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what do people think about the "Klipsch sound" ?

fordiebianco

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I owned a pair of KG4.5s for a few years that I upgraded with a new set of Bob Crites' crossovers and tweeters. I sold them and replaced them with a pair of Q-Acoustics Concept 40. Depending on the source (TV or Stereo) they were run by a beefy Denon AVR or a chunky Marantz power amp with a tube preamp. Both sources sounded great.

I actually miss the KG4.5s, and my wife thinks these were the best sounding pair we ever owned (apart from our KEF 105s). This is of course purely subjective, but particularly live music sounded amazing on them. And Fleetwood Mac.

Figures.
 

garyrc

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A good idea but I have to wonder why you just didn't start with a La Scala instead?
Yeah, I'd wonder, too. Because in those days (2004) they didn't make a La Scala with a removable top hat (except for a pro one we didn't know about, and was sold by pro dealers only) and we thought we might have to separate the woofer from the top hat. Also the La Scala I had a rep for resonating sides, that the Belle didn't have (the La Scala II, and later models used 1" (I think) wood on the great depth of the sides, that were firm). Finally, the Belle seemed a little sweeter than the La Scalas we could audition, (unfortunately, never in the same store-- so we crossed our fingers), One of the dealers said, "they toned it down a little." Without Audyssey, the frequencies above about 350Hz or so are a little lower in SPL than those below. With Audyssey Flat the Belle is a bit flatter, but it still looks a little like the Harman curve.
 

Sal1950

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Yeah, I'd wonder, too. Because in those days (2004) they didn't make a La Scala with a removable top hat
I get it, either would have required heavy mods to get where you wanted to go.
Mod's can be fun, I made a number to my La Scala's over the 32 years I owned them.
 

Angsty

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I've been intrigued by the La Scala recently, particularly given the highly favorable reviews of the AL5 version. What are the psycho-acoustics behind why horn speakers, like the La Scala, sound more like "live music" than direct cone radiators? Is it simply just because we are conditioned to associate live music with horn colorations because most PA equipment uses horns?

I noted how this YouTube video of recorded music sounded more "live" to me than most other loudspeaker videos that I've heard, yet clearly my headphones do not have horn radiators. (Disclaimer: I don't really believe YouTube videos accurately represent how a speaker "sounds", but I can say this one "sounds" different than some others). On another point, I listen to "live" voices everyday using Zoom, but they don't strike me as particularly "live" sounding, which seems weird when I think about it.

What are the physics that make music sound more "live" anyway?

 
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MakeMineVinyl

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Klipsch has a very forward sound which can work for some music and movies, but to my ears they have the worst characteristics of the traditional "horn sound". It takes a good deal of effort to make horns sound good with classical music, especially recordings with overly aggressive string tone from too-close microphones. Most other forms of music are more forgiving of most horns.
 

Sal1950

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What are the physics that make music sound more "live" anyway?
Folks been arguing that since day 1 of Hi Fi.
You either love or hate them, I owned mine for 32 years so I quess you know how I feel.
If you like to play your music loud and have a lot of impact, there are few that can hang with La Scala's.
Take advantage of a in-person listening session before you buy.
New they are very expensive today and have some great competition.
 

Spkrdctr

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I had I believe the KG series towers back in the 1990's. They sounded fantastic. I had them in a big room. They were in a 5.1 surround system and they played so loudly and nicely that I was getting complaints from people walking by the house out on the street. Those speakers were amazing. I don't do anything of volume anymore as I live in an apartment. I do miss those days but my ears appreciate not being damaged. They were the most amazing sounding speakers for music and theater. All around great product. The RF7's were also amazing sounding. But they would play to volume levels that were more like pro sound volumes. I have heard many very expensive large speakers that just don't sound good at all, yet were very expensive. Picking the right speaker from Klipsch will get you decent to fantastic sound. But, sadly I do not say this about any of the older Heritage speaker lines. They were all pretty poor to my ears. Many of the old timers listened to the now called Heritage lines and determined they were crap, yes they were! But some of the newer stuff can sound very good. I wish I had the money to send Amir about 6 of their less expensive speakers to test. Oh well, maybe when I win the Florida Lotto!
 

Sal1950

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At todays price of $13,200 I wouldn't miss out on the chance to get a pair of JBL 4367's
Or something else from the Synthesis Line
They have a bit more sophisticated, balanced sound.
 

garyrc

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My suggestion is to read the whole thread linked below. There is controversy here, but I must say I have been very pleased by Klipschorns in many rooms (8) and driven into ecstasy by them in 3. With the right room, room treatment and program material, they sound a lot like the orchestras I used to both play in, and listen to from audience position. The La Scala is very, very similar above about 60 Hz (it's twin, the Belle Klipsch, actually has a little peak at 60 Hz in my room). Below those frequencies, the Belle and the La Scala need a subwoofer, IMO, but some get away without one. To preserve the ultra clean bass of the La Scala, a horn subwoofer might be best, or, perhaps a horn sub down to about 30 Hz, and the best, deepest reaching, direct radiator sub below that, if you are going to play movies, or listen to pipe organ.

The link is (initially) stuck on page 2. Please go back to page 1 to start.

 
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Teeter

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I had been a JBL person for a number of years and now have Klipsch. As you know, Klipsch has been noted for their horns. I have always had bookshelf speakers and I really prefer the Klipsch sound, that I have now, as bookshelves. The sound for ME, is more distinct, clear, and dynamic, with my current combination. The open basement HT room set-up is 10X12. Wife prefers the living room with a sound bar.
 
