Upgrade to new AVR?

[jdg78]

Thanks for your reply.
Would you have replaced the Arcam if you didn't have issues?
I don't have (and had) any issues with my avr850 (maybe I am lucky), so I was only curious if there was anything to win (within reasonable pricing) if I upgrade.
I am very happy with my avr850.

No, if I wasn’t having so many issues I would have happily continued on with the Arcam for as long as it stayed in good working condition, and if you’re happy with your current unit and it’s performing well, I don’t see any reason to change.

However if it ever does come to a point where you need to get a new unit, or just want something with more current technology, I would encourage you (or anyone else) to also look at some of the offerings from more mainstream brands like Denon, etc. as you might be surprised at how well they perform at a fraction of the cost.

I haven’t heard any of the newer Arcam AVR models, so can’t speak to them specifically, but given how good the Denon sounds, my AVR600 seems ludicrously overpriced in retrospect, and I don’t think I could ever justify dropping $6,000 for an AV receiver again.

 

[_Wilco_]

No, if I wasn’t having so many issues I would have happily continued on with the Arcam for as long as it stayed in good working condition, and if you’re happy with your current unit and it’s performing well, I don’t see any reason to change.

However if it ever does come to a point where you need to get a new unit, or just want something with more current technology, I would encourage you (or anyone else) to also look at some of the offerings from more mainstream brands like Denon, etc. as you might be surprised at how well they perform at a fraction of the cost.

I haven’t heard any of the newer Arcam AVR models, so can’t speak to them specifically, but given how good the Denon sounds, my AVR600 seems ludicrously overpriced in retrospect, and I don’t think I could ever justify dropping $6,000 for an AV receiver again.

Thanks, I will keep in mind.

Just a thought: Can sound still hearable be improved, or are the limits already reached and is it just personal taste that make systems sound better

 

[Hattrick]

Did you eventually upgrade or stayed with the avr850?
I wonder if going from the avr850 to the avr30 (avr31) would be an improvement in sound (I don't need all the new whistles)?

Hi Wilco,
So far so good with the AVR 850 I have been using a cooling fan system on the top ever since I got it back and so far so good. Interesting though, I always have been gazing down the "upgrade DAC" rabbit hole. So I ended up trying a new Bluesound Node X with its new DAC improvement with ESS. The salesperson said it would sound far better than my Arcam DAC for digital playback being CD, Roon, or streaming services. I just got the return label to ship it back. After good testing of the mentioned media the Arcam still came a head with sound quality. I recently also purchased a WiiM Pro Streamer. The best $149.00 I have spent on my system to date. I think I will keep the Arcam for a couple more years if it doesn't fail me being it does everything I need it to do with out a bunch of features I won't use. If I were to decide to upgrade I will wait for the next rendition of Arcam products and compare to Yamaha, and Sony being they seem have come on strong recently.

 

[_Wilco_]

Hi Wilco,
So far so good with the AVR 850 I have been using a cooling fan system on the top ever since I got it back and so far so good. Interesting though, I always have been gazing down the "upgrade DAC" rabbit hole. So I ended up trying a new Bluesound Node X with its new DAC improvement with ESS. The salesperson said it would sound far better than my Arcam DAC for digital playback being CD, Roon, or streaming services. I just got the return label to ship it back. After good testing of the mentioned media the Arcam still came a head with sound quality. I recently also purchased a WiiM Pro Streamer. The best $149.00 I have spent on my system to date. I think I will keep the Arcam for a couple more years if it doesn't fail me being it does everything I need it to do with out a bunch of features I won't use. If I were to decide to upgrade I will wait for the next rendition of Arcam products and compare to Yamaha, and Sony being they seem have come on strong recently.

Thanks for the response.
I think I stick with the avr850 for while, I really like it's sound.
For streaming, I have connected a Chromecast Audio, via s/pdif to the avr850, which is the default playing device of my Nest Hub Max.

 

[Hattrick]

Thanks for the response.
I think I stick with the avr850 for while, I really like it's sound.
For streaming, I have connected a Chromecast Audio, via s/pdif to the avr850, which is the default playing device of my Nest Hub Max.

Update: So far over a year now with the fixed AVR850 and it is working as it should. I did add a WiiM streamer to it via SPDIF to the Arcam and boy what a huge difference in sound quality streaming Amazon Music HD versus Roku or Fire TV. No comparison the WiiM Pro kicks ass.

Note: I did try the new Bluesound Node X and sent it back. It really didn't provide any sonic improvement streaming compared to the WiiM Pro. The Node X is a great unit with tons of features but I didn't need them.

