UpTone Audio EtherREGEN Switch Review

[amirm]

Do you happen to have really poor device (Schiit?) that might give worse results with this thing in place? That would be amusing.

Amusing it is. [click for larger image]

Ethernet noise is so isolated that despite the Modi 2 picking up every source of noise there is, the output is the same with and without Ether Regen (ER). If fixes nothing.

 

[RayDunzl]

Here is what I want to know: If UpTone sells so much product why are they charging customer cards 6 to 8 weeks before they ship product? Are they that cash strapped that they have to do advanced funding? They really don't have the ability to bank roll component inventory?

The factory seems to be an addition to the man's house.

Gotta pay the bills somehow.

https://uptoneaudio.com/blogs/news/we-are-moving-just-not-very-far

 

[dincus]

The technical stories and theories though make enough sense to audiophiles to believe and hence "hear" improvements.

Wait, sorry, I guess this is the answer. So the technical stories and theories make them imagine they are hearing things? I really am curious about this process.

 

[amirm]

Wait, sorry, I guess this is the answer. So the technical stories and theories make them imagine they are hearing things? I really am curious about this process.

When you make a change to your system, if you think there is going to be a difference, you will hear it. Your brain hyper focuses on the music and now digs deep to hear note decays, silent background, etc. All of a sudden a "veil" is removed. Detail becomes luscious and more "analog like." More lifelike.

Now being assured that the change made a sonic difference, you go back to the old setting assuming it is going to sound worse. And worse it will sound.

This has happened to me countless times. I too can swear there is an improvement and a big one. Then I realize that what I thought could not have been there as often, I realize I had not made any changes!

Play a piece of music once. Then go back and play it again without changing anything. But now focus on it to hear more detail. And more detail you will hear. You will hear it even though I just explained, and you know there can't be a change. Yet there will be.

The common retort is that people hear these differences when they are enjoying gear, not testing it. Problem is, they make the initial assessment when comparing gear, not enjoying music in a laid back position.

With the effect not being real, it will wear off. Then comes the next tweak/"upgrade" that triggers the cycle over again. Take notice that the people who "hear" such impossible things, have tried and swear by many impossible tweaks. The ethernet cable. The power cable. The stand. The footers. The tweaks to the OS. The special media player. Heck, even what SATA cable is in the computer!

They are living an illusion and simulation and not able to step out of it to see the reality. They could if they just listened to us once. Just once perform the same test blind. Alas, just like the movie matrix, they don't want to know. Knowing means eating crow. And eating crow is not what folks rather do with online reputation.

 

[Jinjuku]

Wait, sorry, I guess this is the answer. So the technical stories and theories make them imagine they are hearing things? I really am curious about this process.

I give you goop

 

[amirm]

Someone asked for multitone tests. Here is one with Schiit Modi 2 connected to my PC but with the test signal streamed from my NAS using Ethernet to the Roon player and then to Schiit Modi 2 USB DAC:

You can squint all you want and there won't be a difference. Modi 2 performance is of course awful with that raised noise floor especially in low frequencies. The EtherRegen did nothing to reduce that noise.

Let's switch back to Matrix i, this time the content streamed to it from Roon:

We are digging deep to whopping -130 dB yet cannot detect any difference between using EtherRegen Port B or without it.

So one of the worst DACs ever tested doesn't show a difference. And one of the best streamer/DACs out there doesn't show the difference.

The matching is incredibly tight with and without EtherRegen. The EtherRegen simply is not able to impact the sound waves coming out of the DAC.

You breath on the circuit and these measurements will show it. They are hugely more sensitive than any ear. Yet they can't detect electrons moving with less noise, jitter or fidelity.

 

[Thomas savage]

I remember back at WBF when I was reading through the entreq thread and looking up the reviews for grounding boxes , so many people exposing the benefits of these devices I could not wait to try it.

Upon trying it and hearing no benefit or indeed difference it was quite hard to buck the social trend and express this online. And there was quite a lot of negative feedback from doing so.

I'm not sure everyone who reports hearing improvements with these kinds of devices that we know do nothing are actually experiencing these improvements. I think it's possible they are just under certain social pressure to conform.

There's a insecurity, a
tactic to undermine people through the spread of disinformation online. You offer a product and a social space that squashes that insecurity. People feel better and they will defend that feeling and those who perpetrate the toxic environment to the end despite themselves.

It is indeed fascinating.

No doubt we'll have some of these deeply entrenched unfortunates come here and defend the company and all and everything it does despite being defrauded out of their own money.

 

[August]

Why take it seriously ... they should always be a joke

 

[AudioTodd]

The CE certification is administered by the manufacturer. There is no third party involved. Its validity is only checked if there's probable cause. Basically a useless certification. Or so I've been told...

At least it is the “real” logo...

 

[amirm]

Looks like we have an answer from Alex on the certification:

As I guessed, they simply copied the markings of the OEM power supply yet put their own name on it. I am not sure that is compliant with FCC regulations as UpTone is not the one that applied for it and they have erased the name of the OEM that did.