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Sal1950

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The open basement HT room set-up is 10X12. Wife prefers the living room with a sound bar.
Great, you got your space and she's got hers.
Thats the way it should be. ;)
 

steve59

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Depends on the model. I found the Lascala's mid bass boost to be distracting, fat and muddy in the room I listened. the klipschhorns make live recordings sound exciting and avoid the poor midbass of the lascala's while being able to play deep bass. In the long term klipsch speakers wear me out, but fun factor I can see why they're so popular.
 

Spkrdctr

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Great, you got your space and she's got hers.
Thats the way it should be. ;)
Sal, I'm going to end up with the Klipsch 1200 sound bar and sub. I feel it in my bones. A one bedroom apartment does not have the space for my current surround setup. Plus with restrictions on volume etc. from being in an apartment. It seems like a waste of money to me. I can repurpose my Martin Logans/Crown Amp/Equalizer and Yamaha AVR to someone who can enjoy it. Oh and I forgot my ultra high end almost Revels, Pyle 4 Inch surrounds. :)
 

garyrc

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I found the Lascala's mid bass boost to be distracting, fat and muddy in the room I listened. the klipschhorns make live recordings sound exciting and avoid the poor midbass of the lascala's while being able to play deep bass. In the long term klipsch speakers wear me out, but fun factor I can see why they're so popular.

I agree about the fun factor.

It's hard for me to imagine the La Scalas having poor midbass or muddy anything. True, they lack deep bass, thus the superiority of the Klipschorns. As you say, "in the room I listened." The question springs to mind is what kind of room was it? How live or dead was the room? How would you describe the position in the room of the La Scalas, about how far from the rear and side walls?

N.B. Starting with the La Scala II, the the side walls of the speaker enclosure were thicker. People reported better bass.

I can listen to my Klipschorns for 12 hour stretches, or more, and not be "worn out," and experience no listening fatigue.

Paul Klipsch ranked the importance of speaker qualities in approximately the following order:

Most Important

Low distortion
, especially low modulation distortion. [See ] Horn Loaded speakers tend to have very low modulation distortion, compared to direct radiators. Back when Klipsch published such results, the Klipschorn was shown to have approximately 1/3 as much modulation distortion as the Klipsch Cornwall of that time, with direct radiating bass, even though the Cornwall was operating at a 10 dB lower SPL. Typically two pure tones are put into the speaker at once, and the spurious intermodulation products ("side bands") are looked at. Of course, many more than two tones are present in music at a given moment.
1640510337985.png

1640510168392.png



Sensitivity, which is positively correlated with low modulation distortion (i.e. negatively correlated with modulation distortion) perhaps because of lower excursion per dB or watt. Also related to potential dynamics. Klipsch said we need instantaneous peaks (around 1/3 of a second, or less) of 115 dB "at your ears" to simulate "the blood stirring levels" of a symphony orchestra. Later studies by THX indicated that for typical living room or Home Theater size, 5 to 7 dB lower peaks will do, because of those early reflections (even when normally controlled). Typical levels of loud passages (not instantaneous peaks) are more like 80 dB to 100 dB at home.

Controlled directivity to minimize early reflections off of side walls. Area rugs and absorption or diffusion at some reflection points on walls and ceiling are still recommended-- or not -- controversial.
1640511274885.png


Frequency response, probably the least important, providing the range is > 40 Hz to 15K Hz, without deviations that are too great. Response is probably not as flat in a horn speaker as in an excellent direct radiator, BUT, the combination of room treatments, Audyssey Flat, and tweaking to taste with my Khorns gives me response of +/- 2 dB 800 to 16.5KHz, and gradually rising response below that, a la the lower part of the Harman curve, from +1.5 dB at 800Hz to ~~+ 8 dB at 40 Hz, then slowly declining to - 7.65dB at 16 dB with a subwoofer.

Least Important
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _


I try to play only good recordings. Almost all Blu-rays are fine, some wonderful. So are SACDs, even remasters of old recordings. My guess as to why is that the remixers and remasterers are more careful because they know the SACD version will go to at least some audiophiles. Same for DVD-As. CDs seem to be a little worse; I have given a few to Goodwill. That's as low as I go. Here is how Meridian thinks formats stack up:
1640514640984.png
 

tuga

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I think that no one can judge them for you.
You have to give them a listen, because even though objectively they have issues (exaggerated treble) you may actually enjoy their “presentation”.
He who tells otherwise is fooling himself and misleading you in the process.
 

garyrc

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Here is the early La Scala (I) vs. The Altec A7 (Best of four midrange/treble drivers)

post-22082-13819802431398.jpg
More recent La Scalas, starting with the II, have a little smoother bass, partly due to eliminating some cabinet resonances. Can be made much smoother with Dirac or Audyssey.
 
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mhardy6647

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The Cornwalls that once lived here are long gone.
Listen to loudspeakers using classic Altec & JBL drivers almost every day here for nearly 20 years.
One may draw one's own conclusion(s). ;)
 

steve59

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no offense intended.
 

Teeter

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I had been a JBL person for a number of years and now have Klipsch. As you know, Klipsch has been noted for their horns. I have always had bookshelf speakers and I really prefer the Klipsch sound, that I have now, as bookshelves. The sound for ME, is more distinct, clear, and dynamic, with my current combination. The open basement HT room set-up is 10X12. Wife prefers the living room with a sound bar.
I should have mentioned, I watch mostly DD movies and with an AVR with auto speaker calibration, balance in all speakers are exceptional, to my ears. Early this year, I decided to change out the center channel, R-52C, with psb Imagine XC, with better frequency response, to match the other Klipsch. Why didn't I want a Klipsch center with close to matching frequency response to the others? I guess I wanted something different. :rolleyes:
 
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