My next venture is some DAC testing for my digital 2 channel stereo listening. The AVR 850 sounds great but I can't get my head out of the "DAC Rabbit Hole" Looking to purchase from Amazon the S.M.S.L SU-10 MQA Decoder Dual ES9038PRO Support MQA-CD High-Performance Audio DAC 32Bit/768kHz DSD512 Hi-Res Audio Support LDAC,Aptx/HD,SBC,AAC. The reviews are fantastic and per Amirm it is number one on his SINAD list! Their is a good return policy should I find it doesn't provide a significant sonic upgrade to the Cirrus DAC circuit in the AVR850.

 

[Hattrick]

New Update Selling the AVR 850 and going with a AVR31. Considered Sony ES, and Anthem but love the sound of the Arcam. Never compared the Anthem or the Sony ES which maybe I should prior to purchase.

 

[morpheusX]

Why don't you wait until there is confirmation that the new Arcam's are going to have ART available (and that ARCAM's implementation doesn't have bugs)?

 

[Hattrick]

Why don't you wait until there is confirmation that the new Arcam's are going to have ART available (and that ARCAM's implementation doesn't have bugs)?

Well the AVR31 has been out now for almost two years and most of the bugs were related to the AVR30 early release. According to my Dealer/Installer he says the bugs are long fixed. He also said there is a new model forth coming next year but mostly cosmetic updates not internal. I do not know what ART is? Please explain or attach link.

 

[morpheusX]

Well the AVR31 has been out now for almost two years and most of the bugs were related to the AVR30 early release. According to my Dealer/Installer he says the bugs are long fixed. He also said there is a new model forth coming next year but mostly cosmetic updates not internal. I do not know what ART is? Please explain or attach link.

Dirac Live Active Room Treatment (ART) - Dirac

Active Room Treatment calibrates your speakers as a unified system and uses each speaker’s strengths for unmatched clarity.

www.dirac.com

 

[Hattrick]

Arcam AVRs come with Dirac with options of multiple bass management. I am sure one can pay Dirac for ART if it is a option.

 

[morpheusX]

Arcam AVRs come with Dirac with options of multiple bass management. I am sure one can pay Dirac for ART if it is a option.

Probably, but i would wait for the second generation of AVR's with ART, after looking at measurements to check if its worth it!

That's what i'm doing: i was going to swap my NAD T758V3 for a Denon X3800H (i want the 4 subwoofer outs), but i'll wait until 2024/2025 for the 3900H.
AVR's should sound the same, so i just look for the functionalities, and besides 4 subwoofers out, the one i'm most expecting is ART!

 

[Hattrick]

If I had a dedicated HT room I would opt for a Processor vs an AVR and of course get the Dirac ART. Being this upgrade is for my Great Room, I am mostly looking for feature upgrades. Such as, HDMI 2.1, 4k/8k scaling at 120Hz, Duel ESS DACS, multiple subwoofer management, 3 settings of Dirac live to program versus one, the addition of Auro-3D, DTS-X, and IMAX. In addition larger choices of streaming capability. These are a lot of great upgrade over the 850. Combined all that with very low distortion 100W Class G amplification on all 7 channels is awesome! This is a pretty good upgrade. over the AVR 850. I bet ART can be upgraded later but probably not that big of a deal for a Great Room vs a dedicated treated HT room.

 

[Hattrick]

I have now started noticing that my AVR850 is acting up a bit with my L&R surrounds. I hear drop outs and a bit of crackling now and then from each speaker. Not at the exact same time sometime the left then the right. Or sometime both are not working then they are. Very prevalent with streaming either Fire TV via HDMI or SPDIF from my WiiM Pro streamer. Does anyone have any idea what would cause that? I looked at all the speaker connections and they seem to be connected fine with good termination.

I am now thinking maybe move away from Arcam. There are many others who have complained about Arcam's bugs or hardware issues as current as of this month. There is a reviewer who is testing the AVP 41 and having all kinds of issues. I think Amir did test the 41 and it wasn't up to snuff with his measurements. Not sure if that is applicable for a AVR31 but never the less I am getting a bit frustrated with issues.

I just ordered a new Sony ES5000 which should be here tomorrow and will comparing that to the AVR850 even with the intermittent drop outs in the surround channels being L&R. I have read in comments via reviewer channels on YouTube that there are issues with that as well. Maybe should have stayed with stereo vs going through all this crap.

