
I mostly embrace what @Pearljam5000 has got to say.
Does that make it "two" one-person debates?
Should we add that ["closed minded]" @antcollinet to the group, to round it out as a "three" one-person debate?
pfffft, I don't think either member plays tag-team sports, that you are trying to turn this into!

When you are ready to make rational statements, please let us know.

In the meantime...

 

[pseudoid]

Lashing insults seem fully to define you.
You don't want me to say how I define your behavior to keep on the PoliticallyCorrect side.
You are allowed more than one use of Ignore button.