The power supply is not the concern anyway. The real concern is whether the switch itself is FCC Certified. It clearly is not as the device itself has no such marking as required by the law. And Alex just waves his hands by saying "the emissions from EtherRegen are as low and lower than most off the shelf switch." Who says? You think you can give that answer to FCC to avoid a fine and shipment stoppage?

Anyone who has ever produced products that have gone through FCC certification knows what a grief this is. Frequently you fail the first test. You make tweaks and hope that it passes a second time. Sometimes that doesn't work either and you have to turn the design one more time.

You must have your device measured by a certified lab to know if it is compliant or not. If you have never run it as is the case with UpTone products, then you could very well be leaking RF like a sieve.

When I was waiting for the prototypes of the Geshelli Labs headphone amplifier, I was told they were going through FCC certification. Here is a two-person company and they went through the trouble of getting FCC certified. And for a device that hardly generates any high frequencies. Here is what Geshelli says on their website:

EtherRegen in sharp contrast has a ton of high-frequency and high power circuits running there. It has long tentacles in the form of Ethernet patch cables and power supply run that can bleed like there is no tomorrow. And we are to take what Alex says seriously? For a $640?

Gosh these guys paint a target on their back with such comments. The day they handed common sense Alex must have been absent. I mean if you don't have FCC/CE certification, why even bring that up and highlight it? Now people can quote that in their complaint to FCC and put him in serious jeopardy that he is knowingly violating the law.

 

[Blumlein 88]

Oh look at this. So quick to dismiss this device. Look a nearly 5 db reduction in noise floor far right pointer, and a lesser one at some lower frequencies. That is right there in the highly critical 34-39hz range. Not masked by 50 hz or 60 hz sub harmonics. Right where quality speakers often work to and ported speakers accentuate. That is the benefit of the Ethergen, at least with a Schitt product.

 

[amirm]

Then there is this:

Funny there that Alex said he would take a blind test with one of his other products at his house, with his music and his setup. But when I said sure, I will fly to his house at my expense to test him, he ran and ran away hard:

That offer still stands Alex.

As I mentioned before, there is no magic to what you think you are hearing. We all do. The difference is that we know to attribute a change to our brain, or the equipment. You don't, mixing one for the other. And profiting from it.

 

[RayDunzl]

So quick to dismiss this device.

 

[MediumRare]

Someone asked for multitone tests.
...
Let's switch back to Matrix i, this time the content streamed to it from Roon:

View attachment 41469

We are digging deep to whopping -130 dB yet cannot detect any difference between using EtherRegen Port B or without it.

At least it's transparent below -120 dB!

 

[dincus]

Wow. You really have a beef with this Alex guy. Don't see why attacking his business is important, but whatever. I'm more curious about all this listening bias stuff. So is the implication that all you can hear is measurements? I guess I mean if I like the sound of a DAC is that because it measures better? So if I were in the market for a DAC (or any component I guess), then I should just buy the one that measures best? This is a serious question. Thanks

 

[March Audio]

Wow. You really have a beef with this Alex guy. Don't see why attacking his business is important, but whatever. I'm more curious about all this listening bias stuff. So is the implication that all you can hear is measurements? I guess I mean if I like the sound of a DAC is that because it measures better? So if I were in the market for a DAC (or any component I guess), then I should just buy the one that measures best? This is a serious question. Thanks

I certainly do. I dont like it when people are conned. I also think this sort of snake oil is bad for the audio industry.

Unfortunately the area of hifi does seem to be one where people are quite susceptible to the marketing BS. Definitely has more than its fair share of magic crystal purveyors as a result.

 

[Mnyb]

Isn't the SFP on the "dirty" side? And who has a DAC with SFP input?

I think some has gone for optical insulation of thier home network especially for the branch going to the audio gear.
Yes the sfp is on the “dirty side” but they claim not having a long cable back to some other network switch/router is a benefit , hope they don’t use to cheap no name sfp units compatibility can be a problem

 

[amirm]

I'm more curious about all this listening bias stuff. So is the implication that all you can hear is measurements?

Not at all. The implication is that if you want to say something sounds different than another, you better only use your ears. The moment you see the devices, the fixture, etc., your other senses interfere and your brain arrives at faulty conclusion. This is the reason no one in professional audio research accepts sighted listening tests like audiophiles do. Is this new to you? Seems to be....

 

[amirm]

I think some has gone for optical insulation of thier home network especially for the branch going to the audio gear.
Yes the sfp is on the “dirty side” but they claim not having a long cable back to some other network switch/router is a benefit , hope they don’t use to cheap no name sfp units compatibility can be a problem

So they are saying after spending $640 on this box, you still need to run an optical path to it for "better sound?" On what basis and does Alex agree?

 

[amirm]

Wow. You really have a beef with this Alex guy.

Don't project your emotions on me. I don't care about Alex or anyone else. I judge every piece of gear on its merit. And here, audiophiles are sold that "EMI" is bad. So I am commenting that this device has not been measured to a) pass regulatory certification meant to limit such emitted/conducted noise and b) could very well be worse than the switch existing audiophile is using. You get this, right? It is not hard.