 

[jdg78]

I have now started noticing that my AVR850 is acting up a bit with my L&R surrounds. I hear drop outs and a bit of crackling now and then from each speaker. Not at the exact same time sometime the left then the right. Or sometime both are not working then they are. Very prevalent with streaming either Fire TV via HDMI or SPDIF from my WiiM Pro streamer. Does anyone have any idea what would cause that? I looked at all the speaker connections and they seem to be connected fine with good termination.

I am now thinking maybe move away from Arcam. There are many others who have complained about Arcam's bugs or hardware issues as current as of this month. There is a reviewer who is testing the AVP 41 and having all kinds of issues. I think Amir did test the 41 and it wasn't up to snuff with his measurements. Not sure if that is applicable for a AVR31 but never the less I am getting a bit frustrated with issues.

I just ordered a new Sony ES5000 which should be here tomorrow and will comparing that to the AVR850 even with the intermittent drop outs in the surround channels being L&R. I have read in comments via reviewer channels on YouTube that there are issues with that as well. Maybe should have stayed with stereo vs going through all this crap.

I had the same problem with my AVR600. Started getting drop outs and noise from the surround channels to the point where I had to disconnect and run them off of external amps. Eventually the main channels also started suffered from horrible noise issues and had to be run off of external amps, and then finally the entire thing crapped out. I was able to get in touch with the guy who used to be the main licensed repair person for Arcam products in North America (Tim Schwartz), and he told me that these AVRs are essentially unrepairable and he won't touch them anymore after experiencing so many issues in the past.

I don't know if the reliability of Arcam products has improved recently, but personally I wouldn't take the risk. I've owned many Arcam products over the years, and not a single one of them didn't eventually experience major failures, often within a decade. I know electronics aren't designed to last forever, but given the premium cost of these products, the reliability is dismal.

Anyway, good luck with the Sony - I hope it works out for you. FWIW, I've had good experiences with Denon AVRs as well.

 

[onion]

I have the AVR850 relegated to the TV room, with a Denon 3800 powering the movie room. I prefer the sound and features of the Denon even if its DAC does not perform so well in testing.

 

[Hattrick]

I had the same problem with my AVR600. Started getting drop outs and noise from the surround channels to the point where I had to disconnect and run them off of external amps. Eventually the main channels also started suffered from horrible noise issues and had to be run off of external amps, and then finally the entire thing crapped out. I was able to get in touch with the guy who used to be the main licensed repair person for Arcam products in North America (Tim Schwartz), and he told me that these AVRs are essentially unrepairable and he won't touch them anymore after experiencing so many issues in the past.

I don't know if the reliability of Arcam products has improved recently, but personally I wouldn't take the risk. I've owned many Arcam products over the years, and not a single one of them didn't eventually experience major failures, often within a decade. I know electronics aren't designed to last forever, but given the premium cost of these products, the reliability is dismal.

Anyway, good luck with the Sony - I hope it works out for you. FWIW, I've had good experiences with Denon AVRs as well.

Thank you for chiming in! The AVR850 is the 3rd Arcam I have owned the first one was the best per reliability. It completely died but was already over 12 years old. Sold it broke for $30. I then got a the AVR600. What a piece of junk. Broke from the get go mainly overheating issues. Had it repaired 4 times to the point that Arcam took it back and sent me the AVR850. As mentioned repaired 3 times over the past 4 years. Now I am thinking it is starting to die as you mentioned. I hope the Sony works out otherwise I will be trying Anthem if I have to return the Sony.

 

[Beershaun]

My Denon x3100w has been rock solid with daily use now since 2015.

 

[CrusaderBG]

@Hattrick please advice how is the sound from the sony VS the Arcam.
I am plannig to buy the AVR31 for some time and I was about to do it tomorrow... then I saw what you guys wrote in the past month.
And now I do not think it is a good idea.
I only consider it, coz I want the best Stereo out from an AVR.
Till now the Arcam looked like the best choise.

 

[Daka]

I had AvR20 and now have AV40 with hdmi 2.1.
What can I say is you can land a unit which might have issues but there are units which work well. With AvR20 had some issues which were annoying but not the case with AV40, so far it’s been solid. Sound is exceptional- so much so I don’t have a need for separate integrated amp for music. I did try some and compared. I think all AVRs have quirks, especially boutique manufacturers. You can go with Marantz/Denon which over a time will have major issues addressed but their sound for stereo music is average at best (that is if you go for top of the line).

 

[CrusaderBG]

What do u use after the AV40?